The Bible is Father-Centric not Christo-Centric

[APAK]

The so-called Orthodox Christian apologetic should be reaffirming and defending his/her beliefs and faith to others by arguing for a doctrine(s) with a Father centric message(s) of hope and salvation rather than wrapped neatly in a Christocentric message(s). If not understood and believed that scripture reaffirms a Father-to-Son relationship first, then even the most simple and common Christocentric message eventually unravels and becomes chaotic and confused. This is my premise and personal belief.

As one source puts it...Albert Emanuel 2007...

"The Bible is Father-Centric, not Christocentric. The entire bible revolves around the central role of God the Father in the plan of salvation. God the Father is the God of Israel, the God of Jesus, and the God of Christians. It was God the Father who sent His Son, sacrificed His Son, and resurrected His Son. The Bible is primarily about God the Father and secondarily about Christ the Son. The biblical emphasis is upon God the Father. Jesus constantly and continuously emphasized God the Father. The Lord's prayer is entirely about God the Father. The kingdom and the power and the glory belong to God the Father. The kingdom of God is the kingdom of God the Father, not the kingdom of Christ. The time has come for the theological restoration of God the Father to His rightful place as the one ultimate and absolute God of Gods....."

What about it? Can you see the bright light shining in this topic?

[Capbook]

The so-called Orthodox Christian apologetic should be reaffirming and defending his/her beliefs and faith to others by arguing for a doctrine(s) with a Father centric message(s) of hope and salvation rather than wrapped neatly in a Christocentric message(s). If not understood and believed that scripture reaffirms a Father-to-Son relationship first, then even the most simple and common Christocentric message eventually unravels and becomes chaotic and confused. This is my premise and personal belief.

As one source puts it...Albert Emanuel 2007...

"The Bible is Father-Centric, not Christocentric. The entire bible revolves around the central role of God the Father in the plan of salvation. God the Father is the God of Israel, the God of Jesus, and the God of Christians. It was God the Father who sent His Son, sacrificed His Son, and resurrected His Son. The Bible is primarily about God the Father and secondarily about Christ the Son. The biblical emphasis is upon God the Father. Jesus constantly and continuously emphasized God the Father. The Lord's prayer is entirely about God the Father. The kingdom and the power and the glory belong to God the Father. The kingdom of God is the kingdom of God the Father, not the kingdom of Christ. The time has come for the theological restoration of God the Father to His rightful place as the one ultimate and absolute God of Gods....."

What about it? Can you see the bright light shining in this topic?

Would it mean that we are wrong to be Christians? Followers of the teachings of Christ?
When we do not abide in the teachings of Jesus, we does not have the Father.

2 John 9
9 Anyone who goes too far and does not abide in the teaching of Christ, does not have God; the one who abides in the teaching, he has both the Father and the Son.
NASB

[APAK]

The so-called Orthodox Christian apologetic should be reaffirming and defending his/her beliefs and faith to others by arguing for a doctrine(s) with a Father centric message(s) of hope and salvation rather than wrapped neatly in a Christocentric message(s). If not understood and believed that scripture reaffirms a Father-to-Son relationship first, then even the most simple and common Christocentric message eventually unravels and becomes chaotic and confused. This is my premise and personal belief.

As one source puts it...Albert Emanuel 2007...

"The Bible is Father-Centric, not Christocentric. The entire bible revolves around the central role of God the Father in the plan of salvation. God the Father is the God of Israel, the God of Jesus, and the God of Christians. It was God the Father who sent His Son, sacrificed His Son, and resurrected His Son. The Bible is primarily about God the Father and secondarily about Christ the Son. The biblical emphasis is upon God the Father. Jesus constantly and continuously emphasized God the Father. The Lord's prayer is entirely about God the Father. The kingdom and the power and the glory belong to God the Father. The kingdom of God is the kingdom of God the Father, not the kingdom of Christ. The time has come for the theological restoration of God the Father to His rightful place as the one ultimate and absolute God of Gods....."

What about it? Can you see the bright light shining in this topic?

Would it mean that we are wrong to be Christians? Followers of the teachings of Christ?
When we do not abide in the teachings of Jesus, we does not have the Father.

2 John 9
9 Anyone who goes too far and does not abide in the teaching of Christ, does not have God; the one who abides in the teaching, he has both the Father and the Son.
NASB

Well I do see your view. My OP means more that just what 2 John 9 says from a surface view.
Take that verse. It can only offer a summary statement of the Father and the Son, as it is only one verse, and not an entire Chapter dedicated to the Father and the Son in this fashion. And yes of course we do have the Son and therefore the Father, as the Son is in the Father, and that is a more detailed view of what 2 John 9b says.

