Jehovah's Witnesses: False Prophecies

[We_Are_VENOM]

.

First off, let me preface this by saying the following..

1. As mentioned on another thread, I have many years invested in dealing with Jehovah's Witnesses (JW's), from family, to friends, to strangers. I am very familiar with them and their theology.

2. I am beginning a series of threads attacking their "Christian" theology and doctrine. This one, as titled, deals with Jehovah's Witnesses and their false prophecies.

3. I have beef with, not only JW's, but ANYONE of whom I believe to be spreading false Christian doctrine. This includes, but not limited to...

A.) Mormons
B.) Catholics
C.) World Mission Society Church of God
D.) Hebrew Israelites

Jehovah's Witnesses are just one of many false Christian denominations. But, we are talking about Jehovah's Witnesses for now.

So, the question is ultimately; Why do I feel as if Jehovah's Witnesses are false teachers? There are many reasons, and one of those reasons is their many failed attempts at predicting prophecy.

Before I continue on post #2, keep in mind that future threads in this series will go straight to the gusto, with no preface.

Just FYI.

[JehovahsWitness]

But when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for He will not speak on His own initiative, but whatever He hears, He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come (John 16:13).

The Holy Spirit did not guide your organization into all truth, nor did he disclose to your organization what is to come.

IS THERE EVIDENCE GOD HAS GUIDED JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES ?

We believe he most certainly has done. Thanks to holy spirit we have been guided to free ourselves from unbiblical teachings (such as belief in the immortality of the soul, eternal torture in hellfire, the trinity). It has helped us take a firm organisational position [ofgicially publishing condemnations] against behaviours that God disproves of (such as sexual immorality , including homosexuality). God has helped us stay seperate from the worlds wars and political conflicts and blessed us with staying a united international brotherhood.

God has also helped us to be ready and alert for the end of the gentile times and alert to the other bible time prophecies connected with our day such as the events during "last days" .... We were once in spiritual darkness, we are now in the light. All that, we believe, thanks to guidance from God's holy spirit.



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Is infallibility a condition of "being lead by God's spirit"?
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viewtopic.php?p=1045275#p1045275

What do Jehovahs Witnesses mean when they speak of "the truth"?
viewtopic.php?p=998018#p998018

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ORGANISATION, ORGANISATIONAL INFALLIBILITY and ...RELIGIOUS TRUTH and ...

[JehovahsWitness]

They seem to be a list of men's names. Are you claiming each individual was an ORGANISATION ?

My contention is that individuals/organizations that are chosen by God doesn't give false predictions ...

# SWITCH : That was not the point your list was addressing. Your original claim was ....

Organizations chosen by God dont give opinions, they give facts.

I asked for scritural support for the above you provided a list of names. Obviously you cannot prove your point by pointing to the lives of individuals (since no one individual equates to "an organisation" )



=========================

The point regarding whether godly men and women express personal OPINION has already been scripturally addresses. HERE : POST # 89


If you would like to present an actual counterargument (rather than merely repeat your claim) feel free. NOTE "No not buying it" is not a counterargument - I have no interest in debating with anyone that simply parrots the same mantra without scriptural references.





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What is the difference between a PREDICTION and A PROPHECY? [this post]
viewtopic.php?p=1045225#p1045225

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ORGANISATIONAL INFALLIBILITY ,FAILED PREDICTIONS and ...FALSE PROPHETS

[We_Are_VENOM]

Exactly, they were inspired PROPHETS. Jehovahs Witnesses make no such claim. We are not prophets and we certainly are not inspired.

Really? Make or Made?

"As Jehovah revealed his truths by means of the first century Christian congregation so he does today by means of the present-day Christian congregation. Through this agency he is having carried out prophesying. All of this activity is not an accident. Jehovah is the one behind all of it." WT June 15, 64
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There is an authentic prophetic class of Christians among us. Jehovah has raised up a genuine "prophet" within our generation. Regardless of how Christendom views or regards this group of anointed witnesses of Jehovah, the time must come, and that shortly, when those making up Christendom will know that really a "prophet" of Jehovah was among them." (“The Nations Shall Know That I Am Jehovah” – How?, 1971)

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"So, does Jehovah have a prophet to help them, to warn them of dangers and to declare things to come?

