Is an eternal hell reversible?

Exploring the details of Christianity

Moderator: Moderators

User avatar
GospelJohn
Apprentice
Posts: 167
Joined: Sun Nov 16, 2008 4:26 pm
Location: Arizona

Is an eternal hell reversible?

Post #1

Post by GospelJohn »

The horrors of an eternal hell are clearly spelled out in the Bible. We may disagree on if we are burned or frozen or tortured or left completely alone, but the Bible is clear that hell is not something we want to experience. But how long does hell last if God is a fair and just God?

The Catholics have developed the concept of Purgatory so that while hell may be eternal, our suffering for our finite sins (non-mortal sins) can be endured for a time and then we enter heaven purged of our selfishness. Protestants feel that Jesus paid for every sin so that we will all be somehow perfected before entering heaven…although we may well receive unequal rewards forevermore dependent on how we lived when alive on the earth. Others believe that those who do not somehow attain heaven actually suffer forever in hell. Then others still believe that hell is temporary if we don’t qualify for heaven and that the soul is destroyed after it has suffered proportionately for the sins it committed against God on earth.

I personally don’t believe any of those things. If God is omniscient and omnipotent and the perfect loving parent we all wished we’d had growing up, then none of the above makes any sense. If we are punished forever in hell for a finite amount of sin on earth, that is hardly just and fair. If we are punished forever without the option for redemption, that is a great definition of the word torture…and I doubt that is what God wants for His beloved children. If God somehow reverses our sinful choices of the past so that we instantly become perfect, that interferes with our free will. If God is willing to do that, why wouldn’t He have created us without the choice to go against His will in the first place? So it seems that if God wants us all to freely accept His loving ways for our own, then threats of eternal torture and interfering with our free will are poor ways for a perfect parent to achieve that goal with 100% success.

But then what are we to do with the Biblical references to an eternal hell? Even Jesus mentions such a few times in the NT. I believe this all becomes clear from the timeless perspective of our loving Father. If it is God that indeed set the rules for us and the universe, then perhaps seeing things more from His POV is a better way to understand such infinite concepts. Read on…

From the perspective of God, not limited by time, what is the definition of eternal, everlasting, forever, etc.? That would have to be that whatever He is experiencing at this moment is also where God is at any point in eternity. As hard as that might be to understand fully, it fits well with the Bible saying that God is unchanging. But what of us, the selfish Prodigal Children who decided to go against their Father’s loving ways? The Bible says that such behavior means we are doomed for hell, and I actually agree with that. (I define hell as being separated from the loving mind of God, so hell is an ugly state of mind rather than a torturous location.) But while I believe we have the choice to reject God forever, at any moment we might change our minds, we can always get out of hell...forever. When we do, we can head back on the Prodigal’s path toward home/heaven where He meets us and throws a party in celebration. Let me try a science analogy to illustrate this point better.

If you were to throw a ball into open space and there were no gravitational waves or other vector forces to affect its path, how long would the ball head in the direction you threw it? I think we can all agree it would speed ever-farther away unimpeded forever. But if the ball were remotely controlled and propelled by us, could we not at any moment send a signal to the ball to turn around and come back? So how does this relate to an eternal hell? I’ll sum it up…

I agree with the passages of the Bible that say our selfish behaviors will indeed put us in hell (apart from God in consciousness). If we choose to continue our selfish ways, then hell lasts exactly as long as our selfish choices continue, so hell can indeed be eternal if that is what we choose it to be for us. However, the moment we would desire to change our ways and accept the loving ones God prefers, we always have that choice to make. That would make hell eternal, if we choose it to be, but always reversible (can return to heaven) when we’ve had enough of reaping the selfishness we’ve sown.

I know this is a lousy topic for most Atheists to discuss, but I welcome all comments or inquiries into the logic of my POV once the premises it’s based on are at least temporarily accepted for the sake of discussion.

Skyangel
Banned
Banned
Posts: 1211
Joined: Wed Jun 16, 2010 6:22 pm

Post #31

Post by Skyangel »

S-word wrote: It was He, the spirit that descended upon Jesus in the form of a dove and who chose the man Jesus as the one through whom He would reveal his perfected nature to the world. He, who sent Jesus in His name to speak in his name, and it is to He, who revealed himself through his chosen and obedient earthly host body, to whom all sin has been ascribed.

For this reason, his earthly image (Jesus) had to lifted up on a stake, in the same manner that Moses lifted up upon a stake, the image of the serpent in the wilderness, in order that all those who were dying because of the venom of that old accusing serpent that courses through their veins and is killing them, only have to turn to His earthly image that had been lifted up to be saved.
There in your own words is more scriptural proof that Jesus represents the serpent or the devil on the cross. It was the serpent who was lifted up in the wilderness and the serpent lifted up on the cross.
The bible calls the serpent the devil.

Rev 12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

Rev 20:2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,

How the ancients or the people of today view the devil is quite irrelevant and subject to personal opinion with much variation.

You really ought to credit the source of your quote as well so readers can see you are not making up stories yourself but are merely quoting stories made up by someone else.

In the days of the bible stories about Jesus, the religious hypocrites perceived Jesus as being of the devil.

Jhn 10:20 And many of them said, He hath a devil, and is mad; why hear ye him?

Mat 12:24 But when the Pharisees heard [it], they said, This [fellow] doth not cast out devils, but by Beelzebub the prince of the devils.

Mat 10:25 It is enough for the disciple that he be as his master, and the servant as his lord. If they have called the master of the house Beelzebub, how much more [shall they call] them of his household?

The word "satan" means adversary and God is indeed an adversary (a satan ) to hypocrites and liars.

Jesus is also not the only earthly image of God. ALL of mankind was made in the image of God.

Gen 1:27 So God created man in his [own] image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

Post Reply