Another verse on the same concept"
(1Jn 2:24) As for you, let that abide in you which you heard from the beginning. If what you heard from the beginning abides in you, you also shall abide in the Son and in the Father.
and another..
(Joh 1:18) No one has seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, he has made Him known.
-------------------------------
But this is not the point of the OP! The perspective view not just for salvation of the Bible should be first understood and focused on the Father, even if the Son is spoken of as executing salvation for us. We still must acknowledge that say for salvation, the Son became the saviour as the instrument of his father for his plan of salvation. The Father was the one that planned and executed salvation for us through his Son.

Today, many do not place the glory and credit where is should go in the Bible, on the Father, the lifetime CEO on the strategic level. He is the only one who does all the planning, initial thinking, and sets the execution times of his plans. Jesus became the tactical chief 'on the ground' so to speak and performs the Father's plans.
//
Let me give another more detailed example or two in the Bible..

The book of revelation, and entitled the revelation of Jesus the Messiah for a reason, many reasons. And we can both list them. And even this book is solidly still Father God-centric if you continue to use the same approach in thought and heart as in the other books of the Bible.

The accolades of Jesus in this Book, he earned them all. Of course they are given to Jesus as the only worthy person as the anointed one and his God chose him, before time. And it goes without saying, that the Father is worthy of his place and title even more.

We tend to hide this Father elephant in the room, this major current or driving force in every single Book of the New Testament for no reason except by our imaginations, and what we have been taught, of the enticements and the excitement of false teachings. The awards and glory given to Jesus are born of his Father, all of them.

(Rev 1:1) The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show to his servants the things which must shortly come to pass; which he sent and put into sign by his Angel to his servant John;

(Rev 4:2) Immediately I was in the Spirit, and beheld a throne set in heaven; and one sitting upon the throne.
.......
(Rev 4:11) Worthy are you, our Lord, to receive the glory and the honour and the power. For you did create all things, and for your sake they existed and were created.

And these three verses as you well know is about the Father God, and not his Son...as many falsely believe. They are clearly Father God centric. And this chapter and the next in Rev. tees off the tone for the rest of the Book, by first introducing the Father.

You can go through all the Book, and especially all of the OT and see that the Father is centric to nearly all the text.

This is the perspective we should approach and understand scripture. We have no problem relating a prophet's message to the Father, although many of us have a hard time relating Jesus's actions to his Father for reasons that are not realistic and whimsical.

We readily understand that Moses was an agent of the Father and spoke for him. Why not substitute the words of Jesus as coming from and to speak for his Father as well, and that his words are not derived from the Son himself as its source?

The Pharisees were stumped and angry when Jesus explained this very thing to them...

(Joh 5:41) I receive not glory from men.
(Joh 5:42) But I know that you do not have the love of God in your hearts.
(Joh 5:43) I come in my Father's Name, and you do not accept me. If another shall come in his own name, you will accept him.
(Joh 5:44) How can you believe, you who accept praise from each other, but do not seek the praise that comes from the only God?
(Joh 5:45) Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father. There is one that accuses you, Moses, on whom you have set your hope.
(Joh 5:46) For if you believed Moses, you would believe me. For he wrote of me.
(Joh 5:47) But if you do not believe his writings, how shall you believe my words?

(Act 3:20) and that He may send the Christ, who has been appointed for you, Jesus;
(Act 3:21) whom the heaven must receive until the time of the restoration of all things, of which God spoke by the mouth of His holy prophets, that have been since the world began.
(Act 3:22) Moses indeed said: A prophet like me shall the Lord God raise up for you from among your brothers; you shall listen to him in whatever he tells you.
(Act 3:23) And it shall be, that every soul that shall not listen to that prophet shall be utterly destroyed from among the people.
(Act 3:24) Yes, and all the prophets from Samuel, and those that followed after, as many as have spoken, they also told of these days.
(Act 3:25) You are the sons of the prophets, and of the covenant which God made with your fathers, saying to Abraham: And in your descendant shall all the families of the earth be blessed.
(Act 3:26) To you first, God, having raised up His servant, sent him to bless you, in turning every one of you away from your sins.

You can see clearly that the Bible is Father God centric and not truly Christ-centric. That is the point. We much acknowledge this common perspective in the Bible that the Father did and spoke through his servants, including Christ.

