What did Jesus create?

[snowbound]

It's my belief as well as the belief of many others that Jesus only created this 'earth' and this earth only. It's possible that he didn't even create this entire solar system, but God the Father did. God allowed Jesus to 'design' this planet and this planet only. I'm convinced that when we look up and see the trillions of 'suns' many of them have or likely have had inhabited 'earths' - and likely with humans on them. Possibly some of them have humans larger than us. Possible and in my view, likely the same.

No doubt God is still in the creation business. When this 'earth' reaches its end, God will create more 'earths' and my guess is they likely all FELL and needed a Savior. That Savior would likely be another fully human being like our Jesus was.

In my view it's illogical to believe we are the only human creation among trillions of stars AND trillions of galaxies.

https://www.thoughtco.com/galaxy-types- ... on-3072058

[myth-one.com]

Who was Jesus before became flesh?

Jesus was the Word made flesh and did not exist until He was made flesh in John 1:14:

And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us... (John 1:14)

When the Word became flesh, is His God nature ceased in Jesus?

The Word is a Spirit and exists through all time -- never ceasing.

Jesus is not the Word -- Both The Word and the man Jesus Christ existed in parallel for the thirty or so years of Jesus' human life.

The Word exists as a spirit, and the man Jesus existed as a human.

What exactly do you mean by "God nature"?

There are two type of bodies -- natural and spiritual. The Word is a spiritual bodied being and humans are natural, or physical, bodied beings. Jesus was a natural bodied man.

If the Word is not in Jesus when becoming flesh, where do you believe God the Word was when Jesus lived on earth?

God the Word is everywhere at every time. You cannot trap God in one human. The Word did not change when the Word made flesh (Jesus) was born.

[Capbook]

When the Word became flesh, is His God nature ceased in Jesus?

The Word is a Spirit and exists through all time -- never ceasing.

Can you cite a Bible text that state the "Word is Spirit?"

The word "Word" bears Strong#G3056, in Greek "λόγος logos" Bible Lexicon have many definitions but "spirit" is not even one of them.

(NAS95+) John 1:1  R1In the beginningG746 was R2the WordG3056, and the WordG3056 was R3with GodG2316, and R4the WordG3056 was GodG2316. 

G3056 (Thayer Lexicon)
λόγος logos
1) of speech
1a) a word, uttered by a living voice, embodies a conception or idea
1b) what someone has said
1b1) a word
1b2) the sayings of God
1b3) decree, mandate or order
1b4) of the moral precepts given by God
1b5) Old Testament prophecy given by the prophets
1b6) what is declared, a thought, declaration, aphorism, a weighty saying, a dictum, a maxim
1c) discourse
1c1) the act of speaking, speech
1c2) the faculty of speech, skill and practice in speaking
1c3) a kind or style of speaking
1c4) a continuous speaking discourse - instruction
1d) doctrine, teaching
1e) anything reported in speech; a narration, narrative
1f) matter under discussion, thing spoken of, affair, a matter in dispute, case, suit at law
1g) the thing spoken of or talked about; event, deed
2) its use as respect to the MIND alone
2a) reason, the mental faculty of thinking, meditating, reasoning, calculating
2b) account, i.e. regard, consideration
2c) account, i.e. reckoning, score
2d) account, i.e. answer or explanation in reference to judgment
2e) relation, i.e. with whom as judge we stand in relation
2e1) reason would
2f) reason, cause, ground
3) In John, denotes the essential Word of God, Jesus Christ, the personal wisdom and power in union with God, his minister in creation and government of the universe, the cause of all the world’s life both physical and ethical, which for the procurement of man’s salvation put on human nature in the person of Jesus the Messiah, the second person in the Godhead, and shone forth conspicuously from His words and deeds.

