Israel and the Other Arabs; Signs of Hope

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cnorman18

Israel and the Other Arabs; Signs of Hope

Post #1

Post by cnorman18 »

Some good news; something other than peddling outrage, hatred and one-sided propaganda.

From this sort of enlightened self-interest and cooperation will eventually come peace. Let us all fervently hope.

ISRAEL AND THE OTHER ARABS: GULF-ISRAELI CONTACTS UNDER A COLD SURFACE
The cold peace between Israel and Arab Gulf states is surprisingly warm, if you believe a Wikileaked cable from 2009. As Eli Lake described it in the Washington Times, ‘Israel and its adversaries in the Persian Gulf…carried out extensive secret diplomacy to coordinate policy and exchange information on the threat posed by Iran.’ The classified cable cited high-level contact between Israel and Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Oman, and the United Arab Emirates – Arab states who have yet to formally recognize Israel and who either refuse to comment on or vigorously deny official contact. Israeli representative offices in Oman and Doha were ostensibly shuttered out of solidarity with Palestinians during the Second Intifada and Operation Cast Lead. The only recent public opening was in 2009, when an Israeli flag rose in Abu Dhabi to mark the Jewish state’s seat at IRENA, the UN renewable energy agency.

Cross-border contacts are more visible a few levels down, among the civilians and businessmen that serve as track two diplomats in Arab-Israeli relations. Israeli businessmen ply the diamond trade in Dubai and sell defense technology to the broader UAE. Arab and Israeli experts cooperate on water desalination and reuse technology at a research center in Oman. Doctors attend conferences and athletes compete in tournaments, though getting a visa can be haphazard; just today, the Israeli national swim team is in Dubai with a just-in-time set of visas.

‘Little by little there have been signs of progress,’ said Jason Isaacson of the American Jewish Committee. Jason and I met on the sidelines of the Manama Dialogue, a regional security conference where he was invited by the Bahraini government. Isaacson told me he’s been to the Gulf ‘frequently,’ leading AJC delegations to meet with Gulf officials and public figures. ‘I cannot believe that relations forged over many years die when offices are closed. Because the common interests are there and the common threats don't go away,’ he said in a phone interview days after the Manama meeting. ‘We talk with their diplomats in Washington a lot. We have similar concerns about the region, and about moving the peace process forward.’

Isaacson said there’s reason to believe that Gulf-Israeli relations are getting a rethink, and there were signs of it in Bahrain. Speakers advanced the idea that Arab states need to recognize Israeli security needs and opportunities for economic integration. In a sit-down interview, Sheikh Khalid al Khalifa, the Foreign Minister of Bahrain, told me Arab states need to reach out more to Israeli people.

‘We’re not talking about normalization here...we’re talking about communication,’ said Sheikh Khalifa. ‘You need to go to them through their own TV channels, through their own newspapers, and tell them that we are here in the Arab world and we want peace. We don’t want to throw you in the sea.’

Analysts point out that while there’s a lot Israel and Gulf states do not have in common – for one, their system of government – there is quiet admiration from both sides (one Gulf sheikh recently gifted me the book ‘Start Up Nation,’ charting Israel’s IT success).

‘The Persian Gulf countries are seen as more forward looking when it comes to their economies and more integrated with the West...their stability is very important to them,’ said Meir Javedanfar, a Middle East analyst based in Jerusalem. As he sees it, it’s a matter of pragmatism vs. ideology – seeing past the default hatred to seize cooperation on containing Iran, developing trade, and tackling water and environmental issues. In the Gulf, overt moves are constrained by insistence on the Arab Peace Initiative, a Saudi proposal that Arab states would normalize ties with Israel when and only if it achieves peace with the Palestinians. Isaacson of the AJC, and Israeli government spokesman Joel Lion, tell ABC News they want Gulf Arab governments more involved in the peace process – that they have enough weight in resources and political clout to untie the political and demographic knots holding up the process.

‘There is an opportunity for pragmatic thinking...this is a moment when they could step forward,’ said Isaacson. ‘They are potential gamechangers.’

But then events like the assassination of Hamas commander Mahmoud al Mabhouh in Dubai, widely attributed to the Mossad, are blamed for breaking the positive momentum. Dr. Theodore Karasik of regional think tank INEGMA said it was an ‘irritant’ in Israeli-Gulf relations.

