Does the Bible really say that the value of pi is three?

[McCulloch]

Does the Bible really say that the value of pi is three?

Now he made the sea of cast metal ten cubits from brim to brim, circular in form, and its height was five cubits, and thirty cubits in circumference. Under its brim gourds went around encircling it ten to a cubit, completely surrounding the sea; the gourds were in two rows, cast with the rest. It stood on twelve oxen, three facing north, three facing west, three facing south, and three facing east; and the sea was set on top of them, and all their rear parts turned inward. It was a handbreadth thick, and its brim was made like the brim of a cup, as a lily blossom; it could hold two thousand baths.

[McCulloch]

UNDER THE BRIM. So the inside or the Cup from Brim to Brim is ten cubits, That would be the opening. A brim of a Cup. Most blossoms spread out. Under the Brim would not be as wide. Also a King James version of the Bible would help explain a lot.

Why? Is there something special about the 1611 Authorized Version?

The cup or sea had a normal amount in it of 2,000 baths or water, It had a 3,000 capacity. But got 4,000 baths of water poured into it, and, His CUP RUNNETH OVER.

Relevancy?

David’s son was born in 1004 B.C. Died seven days after Birth, Reborn in 4 B.C. at Bethlehem, the First begotten of the dead as Revelation 1:5 shows, and as a Prince, all of King David’s sons were a prince.

Relevancy?

Psalms 90: 4 For a thousand years in thy sight are but as yesterday when it is past, and as a watch in the night.

The 1,000 as yesterday when it is past covers Jesus from 1004 B.C. till Reborn at Bethlehem in 4 B.C. 1,000 as a watch in the Night is for the day of the cross as 1,000 years. Note that 4 B.C. till 29 A.D. is not seen, His age is as the Cup thickness or handbreadth thick.

Relevancy? I don't think that the Bible teaches that Jesus is David's son reborn. Is there any good reason to link Ps 90 to the length of time between 1004 BCE and Jesus' birth?

Psalms 39:5 Behold, thou hast made my days as an handbreadth; and mine age is as nothing before thee: verily every man at his best state is altogether vanity. Selah.

Then 2,000 baths or a deep sleep from seeing what God has done to 2029 A.D. Which is the Jew’s 2,000 years of not seeing, Unto th Cup she poured unto you (Jesus seen as a woman) pour unto her double.

Relevancy? What does this mean? Why is it relevant?

Joshua 3:3 And they commanded the people, saying, When ye see the ark of the covenant of the LORD your God, and the priests the Levites bearing it, then ye shall remove from your place, and go after it.
4 Yet there shall be a space between you and it, about two thousand cubits by measure: come not near unto it, that ye may know the way by which ye must go: for ye have not passed this way heretofore.

A similitude, For seeing the Ark (Jesus) and the Levites bearing it up (Upon a Cross at Golgotha) stay back 2,000 cubits or years, then follow 29 A.D. plus 2,000 is 2029 A.D. Israel follows Jesus.

Relevancy? Is there any valid hermeneutic principle that allows you to equate cubits for years and then to link them to 29 AD?

[ken1burton]

McCulloch.

The king James Version is a good interpretation. Scripture shows that the Cup had a capacity of 3,000 baths. When the Cup is used to also measure the time for Jesus, It needs to be accurate.

Also God speaks in Similitudes, So changing the wording on the verses so they can get a Copyright messes things up when they do not understand the Meaning. Even King James has some of them.

They added punctuation marks, But they did not know what was really being said, So often they did it in error.

When Judas came into the Garden, was one of them:

Luke 22:48 But Jesus said unto him, Judas, betrayest thou the Son of man with a kiss?

That is a Command, not a question, Judas hesitated.

Psalms 2:12 Kiss the Son, lest he be angry, and ye perish from the way, when his wrath is kindled but a little. Blessed are all they that put their trust in him.

Jesus knows He has to be kissed by Judas, or the Prophecies would not be fulfilled, and they would perish from the way, or not be doing this in order. So when Judas hesitated, Jesus commanded him. “Judas, Betrayest thou the Son of Man with a Kiss!”

