It's time for Obama to GO

[WinePusher]

I believe Obama is probably the most radical president in our nation's history, aside from Woodrow Wilson. Not only is his policy questionable, but his character and personal actions are troubling

-Why did this president bow to ver 5 world leaders
-Why did this president spend over 20 years at a church where the pastor spwed hate speech about America
-Why did this president place a communist and a mao se tung lover in his white house

many republicans have called this president a "Marxist" "Neocommunist" "Facist" "Socialist" "Extremist" I personally agree with every single one of these, but many call this hate speech

So the question is

1) Are the statements aganist Obama (ie: Marxist, Socialist) justifiable"

2) Can anyone justify the government take over of the banks, auto industry, student loan industry and the healthcare industry.

3) Is the media giving obama a free pass? Any rational person would agree the media was very hard on Palin but not so hard on Obama

[Wyvern]

1) Obama is no Marxist; he's more conservative than was the VERY conservative Bill Clinton,

The impeached rapist Clinton just seems more conservative when compared to the left-wing extemist Obama.

Last time I checked Clinton served out both terms of his presidency and has not been charged or tried on rape charges. Calling Obama a left wing extremist just shows you have never seen a left wing extremist.

and he's close to Bush in his conservativism.

Obama's deficit is four times Bush's, in a little over a year.

Go figure the guy that has to pick up the pieces after Bush's presidency has a larger deficit.

2) The government has the constitutional right to do what's in the interest of the people. The banks, auto industry, etc. were never "taken over" by the government, but bailed out by the government. Many of the institutions have paid back their debt to the government and are on their own again. Still, it's the government's duty to its people to keep an eye on business and to make any law it wants to control business.

The government can make any law it wants? I don't think so.

As long as it does not run counter to the constitution the government has the duty to regulate business in order to ensure competition and to protect consumers from predatory or unsafe practices. It should be noted that not long after the last of the regulations put in place after the great depression to regulate the financial sector were done away with that another nearly as great recession came about.

I prefer Sarah's accomplishments to Obama's rhetoric. At one time she was the most popular governor in the US. Governor is true management experience to be President, unlike Senator where you only have to speechify and vote, with little accountability. He does have a big mouth, but Obama's community organizing and two years in the Senate in no way qualified him to be President, as we are now seeing.

One of our greatest presidents and a republican, Abraham Lincoln served only one two year term in congress and before that served in the state house of Illinois. According to you one of if not the best president we have ever had was not qualified for the position of president.

[East of Eden]

Last time I checked Clinton served out both terms of his presidency and has not been charged or tried on rape charges.

Clinton was impeached by the house. Here's a list (partial?) of his sexual offenses:

Clinton Misogyny - Sex
Juanita Broaddrick (AR)- rape
Eileen Wellstone (Oxford) - rape
Elizabeth Ward Gracen - rape - quid pro quo, post incident intimidation
Regina Hopper Blakely - "forced himself on her, biting, bruising her"
Kathleen Willey (WH) - sexual assault, intimidations, threats
Sandra Allen James (DC) - sexual assault
22 Year Old 1972 (Yale) - sexual assault
Kathy Bradshaw (AK) - sexual assault
Cristy Zercher - unwelcomed sexual advance, intimidations
Paula Jones (AR) - unwelcomed sexual advance, exposure, bordering on sexual assault
Carolyn Moffet -unwelcomed sexual advance, exposure, bordering on sexual assault
1974 student at University of Arkansas - unwelcomed physical contact
1978-1980 - seven complaints per Arkansas state troopers
Monica Lewinsky - quid pro quo, post incident character assault
Gennifer Flowers - quid pro quo, post incident character assault
Dolly Kyle Browning - post incident character assault
Sally Perdue - post incident threats
Betty Dalton - rebuffed his advances, married to one of his supporters
Denise Reeder - apologetic note scanned

Not only was Clinton an adulterer and sexual predator, but he used the power of his office to silence his victims. If you support someone with no character like Clinton what does that say about your character?