These questions can be answered in the affirmative. Who is this prophet?

This “prophet” was not one man, but was a body of men and women. It was the small group of footstep followers of Jesus Christ, known at that time as International Bible Students. Today they are known as Jehovah’s Christian witnesses."
(Watchtower, 4/1/72, p.197)
----------------------------------------------------------

https://www.gospeloutreach.net/jwproph.html

http://daenglund.com/the-watchtower-wro ... authority/

And there you have it, people. Debunked by their own publications. SMH.

[JehovahsWitness]

DID A 1972 WATCHTOWER JEHOVAHS WITNESSES WERE
INSPIRED PROPHETS?

This “prophet” was not one man, but was a body of men and women. It was the small group of footstep followers of Jesus Christ, known at that time as International Bible Students. Today they are known as Jehovah’s Christian witnesses" - Watchtower, 4/1/72, p.197

No it did not. As in the sense pointed out by the Catholic vatican it only uses there term "prophet" in its wider sense of evangelizers. Indeed the article in question systematically referred to "prophet" " < ----- in quotations marks---> " to signal to the reader that the word was being used in this general sense of MESSENGERS and NOT as in the pronouncers of an INSPIRED personal revelation.

CONCLUSION Jehovah's Witnesses have never claimed to be the originators of inspired prophecy. They have only ever alluded to their role in revealing /interpreting or clarifying already record divinely inspired bible truths.

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[We_Are_VENOM]

STRAWMAN: Why are you asking that of me? Are you claiming Jehovah's Witnesses say this? Jehovah's Witnesses teach that it is only through Jesus we are saved (John 6:40).

... So, are you saying that I can be saved by the blood of Christ without becoming a Jehovah's Witness and in essence belonging to the WTS?

That is correct.

Glad to see you acknowledge that. Although I don't get the same impression from other JW's.

"You do not have to become a Jehovah's Witness in order to be saved".

Can we agree to those terms?

If int he terms you mean be a baptized active member of our modern day organisation and by saved you mean survive Armageddon , and then no you dont have to be a Jehovahs Witness to be saved.

Can we agree to those terms?

Agreed. [/quote]

Perhaps I commended you too soon. The link you provided to the question of do JW's believe that they will be the only ones saved..it states..

"No. Many millions who lived in centuries past and who weren’t Jehovah’s Witnesses will have an opportunity for salvation."

This is just blatantly false. Biblically FALSE.

Expect a thread on this subject soon.

BTW, when a post becomes too lengthy, I don't know how to do multiple quotes on one post. So this post will come out jacked up. But you will get the gist.

[JehovahsWitness]

"As Jehovah revealed his truths by means of the first century Christian congregation so he does today by means of the present-day Christian congregation. Through this agency he is having carried out prophesying. All of this activity is not an accident. Jehovah is the one behind all of it." WT June 15, 64

He or We?

The quote says GOD is "carrying out", as in, fulfilling prophecying through his people. The Christian congregaton was spoken of prophetically and we (Jehovahs Witnesses) believe we are the fulfillment of such prophecies. At no point does the article say WE are inspired prophets.


The article clearly states they are being " used to dispense God’s progressive revelations in these last days" If one uses a jug to pour out milk who is pouring ? you or the jug? The article is simply saying God is fulfilling prophecy by means of his organisation, not that his earthly organisation is a source of prophecy.







JW

To learn more please go to other posts related to...ORGANISATION ,

ORGANISATIONAL INFALLIBILITY and ...FAILED PREDICTIONS

[JehovahsWitness]

" Many millions who lived in centuries past and who weren’t Jehovah’s Witnesses will have an opportunity for salvation."

This is just blatantly false. Biblically FALSE.

Well so far you have not actually proven anything false.

It is the totality of EVERYTHING else that is wrong with the WTS, and the list is long. If you put all of the errors in one gumbo pot, there is nothing but disaster on the menu.