This is also seen as Righteousness and Peace have kissed each other, “He maketh His officers peace, Judas as an officer, Given the Band of men from the Chief Priest. They are seen as a wall around Jesus in the Garden, So “Peace be within Thy walls” Also “He is lead forth with peace, Judas lead them in, Judas leads them out.

Judas is the one who is fulfilling the Prophecies with Jesus, Judas is the one who prepares the way before Him. Look who is instructing Judas:

Zechariah 11:13 And the LORD said unto me, Cast it unto the potter: a goodly price that I was prised at of them. And I took the thirty pieces of silver, and cast them to the potter in the house of the LORD.

His cup runneth over is Prophecy, and every jot and tittle has to be fulfilled, This also points to 1,000 years as yesterday when it is past, Jesus is David’s Child which was conceived outside wedlock, Under the law, that Child could not enter the Congregation even till His tenth generation.

God used a 100 year generation in Egypt, So 1004 B.C. to 4 B.C. (Our Calendar is four years off) Y2K happened in 1996. Knowing the Truth helps even today to know what is real.

Isaiah 60:22 A little one shall become a thousand, and a small one a strong nation: I the LORD will hasten it in his time.

That verse shows Jesus is 1,000 years old, But the Chapter starts showing a similitude for the Birth (actually Rebirth) at Bethlehem.

Isaiah 60:1 Arise, shine; for thy light is come, and the glory of the LORD is risen upon thee.
2 For, behold, the darkness shall cover the earth, and gross darkness the people: but the LORD shall arise upon thee, and his glory shall be seen upon thee.
3 And the Gentiles shall come to thy light, and kings to the brightness of thy rising.
4 Lift up thine eyes round about, and see: all they gather themselves together, they come to thee: thy sons shall come from far, and thy daughters shall be nursed at thy side.
5 Then thou shalt see, and flow together, and thine heart shall fear, and be enlarged; because the abundance of the sea shall be converted unto thee, the forces of the Gentiles shall come unto thee.
6 The multitude of camels shall cover thee, the dromedaries of Midian and Ephah; all they from Sheba shall come: they shall bring gold and incense; and they shall shew forth the praises of the LORD.

ARISE if from the Dead, Because all children go to God when they die, He is sent down from Heaven also, It shows the Kings coming, on Camels, Bringing Gold and Incense (Frankincense and Myrrh.) Other babies are there, That is why they told the Shepherds, You will find Him, lying in a manger, There might have been boy babies there also, There are girl babies being nursed there.

The Sign is also there in that Chapter:

Isaiah 60:19 The sun shall be no more thy light by day; neither for brightness shall the moon give light unto thee: but the LORD shall be unto thee an everlasting light, and thy God thy glory.

So the Wise men who were Bible Students, knew the time of the Promise to David, Knew the Child conceived outside wedlock would come back in 1,000 years, Knew He was destined to be King of the Jews. Knew who should come, What to come on, What to bring. And knew the Brightness of the Moon would be the Sign, Stars are for a sign, or the Sign is called a Star.

God hides the Moon, They go to Jerusalem, Zion is the Castle which was at Jerusalem David took, it was destroyed when Jerusalem was destroyed. They thought they were to go to Jerusalem anyway:

Psalms 87:5 And of Zion it shall be said, This and that man was born in her: and the highest himself shall establish her.
6 The LORD shall count, when he writeth up the people, that this man was born there. Selah.

The Child conceived outside wedlock was Born at Zion, Jesus the day of the Cross is born as the Body of Christ at Zion:

Psalms 2:6 Yet have I set my king upon my holy hill of Zion.
7 I will declare the decree: the LORD hath said unto me, Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee.

So the wise Kings leave Jerusalem for Bethlehem, Bethlehem is South West of Jerusalem, and the Moon would have been Southwest of Jerusalem also. Depending on the Road, any curves, and maybe a House being uphill, and their speed, The Moon could have very well looked as if it was standing right over the House. Like the moon often seems to be standing still as we move in a car in it’s direction.

There are too many jots and tittle which all need to interlock to have a version that is not as accurate as possible. The version you use is very important.

Christianity can not link David to Jesus, Like it or not, The Jews had no problem with the Answer of who’s Son is the Messiah, they answered David’s.

