Telling Demons from God

[ElCodeMonkey]

If one "spirit" tells you X and another tells you NOT X, how do you know which is right? I imagine, for a lot of people, you'll likely say "well does it jive with the Bible?" Barring the fact that most things can be forced to jive if you want it too, how do we know it wasn't a demon who whispered the idea to take the Bible as God's word to begin with? What if that whole concept was a demon whisper and the God whisper is "ugh, listen to me, not the book!" and we unjustly turn away the God-whisper? Of course, it's just as possible that God is saying to follow the book while a demon says to follow him. So how does one tell them apart? How do you know which is God and which is demon and especially if disagreeing about the book itself? Why default to believing the "follow the book" one without a good reason? Please note, the book cannot give an authoritative answer on this. It could contain useful advice, but not with authority on the matter of determining its own authority. So how do you tell spirits apart?

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 6 by JehovahsWitness]

Well, you've given a form of logic for why resurrection would make sense as a test. I could come up with reasons to dismantle that, ....

Feel free to try.

... I'd like to hear if you had response to the remaining questions...

The remaining questions are irrelevant. The logic holds even if the proving events remain unrecorded in a book.



JW

[jeremiah1five]

If one "spirit" tells you X and another tells you NOT X, how do you know which is right? I imagine, for a lot of people, you'll likely say "well does it jive with the Bible?" Barring the fact that most things can be forced to jive if you want it too, how do we know it wasn't a demon who whispered the idea to take the Bible as God's word to begin with? What if that whole concept was a demon whisper and the God whisper is "ugh, listen to me, not the book!" and we unjustly turn away the God-whisper? Of course, it's just as possible that God is saying to follow the book while a demon says to follow him. So how does one tell them apart? How do you know which is God and which is demon and especially if disagreeing about the book itself? Why default to believing the "follow the book" one without a good reason? Please note, the book cannot give an authoritative answer on this. It could contain useful advice, but not with authority on the matter of determining its own authority. So how do you tell spirits apart?

First, "demons" originate in man. They are attitudes.
Second, you must know the Bible back and forth, up and down, even backwards (No, this isn't a Beatles song), and once trained/discipled in His Word (Preferrable a KJV) then it will be difficult when a man will try to deceive you.

[2timothy316]

[Replying to post 32 by ElCodeMonkey]

I really feel the disconnect in our conversation is that Satan doesn't give up anyone for any reason is not taken as a fact. Satan will fake expelling demons to further his agenda but never actually expel a demon. According to Jesus, Jewish leadership was under the influence of Satan. They were liars according to Jesus. Thus even if they did make it look like they were expelling demons, no demon would actually be expelled. Again, think of Televangelist that claim they are casting out demons. It's the answer to your question. Are they actually expelling demons to lead people to Almighty Jehovah, the True God? Or are they misleading and actually expelling nothing to line their pockets? Jesus preached about his Father and the coming kingdom and expelled demons for that cause. Satan would never do such a thing. Yet it is clear that he will fake anything to appear like an 'angel of light'. Yet, Satan actually expel a demon, no way! People have been faking exorcisms for centuries.

If a person studies Satan's tactics and agenda telling demons from God is easy. Jehovah is about furthering kingdom interest and clearing His name. Satan is the exact opposite in all respects.

[William]

[Replying to post 42 by 2timothy316]

People have been faking exorcisms for centuries.

Point being, re the OP blurb, how is one to know the real from the fake? Even the story of demons being cast from one individual into a herd of pigs which then became suicidal, could be fake.

The whole idea of demons/demons possessing human forms could be fake.

Have you personally witnessed a true exorcism, and if so, by what means did you establish the event was true?

[marco]

How do you know? Or how do I know?


You can know by asking to hear for yourself, if indeed you are one of His sheep and do hear His voice, and by testing the inspired expression.

Usually we require some objective method of discerning truth, Tam. I've never been a disciple of the school that suggests we believe that we may understand. It seems like cheating or,indeed, self-deception.

If the crop of believers is drawn from those who have heavenly hearing aids, it raises the question: "How much do they cost?" How much of our intellectuality do we sacrifice in order to own them?

I find the analogy of sheep eating grass and wandering where the shepherd bids them rather unattractive and demeaning. Is man not meant to strive for the stars rather than descend into to ovine behaviour?

[ttruscott]

...and once trained/discipled in His Word (Preferrable a KJV) then it will be difficult when a man will try to deceive you.

Yet isn't it true that the serpent uses GOD's words against sinners, even the elect, as was proved in the garden?

It is not the relationship we have with the Book that keeps us safe, it is only the relationship we have with HIM.

[ttruscott]

If the crop of believers is drawn from those who have heavenly hearing aids, it raises the question: "How much do they cost?" How much of our intellectuality do we sacrifice in order to own them?

They cost that you hold your un-faith in abeyance because at heart you hope that what GOD claims, either as a still small voice or in the word, to be true. I know of no cost to our intellectuality at all.

I find the analogy of sheep eating grass and wandering where the shepherd bids them rather unattractive and demeaning. Is man not meant to strive for the stars rather than descend into to ovine behaviour?

Both arguing the analogy instead of the reality it was used to highlight AND taking the analogy, not the reality, to absurdity are logical fallacies...

[jeremiah1five]

...and once trained/discipled in His Word (Preferrable a KJV) then it will be difficult when a man will try to deceive you.

Yet isn't it true that the serpent uses GOD's words against sinners, even the elect, as was proved in the garden?

It is not the relationship we have with the Book that keeps us safe, it is only the relationship we have with HIM.

Serpent was in the Garden, but what serpent is that?

The serpent is a "beast of the field,' so was Lucifer a beast of the field that the Lord God had made?

[2timothy316]

[Replying to post 42 by 2timothy316]

People have been faking exorcisms for centuries.

Point being, re the OP blurb, how is one to know the real from the fake?

What I have been saying for days now. Motive.

Why would a Televangelist fake casting out a demon? To further Kingdom truth or line his pockets with cash? Did Jesus cast out demons to help or make money? Why would the RCC fake casting out demons? To further kingdom truth? Or put fear in people into keep those donations coming and secure their power. Why did Jesus cast out demons and why would Satan fake casting out demons? Consider Jesus' goal and consider Satan's goal and that is your answer.

If you don't know Jesus' goal and Satan's goal, just ask and will happily show scriptures for both goals.

[ttruscott]

...and once trained/discipled in His Word (Preferrable a KJV) then it will be difficult when a man will try to deceive you.

Yet isn't it true that the serpent uses GOD's words against sinners, even the elect, as was proved in the garden?

It is not the relationship we have with the Book that keeps us safe, it is only the relationship we have with HIM.

Serpent was in the Garden, but what serpent is that?

The serpent is a "beast of the field,' so was Lucifer a beast of the field that the Lord God had made?

I will say, "So what?" to elicit the meaning or implications of what you wrote as I do not see them yet...