Calling Obama a left wing extremist just shows you have never seen a left wing extremist.

You left wing extremists have to stick together.

Go figure the guy that has to pick up the pieces after Bush's presidency has a larger deficit.

You don't think the Democrats had any part? Who was it that was pushing banks to give home loans to unqualified borrowers in the name of 'fairness'?

As long as it does not run counter to the constitution the government has the duty to regulate business in order to ensure competition and to protect consumers from predatory or unsafe practices. It should be noted that not long after the last of the regulations put in place after the great depression to regulate the financial sector were done away with that another nearly as great recession came about.

Which has nothing to do with my statement that the government can't pass any law it wants to.

[micatala]

Moderator Intervention

Calling Obama a left wing extremist just shows you have never seen a left wing extremist.

You left wing extremists have to stick together.

Just a note to avoid personal comments regarding other posters.

[Wyvern]

Last time I checked Clinton served out both terms of his presidency and has not been charged or tried on rape charges.

Clinton was impeached by the house.

The house tried to impeach him but failed, if an impeachment is successful then that president loses his office. Clinton served out both of his terms so obviously he was not successfully impeached.

Not only was Clinton an adulterer and sexual predator, but he used the power of his office to silence his victims. If you support someone with no character like Clinton what does that say about your character?

Some of those charges are from before he had any position of power to use to silence his "victims", are you saying that even before he was president everyone knew he was going to be president and so he could use his future power to silence his contemporary victims. Is Clinton a time lord also?

Calling Obama a left wing extremist just shows you have never seen a left wing extremist.

You left wing extremists have to stick together.

Calling me a left wing extremist just shows you have absolutely no idea whatsoever what a left wing extremist is, but thank you for the insult all the same.

Go figure the guy that has to pick up the pieces after Bush's presidency has a larger deficit.

You don't think the Democrats had any part? Who was it that was pushing banks to give home loans to unqualified borrowers in the name of 'fairness'?

We have been over this many times already, repeating a false claim will not make it true. Also of course the point is you were complaining about Obama AGAIN and I merely pointed out how his deficit comes from having to recover from the mismanagement of the previous president.

As long as it does not run counter to the constitution the government has the duty to regulate business in order to ensure competition and to protect consumers from predatory or unsafe practices. It should be noted that not long after the last of the regulations put in place after the great depression to regulate the financial sector were done away with that another nearly as great recession came about.

Which has nothing to do with my statement that the government can't pass any law it wants to.

Sure it can with the constraints I have already listed, it has been shown a couple times now that without regulation of some sort the market will act in a way which will eventually cause it to self destruct.

[East of Eden]

The house tried to impeach him but failed, if an impeachment is successful then that president loses his office. Clinton served out both of his terms so obviously he was not successfully impeached.

Wrong, he was impeached by the House but not removed from office because the Senate did not.

Some of those charges are from before he had any position of power to use to silence his "victims", are you saying that even before he was president everyone knew he was going to be president and so he could use his future power to silence his contemporary victims. Is Clinton a time lord also?

Obviously, the power position was when he was AG, Governor, and POTUS.

We have been over this many times already, repeating a false claim will not make it true.

As I would say to you.

Also of course the point is you were complaining about Obama AGAIN and I merely pointed out how his deficit comes from having to recover from the mismanagement of the previous president.

The health-care induced trillion dollar expense had what to do with Bush?

Sure it can with the constraints I have already listed, it has been shown a couple times now that without regulation of some sort the market will act in a way which will eventually cause it to self destruct.

Nobody is arguing for no regulation, but government can harm us far more than corporations.

[Wyvern]

The house tried to impeach him but failed, if an impeachment is successful then that president loses his office. Clinton served out both of his terms so obviously he was not successfully impeached.

Wrong, he was impeached by the House but not removed from office because the Senate did not.