God swore in His Holiness that the Messiah would be David’s physical son:

2-Samuel 7:12 And when thy days be fulfilled, and thou shalt sleep with thy fathers, I will set up thy seed after thee, which shall proceed out of thy bowels, and I will establish his kingdom.
13 He shall build an house for my name, and I will stablish the throne of his kingdom for ever.
14 I will be his father, and he shall be my son. If he commit iniquity, I will chasten him with the rod of men, and with the stripes of the children of men:

Psalms 89:34 My covenant will I not break, nor alter the thing that is gone out of my lips.
35 Once have I sworn by my holiness that I will not lie unto David.
36 His seed shall endure for ever, and his throne as the sun before me.

So God coming down in the Form of the Son is not Scriptural truth. Mary has no genealogy, Both Matthew’s and Luke’s go to Joseph, Allowable under Jewish law when a woman’s husband dies with no heir, Next of kin takes her and raises up seed to the dead man, Giving the man two genealogies, One physical, one legal.

Mary does not have to be of the seed of David, the Child does. Mary is the Surrogate Mother, Bathsheba is His Mother. David is His dad.

It is all the Prophecies which God said would be fulfilled in the Messiah, also that He would be David’s child, and the prophecies all fulfilled in Jesus that shows Jesus is David’s son, the Link is the Prophecies being fulfilled in Christ.

When David took Bathsheba, God sent a parable unto him about taking Bathsheba, David had many wives then, But He did not take one of His flock to prepare, But Bathsheba.

2-Samuel 12:4 And there came a traveller unto the rich man, and he spared to take of his own flock and of his own herd, to dress for the wayfaring man that was come unto him; but took the poor man's lamb, and dressed it for the man that was come to him.

The WAYFARING Man whom has come to David is the Promise of the Messiah, Jesus is that WAYFARING MAN:

Jeremiah 14:8 O the hope of Israel, the saviour thereof in time of trouble, why shouldest thou be as a stranger in the land, and as a wayfaring man that turneth aside to tarry for a night?

Jesus was reborn a PRINCE, He does not become a King till God sets Him on His Holy Hill or goes to the Cross, So on Palm Sunday, when a prophecies is claimed to be fulfilled, It can not be, As Jesus is still a Prince:

Zechariah 9:9 Rejoice greatly, O daughter of Zion; shout, O daughter of Jerusalem: behold, thy King cometh unto thee: he is just, and having salvation; lowly, and riding upon an ass, and upon a colt the foal of an ass.

All prophecies are fulfilled the day of the Cross, There are similitudes that appear like they were fulfilled, Heaven and earth have to pass first.

Jesus is coming in on the Birth of mankind to God. The Body of Christ born the day of the Cross with us in that Body.

Genesis 49:11 Binding his foal unto the vine, and his ass's colt unto the choice vine; he washed his garments in wine, and his clothes in the blood of grapes:

Binding Jesus to the Birth of mankind to God.

Job 11:12 For vain man would be wise, though man be born like a wild ass's colt.

Those who hate Jesus without a cause are multiplied, 11 Disciples got Multiplied, Judas did not, they are made 1,000 times more then they are by Deuteronomy 1:11

Psalms 38:19 But mine enemies are lively, and they are strong: and they that hate me wrongfully are multiplied.

Psalms 91:7 A thousand shall fall at thy side, and ten thousand at thy right hand; but it shall not come nigh thee.

The “Right Hand” is the first 6-hour period from Sunset to Midnight, it is also the First day in Genesis, Let there be Light, I am the True Vine, I am the Good Shepherd, I am the Way, the Truth and the Life, In My Father’s House are many mansions, The day of the Cross is the BEGINNING, as the New world will begin, Here is where John 1:1 applies as Jesus or the House of David (Zechariah 12:8) is AS GOD, Because He will be dead part of the day, He is also seen there as the Angel of the Lord.

The Hate is because Jesus is reaching for Non-Jews. That is why it took them so long to start preaching to non-Jews.

Psalms 55:12 For it was not an enemy that reproached me; then I could have borne it : neither was it he that hated me that did magnify himself against me; then I would have hid myself from him:
13 But it was thou, a man mine equal, my guide, and mine acquaintance.