I hope now you can see, that I do not criticize any works of Christ, only where the ultimate credit lies, as many forget or do not realize that it all comes from the Father, who is the one God.

Blessings...

[onewithhim]

The so-called Orthodox Christian apologetic should be reaffirming and defending his/her beliefs and faith to others by arguing for a doctrine(s) with a Father centric message(s) of hope and salvation rather than wrapped neatly in a Christocentric message(s). If not understood and believed that scripture reaffirms a Father-to-Son relationship first, then even the most simple and common Christocentric message eventually unravels and becomes chaotic and confused. This is my premise and personal belief.

As one source puts it...Albert Emanuel 2007...

"The Bible is Father-Centric, not Christocentric. The entire bible revolves around the central role of God the Father in the plan of salvation. God the Father is the God of Israel, the God of Jesus, and the God of Christians. It was God the Father who sent His Son, sacrificed His Son, and resurrected His Son. The Bible is primarily about God the Father and secondarily about Christ the Son. The biblical emphasis is upon God the Father. Jesus constantly and continuously emphasized God the Father. The Lord's prayer is entirely about God the Father. The kingdom and the power and the glory belong to God the Father. The kingdom of God is the kingdom of God the Father, not the kingdom of Christ. The time has come for the theological restoration of God the Father to His rightful place as the one ultimate and absolute God of Gods....."

What about it? Can you see the bright light shining in this topic?

That is so obvious---that it is the Father who is the center of everything. Jesus said things to make it absolutely sure that it is so.

[APAK]

The so-called Orthodox Christian apologetic should be reaffirming and defending his/her beliefs and faith to others by arguing for a doctrine(s) with a Father centric message(s) of hope and salvation rather than wrapped neatly in a Christocentric message(s). If not understood and believed that scripture reaffirms a Father-to-Son relationship first, then even the most simple and common Christocentric message eventually unravels and becomes chaotic and confused. This is my premise and personal belief.

As one source puts it...Albert Emanuel 2007...

"The Bible is Father-Centric, not Christocentric. The entire bible revolves around the central role of God the Father in the plan of salvation. God the Father is the God of Israel, the God of Jesus, and the God of Christians. It was God the Father who sent His Son, sacrificed His Son, and resurrected His Son. The Bible is primarily about God the Father and secondarily about Christ the Son. The biblical emphasis is upon God the Father. Jesus constantly and continuously emphasized God the Father. The Lord's prayer is entirely about God the Father. The kingdom and the power and the glory belong to God the Father. The kingdom of God is the kingdom of God the Father, not the kingdom of Christ. The time has come for the theological restoration of God the Father to His rightful place as the one ultimate and absolute God of Gods....."

What about it? Can you see the bright light shining in this topic?

That is so obvious---that it is the Father who is the center of everything. Jesus said things to make it absolutely sure that it is so.

It is obvious to you and me although many today have lost the plot. They see wherever and whenever Jesus works or speaks he does it independently without any assistance as they think he is also the same God as his Father because they, the Father and Son, 'naturally' know what's on each others mind. ref. Trinitarians and Binitarians. And scripture is silent on their explanations and beliefs.

This thread is a wake up call to refocus on the 'Father first' as the source in al things holy, divine and eternal...

[JehovahsWitness]

This thread is a wake up call to refocus on the 'Father first' as the source in al things holy, divine and eternal...

It would help rebalance things in the mainstream Christian mindset if the Father's name was highlighted appropriately. Begrudgingly acknowledging that God the Father has a personal name but one that has been removed from most modern translations is deeply problematic as it leaves people essentially worshipping a "nameless" god whose identity is acknowledged only rarely and often under duress. How can worshippers forge a close personal relationship with a god whose name they do not use in prayer or worship?


JEHOVAH'S WITNESS

[APAK]

This thread is a wake up call to refocus on the 'Father first' as the source in al things holy, divine and eternal...

It would help rebalance things in the mainstream Christian mindset if the Father's name was highlighted appropriately. Begrudgingly acknowledging that God the Father has a personal name but one that has been removed from most modern translations is deeply problematic as it leaves people essentially worshipping a "nameless" god whose identity is acknowledged only rarely and often under duress. How can worshippers forge a close personal relationship with a god whose name they do not use in prayer or worship?


JEHOVAH'S WITNESS

well said, and to the point

[Revelations won]

Dear APAK,

Your OP is well stated and correct. Thank you!

I realize of course that there are some who have an incorrect understanding of the Father and the Son which in and of itself adds more error and confusion.

