Is your sin Original?

[polonius]

The description of “original shin “ isn’t found in the Bible but it’s linked to the story about the Genesis serpent that convinced Eve and later Adam to eat the “forbidden fruit.�

Actually, the story was developed by St. Augustine in the 4th century working from a mistranslated Latin bible which had added the phrase “In quo� (in whom) in chapter 5� of St. Paul’s Letter to the Romans.

So in some mysterious way all people born were guilty with “the stain" of Adam’s and Eve’s sin. In the seventh century this led to the formulation of the Immaculate Concept doctrine which the Catholic church still considers infallible to this day. It might be noted that the Eastern Catholic Church recognizing Augustine’s writings error has never recognized Original Sin or the Immaculate Conception.

[ttruscott]

Was that an informed decision? What evidence and what basis did they have to decide not to accept YHWH as God?

It was as completely fully informed as it could be without a final proof in a society where ideas were all we had, ie, it was a pre-physical society. We heard HIS claims (probably expressed as the gospel) and had to decide to trust HIM because we saw a better chance for our future happiness that way or to reject HIM as the best way to fulfill our chances for a future happiness.

All supposed consequences of each option, ie to accept HIS claim to divinity or to reject it, were described and discussed until everyone had a full and complete understanding of the claim and was satisfied enough to choose an option. I do not see it as a "Line up and state your choice!" type of decison but waaaay more organic with people trying on one belief for awhile and then the other, all the while talking it all over with their friends until everyone had come to a committed position.

But if PROOF of HIS divinity (and therefore hell) were given BEFORE their decision was finalized then everyone would choose life and happiness in the light of that proof no matter how much they may have scorned accepting YHWH's divinity before they saw that proof. Proof would destroy the ability to make the choice by their free will by coercing them to choose according to the proof, not what they really wanted. And since the choice involved agreeing to be HIS loving bride in a heavenly marriage, our free will was an absolute necessity.

[ttruscott]

Isn’t this your claim? CARM: Christian Apologetics Research Ministry. Carm.org

ttruscott
A sub-set of corollaries to GOD is good and hates all evil is that
- HE created us to enter into a metaphorical marriage state with HIM, a state of perfect telepathic communication and communion, ie, both emotional and intellectual communication, with every person in that communion at all times.

- To allow us to enter this state so that it was a real expression of HIS desire for us, HE had to give us a free will with the ability to reject joining into the heavenly state because HE only wanted to marry those who wanted to marry HIM without being forced in any way.

Without looking back at CARM, I'd accept this post as mine on face value. While I have no memory of what I meant when I posted it, I will say that the state of marriage on earth is the metaphorical state, not the heavenly one. I either wrote this line during a lapse in thinking or was at least very clumsy...as I've been known to be.

Thanks for your help to me to express my thoughts more clearly and accurately...

[brunumb]

[Replying to post 130 by ttruscott]

All supposed consequences of each option, ie to accept HIS claim to divinity or to reject it, were described and discussed until everyone had a full and complete understanding of the claim and was satisfied enough to choose an option.

Can you cite a source that will validate that claim?

[ttruscott]

Can you cite a source that will validate that claim?

I can tell you where to look - every Bible verse which speaks of GOD's righteousness, HIS love and HIS hatred for evil is my source.

[brunumb]

Can you cite a source that will validate that claim?

I can tell you where to look - every Bible verse which speaks of GOD's righteousness, HIS love and HIS hatred for evil is my source.

That's not exactly a citation for the specific claim you made, so I will take that as a "NO". I will go further and say that this discussion of pre-born spirits is nothing more than a flight of fancy. The stories in Marvel comics have more credibility.

[marco]

That's not exactly a citation for the specific claim you made, so I will take that as a "NO". I will go further and say that this discussion of pre-born spirits is nothing more than a flight of fancy. The stories in Marvel comics have more credibility.

People theorize in thousands of ways, and some theories have the strength to sustain. As a boy I always felt exceptionally happy when I emerged from the confessional, having emptied my soul of its guilt.

Theories prove nothing though they may be of comfort to their owners. For many their theory fits perfectly to the way they see life unfolding and they have the Eureka moment of Archimedes, which makes them stout defenders of their golden hypothesis. On the rocky terrain of life I suppose there's nothing wrong with finding a means of transport from alpha to omega. It is better than nothing.

Blessed are those who believe their own theories; for they shall see God. I can understand why.

[polonius]

Isn’t this your claim? CARM: Christian Apologetics Research Ministry. Carm.org

ttruscott

“ HE created us to enter into a metaphorical marriage state with HIM, a state of perfect telepathic communication and communion, ie, both emotional and intellectual communication, with every person in that communion at all times. “
Post 131: Sat Dec 15, 2018 5:24 pm Re: Are there two Truscott;s poeting of the web?
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Ttruscott replied�

Without looking back at CARM, I'd accept this post as mine on face value. While I have no memory of what I meant when I posted it, I will say that the state of marriage on earth is the metaphorical state, not the heavenly one. I either wrote this line during a lapse in thinking or was at least very clumsy...as I've been known to be.

RESPONSE: What I’m interested in is you claim of “…a state of perfect telepathic communication�.

Are you still claiming that you are communicating intellectually telepathically with God and every other person in that communion at all times?

Do you yourself believe that, or expect readers to believe, your claim?

And you should work to overcome your memory losses and "lapse in thinking" and clumsiness.

[ttruscott]

Are you still claiming that you are communicating intellectually telepathically with God and every other person in that communion at all times?

IF you refer to the state of marriage I mentioned as the heavenly state, ie, HE created us to enter into a marriage state with HIM, a state of perfect telepathic communication and communion, why did you leave out the words to enter and marriage as if the time is now? It makes the question a bit dodgy... We enter the heavenly state after the judgement day; it's not yet ...

[polonius]

Are you still claiming that you are communicating intellectually telepathically with God and every other person in that communion at all times?

IF you refer to the state of marriage I mentioned as the heavenly state, ie, HE created us to enter into a marriage state with HIM, a state of perfect telepathic communication and communion, why did you leave out the words to enter and marriage as if the time is now? It makes the question a bit dodgy... We enter the heavenly state after the judgement day; it's not yet ...

RESPONSE: You claimed in a simple sentence:

ttruscott

- HE created us to enter into a metaphorical marriage state with HIM, a state of perfect telepathic communication and communion, ie, both emotional and intellectual communication, with every person in that communion at all times.

So I ask again are you claiming perfect telepathic communication with God? Is that true in your case?