Judas seen as not hating Jesus, also as a man His Equal, Jesus in Vision told Daniel that only one person aided His coming, Michael your PRINCE. Jesus as a Prince, In the Garden the “PRINCE” of this world cometh, and has nothing in Me, or no one has been gathered yet into the Body of Christ at this point.

Revelation is looking at the day of the cross as 7 days or time periods. Seen as seven days in Isaiah 30:26. Only the day of the Cross will fit as this is the day God heals.

God takes the day of the cross and makes it as three pictures of doubles twice to establish it as God’s word. (Genesis 41:32)

First picture as 4 6-hour periods as 4 beasts with 6-wings, as the four winds, as the Four corners of the Earth, as the four horses.

Sunset to Midnight, Old Heaven, Midnight to sunrise is Old Earth, Sunrise to noon is New Earth, Noon to sunset is New Heaven, Old heaven and earth flee from His face which is the Face of a man on the Third beast with 6-wings or sunrise to noon.

Matthew 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

Adding a cubit to your stature raises you to Angel status, the 144 with Judas seen as a wall are the Angels given charge over Jesus, So they gather all things which offend, (Jesus has all sin) from one end of Heaven to the other, From one end of the earth to the other.

Revelation 21:17 And he measured the wall thereof, an hundred and forty and four cubits, according to the measure of a man, that is, of the angel.

They hate Jesus without a cause, so they are multiplied by 1,000 or 144,000 with Jesus on the Mount, they are virgins, Men travailing with Child, the Birth of the Body of Christ or Jesus took away sin, Now it is Emmanuel or “God with us.”

As every jot and tittle gets fulfilled.

There was war in Heaven, Old Heaven is Sunset to Midnight, Michael and his angels fought, the Devil and His angels fought in the Garden of Gethsemane.

The Devil is come down to you having great wrath, Jesus had to allow Himself to be taken, Great wrath is one of the sins of the world, When He did at Midnight, He knows He has but a short time, withing 16 Hours He will be dead on the Cross,

Matthew 12:22 Then was brought unto him one possessed with a devil, blind, and dumb: and he healed him, insomuch that the blind and dumb both spake and saw.

Exodus 4:11 And the LORD said unto him, Who hath made man's mouth? or who maketh the dumb, or deaf, or the seeing, or the blind? have not I the LORD?

The Lord devours like a Lion in Hosea 13:8, Roaring in Psalms 22:1, In adversity in Psalms 35:15. The day of the Cross He is seeking who He may devour or consume into the Body of Christ.

Psalms 99:3 Let them praise thy great and terrible name; for it is holy.

Father of lies is all the prophecies are seen as lies till they are fulfilled and not until, So Truth was not in Him when John 8:44 was spoken, Jesus has all future sins on Himself at Golgotha, Which is the Beginning, so a Murderer from the Beginning.

1-Kings 22:23 Now therefore, behold, the LORD hath put a lying spirit in the mouth of all these thy prophets, and the LORD hath spoken evil concerning thee.

Similitude for having Jesus go up and die in battle to establish God’s word as Truth.

The Link of the 1,000 years is so we start to look at what 1,000 years as yesterday past is for? God gives hints what is needed to search for.

Like the sin unto death, Not to pray for it, So we ask, What is the unpardonable sin, and a whole big story takes shape, showing just how much Jesus did suffer the day of the cross.

Jesus prayed for Peter, But God’s word says Smite the Shepherd, and the Sheep will be scattered, So Jesus thinking the Words are to Peter says “Get thee behind Me Satan, THOU art and offence unto Me.” But it is God speaking through Jesus to Jesus, Upon Jesus is coming all iniquity (Isaiah 53:6) not on Peter.

Satan is a name meaning in that Context, The Word of God. So Satan desires to sift Peter, or God’s word says He will sift all Israel, Peter is one of them.

Amos 9:9 For, lo, I will command, and I will sift the house of Israel among all nations, like as corn is sifted in a sieve, yet shall not the least grain fall upon the earth.

A similitude in Job, God tells Satan that He moved Him against Job without a Cause, God’s own words moved God, “I try the hearts and reigns of men” so cause or not, Job gets tested.