G3056 (Mounce Lexicon)
λόγος logos
330x: a word, a thing uttered, Mat_12:32; Mat_12:37; 1Co_14:19; speech, language, talk, Mat_22:15; Luk_20:20; 2Co_10:10; Jas_3:2; converse, Luk_24:17; mere talk, wordy show, 1Co_4:19-20; Col_2:23; 1Jn_3:18; language, mode of discourse, style of speaking, Mat_5:37; 1Co_1:17; 1Th_2:5; a saying, a speech, Mrk_7:29; Eph_4:29; an expression, form of words, formula, Mat_26:44; Rom_13:9; Gal_5:14; a saying, a thing propounded in discourse, Mat_7:24; Mat_19:11; Jhn_4:37; Jhn_6:60; 1Ti_1:15; a message, announcement, 2Co_5:19; a prophetic announcement, Jhn_12:38; an account, statement, 1Pe_3:15; a story, report, Mat_28:15; Jhn_4:39; Jhn_21:23; 2Th_2:2; a written narrative, a treatise, Act_1:1; a set discourse, Act_20:7; doctrine, Jhn_8:31; Jhn_8:37; 2Ti_2:17; subject-matter, Act_15:6; reckoning, account, Mat_12:36; Mat_18:23; Mat_25:19; Luk_16:2; Act_19:40; Act_20:24; Rom_9:28; Php_4:15; Php_4:17; Heb_4:13; a plea, Mat_5:32; Act_19:38; a motive, Act_10:29; reason, Act_18:14; ὁ λόγος, the word of God, especially in the Gospel, Mat_13:21-22; Mrk_16:20; Luk_1:2; Act_6:4; ὁ λόγος, the divine WORD, or Logos, Jhn_1:1.

Jesus is not the Word -- Both The Word and the man Jesus Christ existed in parallel for the thirty or so years of Jesus' human life.

Can you explain whose "form of God' Jesus opted to emptied Himself to?

The Word exists as a spirit, and the man Jesus existed as a human.

Verse please that the Word a spirit.

What exactly do you mean by "God nature"?

The God nature of the Word.

There are two type of bodies -- natural and spiritual. The Word is a spiritual bodied being and humans are natural, or physical, bodied beings. Jesus was a natural bodied man.

Verse please of what I colored blue above.

If the Word is not in Jesus when becoming flesh, where do you believe God the Word was when Jesus lived on earth?

God the Word is everywhere at every time. You cannot trap God in one human. The Word did not change when the Word made flesh (Jesus) was born.

Jesus said , "He is the life" and in 1John 1:1, as stated "the Logos of life" manifested, I believe the Word/Logos is in Jesus, when became flesh. The Word/Logos/speech/Jesus, whom through Him created all things. (John 1:3, Col 1:16)

John 14:6  Jesus *said to him, "I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father but through Me. 

1Jn 1:1  What was from the beginning, what we have heard, what we have seen with our eyes, what we have looked at and touched with our hands, concerning the Word of Life— 

1Jn 1:1  WhatG3739 was R1from the beginningG746, whatG3739 we have R2heardG191, whatG3739 we have R3seenG3708 with our eyesG3788, whatG3739 we R4have lookedG2300 at and R5touchedG5584 with our handsG5495, concerningG4012 the R6WordG3056 of LifeG2222— 

G3056
λόγος logos
Thayer Definition:
1) of speech

[myth-one.com]

When the Word became flesh, is His God nature ceased in Jesus?

The Word is a Spirit and exists through all time -- never ceasing.

Can you cite a Bible text that states the "Word is Spirit?"

Sure. The Word is God according to John 1:1:

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

And God is a Spirit:

God is a Spirit: . . .(John 4:24)

If The Word is God, and God is a Spirit, then the Word is a Spirit. End of proof.

The Word exists as a spirit, and the man Jesus existed as a human.

Verse please that the Word is a spirit.

See above.

There are two type of bodies -- natural and spiritual. The Word is a spiritual bodied being and humans are natural, or physical, bodied beings. Jesus was a natural bodied man.

Verse please of what I colored blue above.

If The Word is God, and God is a Spirit, then the Word is a Spirit.

If the Word is not in Jesus when becoming flesh, where do you believe God the Word was when Jesus lived on earth?

God the Word is everywhere at every moment. You cannot trap God in one human. The Word did not change when the Word made flesh (Jesus) was born. They were two separate beings. One spiritual and one physical.

[William]

[Replying to snowbound in post #1]

Is there a question for debate?

[myth-one.com]

[Replying to snowbound in post #1]

Is there a question for debate?

It's "What did Jesus create?"

It's way up at the top.

The correct answer is that the Word created everything!

And if the Word created everything, then Jesus created nothing!

No one has proved otherwise.

Ta Da!

[Capbook]

When the Word became flesh, is His God nature ceased in Jesus?

The Word is a Spirit and exists through all time -- never ceasing.

Yes, it never ceased in Jesus, that's the form of God Jesus opted to empty Himself.

Can you cite a Bible text that states the "Word is Spirit?"

Sure. The Word is God according to John 1:1:

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

And God is a Spirit:

God is a Spirit: . . .(John 4:24)

If The Word is God, and God is a Spirit, then the Word is a Spirit. End of proof.

Bible defined the Word as speech, as thing uttered and etc. And by your interpretation you've just proven and confirm that the "Holy Spirit" is God, the second person of the Trinity.

