Welcoming gays into the church.

[micatala]

I found this article in a Minnesota newspaper.

http://www.twincities.com/newsletter-mo ... i_10525210

The article notes that many more churches are seeking 'certification' that they are a welcoming environment for gays (GLBT). This designation is not meant to signify a pre-dominantly gay church, just one that is welcoming to gays. The article also notes that there is some resistance to this trend.

Questions for debate:

Are these certifications supportable from a Biblical standpoint?


The article also alludes to churches making statements regarding their openness to ethnic diversity, those with disabilities etc. Conventional wisdom still says that Sunday morning is the most segregated hour of the week, with many people still attending racially homogeneous churches, and many churches identifying themselves as Black, Hispanic, or even Ukrainian, Croatian, etc.

From a Biblical standpoint, are 'racially identified' churches supportable?

Which would be more Christian, welcoming gays into existing churches, or asking gays to form their own 'predominantly gay' or 'gay only' churches?

Do these certifications have the capacity to eventually change Christian attitudes about gays?

[ChristianGuy]

I know this has been dead for a few days, but I must throw in my 2 cents. I believe that the Bible is very clear when it says that all sins are equal. I believe that if you lie, it is just as bad to God as having sex with the same gender. The problem with homosexuality is not that it is a more deadly sin, but it is a lifestyle of sin. It would be know different if I killed one person a day, and then came to the church and asked to be accepted because it is just my lifestyle and I still love Jesus. I am not comparing homosexuals to murderers though. It would be the same if you condoned lying and living in lies.

[McCulloch]

I know this has been dead for a few days, but I must throw in my 2 cents. I believe that the Bible is very clear when it says that all sins are equal. I believe that if you lie, it is just as bad to God as having sex with the same gender. The problem with homosexuality is not that it is a more deadly sin, but it is a lifestyle of sin. It would be know different if I killed one person a day, and then came to the church and asked to be accepted because it is just my lifestyle and I still love Jesus. I am not comparing homosexuals to murderers though. It would be the same if you condoned lying and living in lies.

Interesting thought. Do you know anybody who behaves as if they really believe that blasphemy is equal to genocide? Or that stealing office supplies is equal to rape?

[ChristianGuy]

Not by man's eyes. It most certainly is not. That is why we have punishments in the law and Jesus told us to follow the law of the land, but when you do anything agaist God's will you have not so much murdered or lied as you have Sinned.


James 2:For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it. For he who said, “Do not commit adultery,� also said, “Do not murder.�If you do not commit adultery but do commit murder, you have become a lawbreaker

Now, am I minimizing it by calling it sin? No. God doesn't just say, "oh well, its just sin" if you will read on Sodom and Gamora, you will see just how accepting he is of it. However, please do not think that Sodom was destroyed only for homosexuality; it was destroyed because of its sin and lack of repentance

Genesis 18:20 Then the LORD said, "The outcry against Sodom and Gomorrah is so great and their sin so grievous 21 that I will go down and see if what they have done is as bad as the outcry that has reached me. If not, I will know."

"their sin so grievous" This is a quote that some of you will say points out that their sin was worse so God wanted to destroy them. I don't think so. I believe that this means that their sin was so abundant and had not been repented for.
Lets look at this from a logical standpoint.

If I have 100 apples in one basket and 25 in another, which basket has more apples in it?

The one with 100 apples in it. It is not because of the nature of the apples that their are more of them. It is because there are just more apples in that basket.

I believe the same goes for Sodom and Gomorrah.

So anyway, back to the original topic. Do I think that there are degrees of sin in God's eyes? No.
Is stealing office supplies equal to rape in my eyes? No
In Gods eyes? Sin is sin, but does that really mean that rape is equal to stealing office supplies, or does it mean that stealing office supplies is equal to rape. It is a two sided card.

I for one, do not believe that God looks at one sin any differently than he does another.

[JoeyKnothead]

If God can't tell the difference twixt a murder and some dude lying and telling his old lady her butt don't look big in them britches, I gotta wonder about God's intelligence.

[ChristianGuy]

Well as a Christian, I stand on what the Bible says and that is it. I believe Jesus put it so... "Live not by bread alone but by every word that comes out of the mouth of God." That is all I can say on this subject.

[JoeyKnothead]

Well as a Christian, I stand on what the Bible says and that is it. I believe Jesus put it so... "Live not by bread alone but by every word that comes out of the mouth of God." That is all I can say on this subject.

My previous statement was meant to show that lying in order to make someone feel good about themselves is not so bad if done in moderation. Pretty much every man has had to tell some kind of small lie to please his mate, or to help lift her spirits. This is not such a crime as murder by any stretch of at least my imagination.

[ChristianGuy]

I understand what you mean. White lies seem to hold everything together at times.