Jesus does not want to die and be separated from God and have to go into hell. But there is a Pardon offered, and Jesus only needs one person to stand for Him and He has it, That is what God saw in Jesus praying for Peter’s strength when Jesus knew He had to flee.

Jeremiah 5:1 Run ye to and fro through the streets of Jerusalem, and see now, and know, and seek in the broad places thereof, if ye can find a man, if there be any that executeth judgment, that seeketh the truth; and I will pardon it.

So Jesus does not get Peter for the Pardon, But later the One called the Good Thief (Jesus has all sins) stands up for Him, This is seen in the Prophecies:

Job 33:22 Yea, his soul draweth near unto the grave, and his life to the destroyers.

Jesus on the Cross:

23 If there be a messenger with him, an interpreter, one among a thousand, to shew unto man his uprightness:
24 Then he is gracious unto him, and saith, Deliver him from going down to the pit: I have found a ransom.

Jesus has the RANSOM from death, the one called the Good Thief is standing up for Him. Jesus says, “Today thou shall be with Me in Paradise, or I do not have to die, the Kingdom can come now.

But, He later reviles Jesus also, and the Pardon is lost.

Matthew 27:44 The thieves also, which were crucified with him, cast the same in his teeth.

This also is seen in Prophecy:

Psalms 142:4 I looked on my right hand, and beheld, but there was no man that would know me: refuge failed me; no man cared for my soul.

The one called the Good thief was on the Right side, Refuge or the Pardon is Gone, as more despair falls upon Jesus, He was sure He had it, But now “My God, My God, Why hast Thou forsaken Me.?

There is another try, “If you forgive others, Your heavenly Father will forgive You.” So “Father forgive them, They know not what they do.” But there is a problem there, Jesus has all sin, They have none. So if you regard iniquity in your heart, God will not hear you, So the Prayer falls short, God can not forgive them of anything.

Psalms 49:7 None of them can by any means redeem his brother, nor give to God a ransom for him:

NONE is a Name for Jesus, He can redeem us, We can not redeem Him, So None declareth, None showeth, When I called, None did answer, There is None beside Me.

Isaiah 22:14 And it was revealed in mine ears by the LORD of hosts, Surely this iniquity shall not be purged from you till ye die, saith the Lord GOD of hosts.

Jesus has the UNPARDONABLE sin, He has to die when He takes Future sins as His own. With Future sins as His own, This also fulfills to Disappoint the Wicked, and Disappointed He was, over and over. As God doubles twice to establish His words.

White horse is Sunset to Midnight, Coming in clouds is when Jesus took sin, Sin seen as clouds in Isaiah 44:22.

Black Horse with Balances is the Judgment from sunrise to noon, Third angel sounds and the Star wormwood falls upon the earth, Jesus is made all things cursed, He is as the Earth destroyed by God’s word like as a fire in Jeremiah 23:29.

It is a sign of the Judgment falling on Christ between sunrise and noon:

Amos 5:7 Ye who turn judgment to wormwood, and leave off righteousness in the earth,

So when Heaven and earth flee from His Face on the Third beast with 6-wings, then the first or white horse moves forward and it becomes the Great White throne of Judgment. All fulfilled the day of the Cross,

The things written is all sin on Jesus, His righteousness on us (Job 33:26)

So every man is judged according to His (Christ’s) works.

Fourth horse is Noon to sunset, Death followed by hell as Jesus dies and descends into hell. Fourth day in Genesis, God makes two great lights, Sun seen as the Throne in Psalms 89:36, Turned to darkness as Jesus dies and they think that is the end, Moon seen as the Establishment of the throne in Psalms 89:37 turned to blood as the Blood of Christ establishes the throne.

Fourth angel sounds in Revelation and a third of the Sun, and a third of the Moon is smitten, or one of the three pictures for the day of the Cross is fulfilled for the fourth time period.

The 1004 B.C. to 4 B.C. then goes to 29 A.D. or His Age as nothing, Time is to the Baptism, But times is the day of the Cross, God skips Him ministry.

Jesus is Baptized, Is carried to the Wilderness, Wilderness is the House built or taken to the day of the Cross, Shown the Revelation, Given 42 Months to continue, Goes back and shows His servants things which must shortly come to pass, So 42 months removed, or His age as Nothing, Things “Goof from nothing” then are good for Him Ministry.