‘But what was thought to be something that was damaging for years was only damaging for months…overtaken by regional concerns.’ They’re concerns that, by their nature, tend to bring all sides to the same table.

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Post #2

Post by Jrosemary »

Thank you for posting this! Any glimmer of hope is a good thing. O:)

DeBunkem
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Post #3

Post by DeBunkem »

There is a world of difference between the the corrupt despotic oil sheiks that host multinational corporations and the Arab "Street," who know that Israel is no more interested in a just peace with Palestine than the old South was in Emancipation:
The Gaza Massacre And The Struggle For Justice
By Ali Abunimah

December 28, 2010 "Electronic Intifada" -- The Gaza massacre, which Israel launched two years ago today, did not end on 18 January 2009, but continues. It was not only a massacre of human bodies, but of the truth and of justice. Only our actions can help bring it to an end.
The UN-commissioned Goldstone Report documented evidence of war crimes and crimes against humanity committed in an attack aimed at the very "foundations of civilian life in Gaza" -- schools, industrial infrastructure, water, sanitation, flour mills, mosques, universities, police stations, government ministries, agriculture and thousands of homes. Yet like so many other inquiries documenting Israeli crimes, the Goldstone Report sits gathering dust as the United States, the European Union, the Palestinian Authority and certain Arab governments colluded to ensure it would not translate into action.

Israel launched the attack, after breaking the ceasefire it had negotiated with Hamas the previous June, under the bogus pretext of stopping rocket firing from Gaza.

During those horrifying weeks from 27 December 2008 to 18 January 2009, Israel's merciless bombardment killed 1,417 people according to the Palestinian Centre for Human Rights in Gaza.

They were infants like Farah Ammar al-Helu, one-year-old, killed in al-Zaytoun. They were schoolgirls or schoolboys, like Islam Khalil Abu Amsha, 12, of Shajaiyeh and Mahmoud Khaled al-Mashharawi, 13, of al-Daraj. They were elders like Kamla Ali al-Attar, 82 of Beit Lahiya and Madallah Ahmed Abu Rukba, 81, of Jabaliya; They were fathers and husbands like Dr. Ehab Jasir al-Shaer. They were police officers like Younis Muhammad al-Ghandour, aged 24. They were ambulance drivers and civil defense workers. They were homemakers, school teachers, farmers, sanitation workers and builders. And yes, some of them were fighters, battling as any other people would to defend their communities with light and primitive weapons against Israel's onslaught using the most advanced weaponry the United States and European Union could provide.

The names of the dead fill 100 pages, but nothing can fill the void they left in their families and communities ("The Dead in the course of the Israeli recent military offensive on the Gaza strip between 27 December 2008 and 18 January 2009," [PDF] Palestinian Centre for Human Rights, 18 March 2009).

These were not the first to die in Israeli massacres and they have not been the last. Dozens of people have been killed since the end of Israel's "Operation Cast Lead," the latest Salameh Abu Hashish last week, a 20-year old shepherd shot by Israeli occupation forces as he tended his animals in northern Gaza.

But the tragedy does not end with those who were killed. Along with thousands permanently injured, there is the incalculable psychological cost of children growing up without parents, of parents burying their children, and the mental trauma that Israel's offensive and the ongoing siege has done to almost everyone in Gaza. There are the as yet unknown consequences of subjecting Gaza's 700,000 children to a toxic water supply for years on end.

The siege robs 1.5 million people not just of basic goods, reconstruction supplies (virtually nothing has been rebuilt in Gaza), and access to medical care but of their basic rights and freedoms to travel, to study, to be part of the world. It robs promising young people of their ambitions and futures. It deprives the planet of all that they would have been able to create and offer. By cutting Gaza off from the outside world, Israel hopes to make us forget that the those inside are human.

Two years after the crime, Gaza remains a giant prison for a population whose unforgivable sin in the eyes of Israel and its allies is to be refugees from lands that Israel took by ethnic cleansing.