The Word exists as a spirit, and the man Jesus existed as a human.

May we know what is your definition of the word "Word" myth-one.com?

Verse please that the Word is a spirit.

See above.

Can you define what the "Word/Logos" means?

There are two type of bodies -- natural and spiritual. The Word is a spiritual bodied being and humans are natural, or physical, bodied beings. Jesus was a natural bodied man.

Verse please of what I colored blue above.

If The Word is God, and God is a Spirit, then the Word is a Spirit.

Just no verse quoted. Again, by your interpretation you just edified the concept of the Trinity, as the Word, the Father and the Holy Spirit are one in the nature of God in three persons.
Keep in mind that the Father is a person, and by that the other two are also persons.

If the Word is not in Jesus when becoming flesh, where do you believe God the Word was when Jesus lived on earth?

God the Word is everywhere at every moment. You cannot trap God in one human. The Word did not change when the Word made flesh (Jesus) was born. They were two separate beings. One spiritual and one physical.

According to your interpretation, the "Word is spirit" when the spirit became Jesus and not in Jesus, do that mean Jesus had no spirit while on earth?

Bear in mind that the "Logos of life" when in flesh/Jesus was manifested, seen, looked at and been touch with hands.
If the Logos was not in Jesus, He should have not been recorded in the text.

1Jn 1:1  What was from the beginning, what we have heard, what we have seen with our eyes, what we have looked at and touched with our hands, concerning the Word of Life— 
1Jn 1:2  and the life was manifested, and we have seen and testify and proclaim to you the eternal life, which was with the Father and was manifested to us

[BruceLeiter]

[Replying to snowbound in post #1]

On what do you base these beliefs, @snowbound? Certainly, not on the Bible?

[NeutralZone]

Sure. The Word is God according to John 1:1:

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

myth-one.com, your cherry-picking of the third clause from John 1:1 is the routine of all Trinitarians. Like the rest of them, you conveniently skipped past Clause #1: "In the BEGINNING was the Word...."

That first clause makes it abundantly clear that the spirit person referred to as "the Word" aka Jesus Christ had a beginning. In other words, Jesus Christ/the Word is a created being. According to the Trinity doctrine, Jesus has always existed with Jehovah the Father. Scripture says the exact opposite. It says he had a beginning.

FYI: Clause #3 "and the Word was God," is nothing more than manipulation of scripture by Trinitarian Bible translators. That third clause should correctly say "and the Word was A god." And that's lower case "god."

Another thing, don't bother telling me that the New World Translation of the Bible (published by Jehovah's Witnesses) has it wrong. There are dozens of other Bibles that render Clause #3 as "the Word was A god." Let me know when you are ready, and I will provide you with a few examples.



NeutralZone


________________
". . . be swift about hearing, slow about speaking, slow about wrath. . . . " (James 1:19-20)

[BruceLeiter]

[Replying to NeutralZone in post #108]

No, @NeutralZone, John runs his description parallel with Genesis 1:1, which says that "in the beginning (of the creation,)" God creates it.

Gen 1:1  In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth. 

And the Word as a Person of God is the Agent of the Father involved "in the beginning" of that first creation:

Joh 1:2  He was in the beginning with God. 
Joh 1:3  All things were made through him, and without him was not any thing made that was made. 

[NeutralZone]

[Replying to NeutralZone in post #108]

No, @NeutralZone, John runs his description parallel with Genesis 1:1, which says that "in the beginning (of the creation,)" God creates it.

Gen 1:1  In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth. 

And the Word as a Person of God is the Agent of the Father involved "in the beginning" of that first creation:

Joh 1:2  He was in the beginning with God. 
Joh 1:3  All things were made through him, and without him was not any thing made that was made. 

That's incorrect, BruceLeiter. The Genesis creation account was not the first creation. By the time of the Genesis creation account, there were already millions of created angels. Therefore, John 1:1 and Genesis 1:1 are not parallel scriptures.

You are ignoring the context to Genesis 1:1. Context refers to surrounding words, verses, and chapters within the same Bible book. Below is part of the context to Genesis 1:1 that you've chosen to ignore. There, Jehovah God was talking to one of the millions of his previously created angelic sons who we now know is the prehuman Jesus Christ.

Genesis 1:26
Then God said: “Let us make man in our image, according to our likeness, and let them have in subjection the fish of the sea and the flying creatures of the heavens and the domestic animals and all the earth and every creeping animal that is moving on the earth.”



NeutralZone


________________
". . . be swift about hearing, slow about speaking, slow about wrath. . . . " (James 1:19-20)