Matthew 5:13 Ye are the salt of the earth: but if the salt have lost his savour, wherewith shall it be salted? it is thenceforth good for nothing, but to be cast out, and to be trodden under foot of men.

Jesus is the Salt, Now as a Street to them, or trodden underfoot. The Street is in all three pictures, The day as 7 time periods as SILVER tried in the Fire seven times, The three pictures is as God, So the Streets are paved with Gold or in the three pictures.

Isaiah 51:23 But I will put it into the hand of them that afflict thee; which have said to thy soul, Bow down, that we may go over: and thou hast laid thy body as the ground, and as the street, to them that went over.

So the Street and the wall get built again, as the day has to be shown in all three pictures,
Second picture as 2 12-hour periods as 2 witnesses, Third picture as 1 24-hour period as 24 Elders.

Daniel 9:25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.

The 70 weeks is a diversion, forget it, the days had to be shortened, all back to one day.

The day is all the Sevens in Revelation, the lamb has seven eyes, The day as unclean till fulfilled, so the eyes are plucked out till the eye is single, the day made as Darkness, so if the light of Thy eye be darkness, How GREAT is that Darkness.

Hosea 12:10 I have also spoken by the prophets, and I have multiplied visions, and used similitudes, by the ministry of the prophets.

The Cubits is to stay back 2,000 years, The Baby is waking up, So I better take care of him.

God bless your searching:

Ken

[Jester]

Does the Bible really say that the value of pi is three?

This wins a cleverness award if nothing else.

My natural reaction is that these were aproximate measurements. I don't see the reason why a book on theology would bother being exact in mathmatical areas. I suppose that it could be argued (and has been by myself if no one else) that there isn't necesarilly a point in giving mesurements at all (even aproximate ones). Perhaps there is a cultural translation issue here, but I don't see any reason why a passage specifically using a unit of measurement as innacurate as a cubit implies in any way that it is attempting to be mathmatically exact. In our culture (which is more literal than that of the Biblical authors) it is acceptable to claim that pi is 3.14 though we are fully aware that this is merely an aproximation. I'd imagine that a simmilar thing is going on here.

[anu]

I don't see the reason why a book on theology would bother being exact in mathmatical areas.

Yes, why pay attention to details. Like when the "Light" was created the first day and the "Sun" in the fourth day.

[OnceConvinced]

You'd think an all-knowing being like God would have taken into consideration the controversy he would cause by not making sure his writers got their facts exact on this ocassion.

[opus49]

You'd think an all-knowing being like God would have taken into consideration the controversy he would cause by not making sure his writers got their facts exact on this ocassion.

Or maybe he started the controversy on purpose... don't question your Creator!

[opus49]

I don't see the reason why a book on theology would bother being exact in mathmatical areas.

Yes, why pay attention to details. Like when the "Light" was created the first day and the "Sun" in the fourth day.

Are you saying light didn't exist before our sun? I mean, I like our sun and all... it's yellow, got lots of hydrogen, I like to draw mine with a smiley face. But I'm pretty sure that scientists now believe that light pre-dates the Sun's existence.

[OnceConvinced]

You'd think an all-knowing being like God would have taken into consideration the controversy he would cause by not making sure his writers got their facts exact on this ocassion.

Or maybe he started the controversy on purpose... don't question your Creator!

Actually, I don't question the creator. Only those humans who wrote the bible.

[Jester]

I don't see the reason why a book on theology would bother being exact in mathmatical areas.

Yes, why pay attention to details. Like when the "Light" was created the first day and the "Sun" in the fourth day.

I'm not sure that listing the infinitely long measurement of pi would be a better alternative. With each section of any book I've ever read, I try to ask myself "what is the point the writer is getting at?" then ask myself if I agree with that. I wouldn't reject a scientific proposal because it was written with poor grammar. I don't see why I should reject a claim about God because it uses rough aproximations in math.
The issue of the creation is simmilar, but that's another topic, really.

[opus49]

With each section of any book I've ever read, I try to ask myself "what is the point the writer is getting at?"

If only mainstream Christianity took this viewpoint with the entire Bible...