Israel's violence against Gaza, like its violence against Palestinians everywhere, is the logical outcome of the racism that forms the inseparable core of Zionist ideology and practice: Palestinians are merely a nuisance, like brush or rocks to be cleared away in Zionism's relentless conquest of the land. This is what all Palestinians are struggling against, as an open letter today from dozens of civil society organizations in Gaza reminds us:

"We Palestinians of Gaza want to live at liberty to meet Palestinian friends or family from Tulkarem, Jerusalem or Nazareth; we want to have the right to travel and move freely. We want to live without fear of another bombing campaign that leaves hundreds of our children dead and many more injured or with cancers from the contamination of Israel's white phosphorous and chemical warfare. We want to live without the humiliations at Israeli checkpoints or the indignity of not providing for our families because of the unemployment brought about by the economic control and the illegal siege. We are calling for an end to the racism that underpins all this oppression."

Those of us who live outside Gaza can look to the people there for inspiration and strength; even after all this deliberate cruelty, they have not surrendered. But we cannot expect them to bear this burden alone or ignore the appalling cost Israel's unrelenting persecution has on the minds and bodies of people in Gaza or on society itself. We must also heed their calls to action.

One year ago, I joined more than a thousand people from dozens of countries on the Gaza Freedom March in an attempt to reach Gaza to commemorate the first anniversary of the massacre. We found our way blocked by the Egyptian government which remains complicit, with US backing, in the Israeli siege. And although we did not reach Gaza, other convoys before, and after, such as Viva Palestina did, only after severe obstruction and limitations by Egypt.

Yesterday, the Mavi Marmara returned to Istanbul where it was met dockside by thousands of people. In May the ship was part of the Gaza Freedom Flotilla which set out to break the siege by sea, only to be attacked and hijacked in international waters by Israeli commandos who killed nine people and injured dozens. Even that massacre has not deterred more people from seeking to break the siege; the Asian Convoy to Gaza is on its way, and several other efforts are being planned.

We may look at all these initiatives and say that despite their enormous cost -- including in human lives -- the siege remains unbroken, as world governments -- the so-called "international community" -- continue to ensure Israeli impunity. Two years later, Gaza remains in rubble, and Israel keeps the population always on the edge of a deliberately-induced humanitarian catastrophe while allowing just enough supplies to appease international opinion. It would be easy to be discouraged.

However, we must remember that the Palestinian people in Gaza are not objects of an isolated humanitarian cause, but partners in the struggle for justice and freedom throughout Palestine. Breaking the siege of Gaza would be a milestone on that march.

Haneen Zoabi, a Palestinian member of the Israeli parliament and a passenger on the Mavi Marmara explained last October in an interview with The Electronic Intifada that Israeli society and government do not view their conflict with the Palestinians as one that must be resolved by providing justice and equality to victims, but merely as a "security" problem. Zoabi observed that the vast majority of Israelis believe Israel has largely "solved" the security problem: in the West Bank with the apartheid wall and "security coordination" between Israeli occupation forces and the collaborationist Palestinian Authority in Ramallah, and in Gaza with the siege.

Israeli society, Zoabi concluded, "doesn't feel the need for peace. They don't perceive occupation as a problem. They don't perceive the siege as a problem. They don't perceive oppressing the Palestinians as a problem, and they don't pay the price of occupation or the price of [the] siege [of Gaza]."

Thus the convoys and flotillas are an essential part of a larger effort to make Israel understand that it does have a problem and it can never be treated as a normal state until it ends its oppression and occupation of Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza Strip, and fully respects the rights of Palestinian citizens of Israel and Palestinian refugees. And even if governments continue to stand by and do nothing, global civil society is showing the way with these efforts to break the siege, and with the broader Palestinian-led campaign of boycott, divestment and sanctions (BDS).

Amid all the suffering, Palestinians have not celebrated many victories in the two years since the Gaza massacre. But there are signs that things are moving in the right direction. Israel begs for US-endorsed "peace negotiations" precisely because it knows that while the "peace process" provides cover for its ongoing crimes, it will never be required to give up anything or grant any rights to Palestinians in such a "process."

Yet Israel is mobilizing all its resources to fight the global movement for justice, especially BDS, that has gained so much momentum since the Gaza massacre. There can be no greater confirmation that this movement brings justice within our grasp. Our memorial to all the victims must not be just an annual commemoration, but the work we do every day to make the ranks of this movement grow.
No amount of AIPAC propaganda will ever succeed in negating the obvious injustice perpetrated by the Occupation of Palestine.