Yes I hear your hyperbole... what I cannot see that you have presented
any specifics.

I have reasons to believe that Jehovah's Witnesses (the leadership) have been dishonest about some things.

a) .... not saying what specifically what your reasons are.

b) ...not producing any scriptural evidence whatsoever.

We have some excellent posters here, both believers and non belivers that know their bibles very well. They can and do construct very good argumentation and counterarguments*. I may not necessarily agree with them but I totally respect the quality of their posting. May I suggest you read the contributions of some of the regular posters here .

* NOTE Repetiton is no more counterargument than stamping your feet or sucking your thumb

Maybe it would be best for your credibility to refrain from statements and claims until you are ready to present proof to support them.

[onewithhim]

STRAWMAN: Why are you asking that of me? Are you claiming Jehovah's Witnesses say this? Jehovah's Witnesses teach that it is only through Jesus we are saved (John 6:40).

... So, are you saying that I can be saved by the blood of Christ without becoming a Jehovah's Witness and in essence belonging to the WTS?

That is correct.

Glad to see you acknowledge that. Although I don't get the same impression from other JW's.

"You do not have to become a Jehovah's Witness in order to be saved".

Can we agree to those terms?

If int he terms you mean be a baptized active member of our modern day organisation and by saved you mean survive Armageddon , and then no you dont have to be a Jehovahs Witness to be saved.

Can we agree to those terms?

Agreed.

Perhaps I commended you too soon. The link you provided to the question of do JW's believe that they will be the only ones saved..it states..

"No. Many millions who lived in centuries past and who weren’t Jehovah’s Witnesses will have an opportunity for salvation."

This is just blatantly false. Biblically FALSE.
[/quote]


onewithhim responds:


No, it's not Biblically false. If you believe that, then prove it by presenting scriptures.





.

[We_Are_VENOM]

STRAWMAN: "The truth" in all those expressions refer to bible truths not the modern day organisation which did not even exist until 1879.

There is nothing unscriptural about the terminology. You seem to be attributing a meaning to the terms contrary to intent. May I suggest you do some further research on JWs terminology before you attempt to criticize it.

That is incorrect. JW's use "the truth" to refer to their organization as it stands today, and yesterday. I've witnessed (no pun intended) this with my own eyes, and anytime someone (anyone) uses that terminology to refer to themselves (or his or her self), immediately my "cult" alarm begins to go off.

That is how it always begins.

Kind of reminds me of the "Peoples Temple" with cult leader Jim Jones.

During a documentary on the Jonestown massacre, one of his sermons (audio) was displayed...and in the sermon, he stated..(I'm paraphrasing)..

"If you want me to be your father, I will be your father" (audience applause)

"If you want me to be your mother, I will be your mother" (louder applause)

"If you want me to be your brother, I will be your brother" (louder applause)

"If you want me to be your sister, I will be your sister" (louder applause)

"If you want me to be your GOD, I will be your GOD"

(LOUDEST APPLAUSE)

It is that last part where it things began to turn "culty".

And the people just went with it. Blind sheep lead by a wolf in sheep's clothing.

There was even a photo of an elderly woman holding up a sign which said

"I believe in Jim Jones".

I see no difference between that, and the faith that JW's have in the leadership of the organization (governing body).

But more on that later, in due time.

[We_Are_VENOM]

STRAWMAN THE W[ B]TS is a legal entity. The 8 million or or Jehovahs Witnesses are no part of it.

You acknowledge that it is a legal entity, but are you implying that it is just a legal entity?

Please answer this question, and based on how you answer I will be able to determine whether or not you are being disingenuous.

May I suggest you do some further research on JWs terminology before you attempt to criticize it

Sure. I have a suggestion for you, also.

I suggest you look deep inside your soul, that, and with prayer, I guarantee you to find that the organization you consider "home" has not been chosen by the living God to feed his sheep.

They are not the faithful and discreet slave, and the leadership has no Biblical authority over you, nor are they inspired by the Most High.