I am starting this thread here for those who aren't participating in The God Delusion debate because I think it warrants a much wider range of attention.
In the book, the author states a case in which in 2004, a 12 year old boy in Ohio wore a t-shirt to school that said "Homosexuality is a sin, Islam is a lie, abortion is murder. Some issues are just black and white!". The school told the student not to wear it, the parents sued the school not on the basis of freedom of speech, but freedom of religion. The courts agreed with the parents. The Alliance Defense Fund of Arizona argued that the t-shirt wasn't about hate speech, but religious speech. Hence it warrants freedom of religion.
Another cited example is a church in New Mexico that believes the use of the hallucinogenic drug dimethyltryptamine found in hoasca tea enhances their ability to understand God. The US Supreme Court in 2006 agreed, despite the fact that the drug is illegal. The church got an exemption. However, in the case of cannabis for chemo patients, though few states legalized it for medical purposes, the federal government wont recognize this and can still prosecute you for it use based on the 2005 ruling of the Supreme Court.
So my question for debate should be obvious:
What is the limitation of freedom of religion. Is it being abused?
Freedom of Religion
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Freedom of Religion
Post #1What we do for ourselves dies with us,
What we do for others and the world remains
and is immortal.
-Albert Pine
Never be bullied into silence.
Never allow yourself to be made a victim.
Accept no one persons definition of your life; define yourself.
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What we do for others and the world remains
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-Albert Pine
Never be bullied into silence.
Never allow yourself to be made a victim.
Accept no one persons definition of your life; define yourself.
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Post #31
McCulloch wrote:So if God promises to make a great nation of my descendants and then I hear a message to sacrifice my only son to God, that must be from a demon. Right?
So Abraham was wrong to attempt to obey God in human sacrifice?Greatest I Am wrote:Not likely. I would be sure that God got enough souls in other ways without needing one more.
A request from God to break His Law would be considered strange indeed.
Examine everything carefully; hold fast to that which is good.
First Epistle to the Church of the Thessalonians
The truth will make you free.
Gospel of John
First Epistle to the Church of the Thessalonians
The truth will make you free.
Gospel of John
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Post #32
No. Anyone willing to not do the bidding of a real God would be a fool.McCulloch wrote:McCulloch wrote:So if God promises to make a great nation of my descendants and then I hear a message to sacrifice my only son to God, that must be from a demon. Right?So Abraham was wrong to attempt to obey God in human sacrifice?Greatest I Am wrote:Not likely. I would be sure that God got enough souls in other ways without needing one more.
A request from God to break His Law would be considered strange indeed.
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DL
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Post #33
McCulloch wrote:So Abraham was wrong to attempt to obey God in human sacrifice?
And how does one tell the difference between the bidding of the real God and that of a demon?Greatest I Am wrote:No. Anyone willing to not do the bidding of a real God would be a fool.
Examine everything carefully; hold fast to that which is good.
First Epistle to the Church of the Thessalonians
The truth will make you free.
Gospel of John
First Epistle to the Church of the Thessalonians
The truth will make you free.
Gospel of John
Post #34
If God requests you sacrifice your child, is He real? Recall, it was done in the OT and the NT emphasizes that none should be put before God. I would think that would include children.Greatest I Am wrote:It depends on the message.McCulloch wrote:How do you tell the difference?Greatest I Am wrote:If you are searching for God and you find a demon then you must recognize it for what it is. If not then likely you will end up in jail.
Regards
DL
What we do for ourselves dies with us,
What we do for others and the world remains
and is immortal.
-Albert Pine
Never be bullied into silence.
Never allow yourself to be made a victim.
Accept no one persons definition of your life; define yourself.
-Harvey Fierstein
What we do for others and the world remains
and is immortal.
-Albert Pine
Never be bullied into silence.
Never allow yourself to be made a victim.
Accept no one persons definition of your life; define yourself.
-Harvey Fierstein
Post #35
Sorry, posted mine before I read this. Not intending to step on toesMcCulloch wrote:McCulloch wrote:So if God promises to make a great nation of my descendants and then I hear a message to sacrifice my only son to God, that must be from a demon. Right?So Abraham was wrong to attempt to obey God in human sacrifice?Greatest I Am wrote:Not likely. I would be sure that God got enough souls in other ways without needing one more.
A request from God to break His Law would be considered strange indeed.

What we do for ourselves dies with us,
What we do for others and the world remains
and is immortal.
-Albert Pine
Never be bullied into silence.
Never allow yourself to be made a victim.
Accept no one persons definition of your life; define yourself.
-Harvey Fierstein
What we do for others and the world remains
and is immortal.
-Albert Pine
Never be bullied into silence.
Never allow yourself to be made a victim.
Accept no one persons definition of your life; define yourself.
-Harvey Fierstein
- Greatest I Am
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Post #36
When He comes in with that request I will let you know.Confused wrote:If God requests you sacrifice your child, is He real? Recall, it was done in the OT and the NT emphasizes that none should be put before God. I would think that would include children.Greatest I Am wrote:It depends on the message.McCulloch wrote:How do you tell the difference?Greatest I Am wrote:If you are searching for God and you find a demon then you must recognize it for what it is. If not then likely you will end up in jail.
Regards
DL
Regards
DL
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Post #37
See, that's the question that I have always asked. How do you know that "God" isn't, in reality, the 'devil' of another pantheon, sent to mislead humanity from the one true deity? Exactly how would you discover the truth?McCulloch wrote:And how does one tell the difference between the bidding of the real God and that of a demon?
Funny, I never get any answers from the theists on that.
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Post #38
When God speaks it is only with your mind that you hear.Cephus wrote:See, that's the question that I have always asked. How do you know that "God" isn't, in reality, the 'devil' of another pantheon, sent to mislead humanity from the one true deity? Exactly how would you discover the truth?McCulloch wrote:And how does one tell the difference between the bidding of the real God and that of a demon?
Funny, I never get any answers from the theists on that.
Is the message good or bad. Evaluate it and then you tell us if it is God or a Demon.
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DL
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Post #39
So when I'm listening to the voices in my head, if I personally think that a particular message is good then it must be from God and not a demon. OK.Greatest I Am wrote:When God speaks it is only with your mind that you hear.
Is the message good or bad. Evaluate it and then you tell us if it is God or a Demon.
:yapyap:

Examine everything carefully; hold fast to that which is good.
First Epistle to the Church of the Thessalonians
The truth will make you free.
Gospel of John
First Epistle to the Church of the Thessalonians
The truth will make you free.
Gospel of John
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Post #40
Do you need others to prove you right before acting?McCulloch wrote:So when I'm listening to the voices in my head, if I personally think that a particular message is good then it must be from God and not a demon. OK.Greatest I Am wrote:When God speaks it is only with your mind that you hear.
Is the message good or bad. Evaluate it and then you tell us if it is God or a Demon.
:yapyap:
Do you not trust your own judgement?
Regards
DL