Of course, there is an alternative to terrorism. It's
called justice... Arundhati Roy
" The corporate grip on opinion in the United States
is one of the wonders of the Western world. No First
World country has ever managed to eliminate so
entirely from its media all objectivity - much less
dissent."
Gore Vidal

cnorman18

Post #4

Post by cnorman18 »

DeBunkem wrote:There is a world of difference between the the corrupt despotic oil sheiks that host multinational corporations and the Arab "Street," who know that Israel is no more interested in a just peace with Palestine than the old South was in Emancipation:
The Gaza Massacre And The Struggle For Justice
By Ali Abunimah

December 28, 2010 "Electronic Intifada" --
So much for showing any interest in peace and cooperation.

If I may quote a couple of other members --
JoeyKnothead and ChaosBorders wrote: May I ask why you continue to speak on a subject without bothering to refute the rebuttals that have already been presented? Simply ignoring or being dismissive of those who present counter evidence would be indicative that you have no actual interest in debating the issue.
A definition might be helpful here (emphasis added):
Propaganda is a form of communication that is aimed at influencing the attitude of a community toward some cause or position.

As opposed to impartially providing information, propaganda, in its most basic sense, presents information primarily to influence an audience. Propaganda often presents facts selectively (thus possibly lying by omission) to encourage a particular synthesis, or uses loaded messages to produce an emotional rather than rational response to the information presented. The desired result is a change of the attitude toward the subject in the target audience to further a political agenda. Propaganda can be used as a form of political warfare.
Of course, no one expects this member to bother to refute or rebut these observations either -- they will only be dismissed and ignored, like so many other cogent and on-point FACTS with which he has been presented; or else there will be a clumsy and easily disproven claim that others are guilty of these offenses without any attempt to show that he himself is not.

(yawn) So predictable, so obviously agenda-driven, so obviously hate-driven, and so obviously inflammatory and propagandistic -- and from a source that shares all the above characteristics:

From NGO Monisor's Electronic Intifada and Ali Abunimah Factsheet:
Ali Abunimah, co-founder and executive director of EI
•Abunimah is a leading advocate of the one-state solution. To actualize this, he says “coercion is necessary,� and dismisses Jewish concerns of living under an Arab majority as “irrational, racist fears.�
•He acknowledges that in a one-state solution “we couldn’t rule out some disastrous situation� for Jews.
•Labels PA President Mahmud Abbas and Prime Minister Salam Fayyad as “collaborators�, and PA participation in peace talks as “collaboration.� Collaboration is punishable by death in the PA and Gaza.
•In a conference in Madrid on the one-state solution, Abunimah refers to Peace Now as a “right-wing Zionist racist group� (Arab World Geographer, Vol 10, No 1, 2007).
•On his personal Twitter account, Abunimah accuses Israel of ethnic cleansing, calls Israeli settlements “Jim Crow colonies,� refers to the Shin Bet (Israel’s General Security Service) as a “death squad,� and calls people of color “schwarzers.�
•Says Zionism “is one of the worst forms of anti-Semitism in existence today,� claiming that it “dehumanizes its victims, denies their history, and has a cult-like worship of ethnoracial purity� (Twitter; October 26, 2010). He also wrote “That is something Zionism shares with anti-Semitism, a disdain for actual Jewish culture and life as it existed.�
•Refers to Israel’s self-defense policy in Gaza as an “attempted genocide.�
•Holocaust references appear frequently in his comments. He calls Gaza a “ghetto for surplus non-Jews,� compares the Israeli press to “Der Sturmer,� and claims “Supporting Zionism is not atonement for the Holocaust, but its continuation in spirit.� He calls Gaza a “concentration camp� and repeated a claim that IDF statements are the words “of a Nazi.�
•Publicized a pirated list of Israeli soldiers allegedly involved in the Gaza War, containing personal details such as home address and ID numbers. The list encourages “people to seek out other such similar information, it is readily available… inside public officials' locked cabinets.�
•Defends Hamas’ policy blocking ICRC visits to Israeli captive Gilad Shalit.
•Abunimah is a founding steering committee member of Al Awda, the Palestinian Right of Return Coalition.
....
Analysis of articles published in EI
•EI submissions use apartheid rhetoric, and accuse Israel of ethnic cleansing, Judaizing Jerusalem, and genocide.
•Laurie King-Irani, co-founder and contributing editor at EI, advocates using universal jurisdiction against Israeli officials in foreign courts. (In an updated version of the article she writes, “One day soon, they'll unplug that bastard Sharon, and flush.�)
•In an EI article, King-Irani claimed that the September 11 attacks were “the biggest gift, wrapped up in silk ribbons and presented on a golden platter, that [the pro-Israel lobby] could ever hope to receive. A real day of victory and glee for them to see that now they have the entire US populace in the palm of their hands.�
•Nigel Parry, co-founder of EI, justifies Palestinian violence against Israeli settlers, and draws a moral equivalency between Israeli counter-terrorism operations and Palestinian attacks against civilians, calling the targeting of Hamas founder Ahmed Yassin “Israel’s version of a bus bombing.�
•Parry calls for legal action against the American media, which promotes a “pervasive distortion� in favor of Israel, and calls Israel’s actions in Gaza an “ongoing genocide.�
•An article entitled “The Gaza genocide� (March 2, 2008) ccompares Israeli actions in Gaza to the Holocaust, describing them as “a slow and calculated genocide -- a genocide through more calibrated, long-term means... In many ways, this is a more sinister genocide, because it tends to be overlooked.�
•EI published a letter calling Hezbollah “hope and organization for those who are… watching Israelis hunt their children sick, watching US/Israel assassinate all good leaders,� and saying “Israel has lost its moral right to exist.�
The above does not constitute an ad hominem. DeBunkem dismisses and disparages sources because they are Jewish or Israeli; I provide factual information about the nature, record and tactics of his sources, as with my (unanswered) posts on Noam Chomsky and Human Rights Watch, not to mention the blatant racism and hatemongering of the viciously antisemitic websites he has used.