Is it not also of fundamental import that we all should have a clear and certain knowledge of every aspect of the corporeal nature of both the Father and the Son?

For example, has the Son ever received or possessed anything which the Father does not already have?

Another example is, has the Son ever done anything which the Father ha not already done?

Did not Christ also have glory with the Father before the world was?

Did not, according to scripture Christ bring more glory to the Father in heaven before he became the only begotten Son of the Father in the flesh?

Did not Christ in his mortal mission by submitting to the will of the Father in all things also bring more glory to the Father?

Mortal man may devise philosophies of man trying to formulate their man made ideas relating to heavenly things.


I submit that all that efforts by man completely fail in comparison to the most powerful testimony given by Christ himself when he so testified in the following:

John 8:28 Then said Jesus unto them, When ye have lifted up the Son of man, then shall ye know that I am he, and that I do nothing of myself; but as my Father hath taught me, I speak these things.

John 5:30 I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.


John 5:19 Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise.


Do we not also follow and worship Christ as the angels of God do as our great exemplar?

Do we also in this process humble and condition ourselves by so doing to also ultimately prepare ourselves to become worthy to allow Christ to introduce us to the point of our ultimate focus of highest worship of the great Elohim, the most high God even our Father in heaven, who is literally the very Father of our spirits and ultimately serve him who is the most high God?

[A Freeman]

This thread is a wake up call to refocus on the 'Father first' as the source in al things holy, divine and eternal...

It would help rebalance things in the mainstream Christian mindset if the Father's name was highlighted appropriately. Begrudgingly acknowledging that God the Father has a personal name but one that has been removed from most modern translations is deeply problematic as it leaves people essentially worshipping a "nameless" god whose identity is acknowledged only rarely and often under duress. How can worshippers forge a close personal relationship with a god whose name they do not use in prayer or worship?


JEHOVAH'S WITNESS

Thank-you. That's been done in the King of kings' Bible, where the vague references have been replaced with "I AM" from the Hebrew "YHWH", sometimes expressed as "Jehovah".

To all: very nice thread, by the way. All praise and glory be to Father, the One True God.

[Capbook]

This thread is a wake up call to refocus on the 'Father first' as the source in al things holy, divine and eternal...

It would help rebalance things in the mainstream Christian mindset if the Father's name was highlighted appropriately. Begrudgingly acknowledging that God the Father has a personal name but one that has been removed from most modern translations is deeply problematic as it leaves people essentially worshipping a "nameless" god whose identity is acknowledged only rarely and often under duress. How can worshippers forge a close personal relationship with a god whose name they do not use in prayer or worship?


JEHOVAH'S WITNESS

There are still Bible translations that mentioned the personal name of the Father. The Tetragrammaton.

Gen 2:4 These are the births of the heavens and the earth when they were created, in the day that יהוה Elohim made earth and heavens.
Gen 2:5 Now no shrub of the field was yet on the earth, and no plant of the field had yet sprung up, for יהוה Elohim had not sent rain on the earth, and there was no man to till the ground,
Gen 2:6 but a mist went up from the earth and watered the entire surface of the ground.
Gen 2:7 And יהוה Elohim formed the man out of dust from the ground, and breathed into his nostrils breath of lives. And the man became a living being.
Gen 2:8 And יהוה Elohim planted a garden in Ěḏen, to the east, and there He put the man whom He had formed.
Gen 2:9 And out of the ground יהוה Elohim made every tree grow that is pleasant to the sight and good for food, with the tree of life in the midst of the garden and the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.

Rev 19:1 And after this I heard a loud voice of a great crowd in the heaven, saying, “Halleluyah! Deliverance and esteem and respect and power to יהוה our Elohim!
Rev 19:6 And I heard as the voice of a great crowd, as the sound of many waters and as the sound of mighty thunders, saying, “Halleluyah, for יהוה Ěl Shaddai reigns!
Rev 19:13 and having been dressed in a robe dipped in blood – and His Name is called: The Word of יהוה.c Footnote: c Jhn 1:1 and Jhn 1:14.
Rev 21:22 And I saw no Dwelling Place in it, for יהוה Ěl Shaddai is its Dwelling Place, and the Lamb.
Rev 22:5 And night shall be no more, and they shall have no need of a lamp or the light of the sun, because יהוה Elohim shall give them light. And they shall reign forever and ever.
Rev 22:6 And he said to me, “These words are trustworthy and true. And יהוה Elohim of the set-apart prophets has sent His messenger to show His servants what has to take place with speed.