Whatever. One wonders if DeBunkem will EVER so much as ACKNOWLEDGE, never mind DEBATE, any of the following relevant, cogent, on-point and undisputed FACTS:

(1) The decades-long campaign of Palestinian attacks against unarmed civilians chosen as primary targets for mass murder

(2) The responsibility of the Palestinian terrorists for the deaths of Palestinian civilians due to their own inarguably criminal tactics

(3) The openly and explicitly stated, and never renounced, Palestinian goal of the total eradication of Israel and the extermination or expulsion of every Jew in the Mideast

(4) The decades of Government-sponsored and encouraged old-school Nazi-style anti-Semitic hate propaganda to which the Arab public is subjected, which includes Holocaust denial, claims of worldwide Jewish conspiracy, the promoting of the Protocols of the Elders of Zion as an authentic document, and even, incredibly, dramatizations of the notorious Blood Libel as factually true

(5) The explicit Palestinian goal of “ethnic cleansing� in order to establish a Judenrein Arab nation in the West Bank, and eventually from the Jordan to the sea

(6) The fact that very many Arabs never left Israel at the time of its founding, and many (20% of the Israeli population) live there in peace and freedom as full citizens to this day

(7) The factual record of endlessly repeated Israeli offers of “land for peace�

(8) The blatant and proven anti-Israel bias of the supposedly “unbiased� UN

(9) The blatant and proven anti-Israel bias of many supposedly “unbiased� NGOs

(10) The FACT that looking to mutually exclusive historical narratives of the past offers no solutions, only more endless conflict

Instead, we see, over and over and over again, nothing but Palestinian propaganda; reports from biased and agenda-driven organizations, fake and fabricated “quotes� clearly intended to inflame and promote hatred and resentment, inflammatory and fact-free propaganda cartoons, and even material from unsourced and unacknowledged anti-Semitic websites.

Perhaps DeBunkem’s steely determination never to allow these matters to be discussed accounts for his failure to respond to the posts of mine in the following ongoing, unfinished debates which he has apparently abandoned without further attempts at argument:

AIPAC spying on US

What I learned from a 1937 World Atlas -- or here, if you like.

Noam Chomsky: Agenda and Tactics

Argentina, Brazil, Uruguay Recognize Palestinian State

Justifying Israel (&ff.)

Israel and Palestine -- Whose Land Is It?

8 Reasons Leftists should be Pro-Israel

Question for DeBunkem

Are Jews “Unrightly� Occupying Israel?

Berserk Israeli Terrorist NOT a Racist?

That determination to ignore and disregard all the facts listed above might also account for his failure to address the topics of any of these threads, as well:

To the Chorus of Chronic, Compulsive Critics of Israel

Questions for Debate: Israel

Oh, to be an Ideologue (on the Left OR the Right)

Human Rights Watch: Bias and Agenda

Are These Events Relevant?


And the list grows longer and longer...

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