So you admit the impeachment did not make it through and he served out both of his presidential terms.

Some of those charges are from before he had any position of power to use to silence his "victims", are you saying that even before he was president everyone knew he was going to be president and so he could use his future power to silence his contemporary victims. Is Clinton a time lord also?

Obviously, the power position was when he was AG, Governor, and POTUS.

One of the supposed rapes happened during his time at Oxford another was in 1972 at Yale and yet another in '74 when he was still a student what power did he have then to silence anyone?

We have been over this many times already, repeating a false claim will not make it true.

As I would say to you.

What false claims have I made?

Also of course the point is you were complaining about Obama AGAIN and I merely pointed out how his deficit comes from having to recover from the mismanagement of the previous president.

The health-care induced trillion dollar expense had what to do with Bush?

Are you now trying to claim that the current deficit is exclusively from a health care bill that has been in effect for an extremely short time? The two wars and the mismanagement of the economy had absolutely nothing to do with our current deficit?

Sure it can with the constraints I have already listed, it has been shown a couple times now that without regulation of some sort the market will act in a way which will eventually cause it to self destruct.

Nobody is arguing for no regulation, but government can harm us far more than corporations.

It was the far right wing conservatives that were arguing for no regulations in the financial sector. They argued business can regulate itself and what happened when they got their way and were able to finally remove most of the regulations? The businesses acted in a way which nearly brought the world economy to its knees.

[East of Eden]

So you admit the impeachment did not make it through and he served out both of his presidential terms.

You're asking two different questions.

Impeachment of Bill Clinton
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopediaJump to:navigation, search

Floor proceedings of the U.S. Senate during the impeachment trial of President Bill Clinton in 1999, Chief Justice William H. Rehnquist presiding. House managers are seated beside the quarter-circular tables on the left and the president's personal counsel on the right.Bill Clinton, President of the United States, was impeached by the House of Representatives on December 19, 1998, and acquitted by the Senate on February 12, 1999. The charges, perjury, obstruction of justice, and malfeasance in office, arose from the Monica Lewinsky scandal and the Paula Jones lawsuit. The trial proceedings were largely partisan, with no Democratic Senators voting for conviction and only five Democratic Representatives voting to impeach. In all, 55 senators voted not guilty, and 45 voted guilty on the perjury charge. The Senate also acquitted on the charge of obstruction, with 50 votes cast as not guilty, and 50 votes as guilty.[1] It was only the second impeachment of a President in American history, following the impeachment of Andrew Johnson in 1868.

One of the supposed rapes happened during his time at Oxford another was in 1972 at Yale and yet another in '74 when he was still a student what power did he have then to silence anyone?

Do you deny he used his official power to silence and intimidate some of his victims?

Are you now trying to claim that the current deficit is exclusively from a health care bill that has been in effect for an extremely short time? The two wars and the mismanagement of the economy had absolutely nothing to do with our current deficit?

The mismanagement of the economy was bad which is why I dislike Chris Dodd and Barney Frank.

It was the far right wing conservatives that were arguing for no regulations in the financial sector. They argued business can regulate itself and what happened when they got their way and were able to finally remove most of the regulations? The businesses acted in a way which nearly brought the world economy to its knees.

Funny, according to this New York Times article Bush tried to rein in Fannie & Freddie but were opposed by congressional Democrats:

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/09/11/busin ... wanted=all

"Among the groups denouncing the proposal today were the National Association of Home Builders and Congressional Democrats who fear that tighter regulation of the companies could sharply reduce their commitment to financing low-income and affordable housing.

''These two entities -- Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac -- are not facing any kind of financial crisis,'' said Representative Barney Frank of Massachusetts, the ranking Democrat on the Financial Services Committee. ''The more people exaggerate these problems, the more pressure there is on these companies, the less we will see in terms of affordable housing.''

Representative Melvin L. Watt, Democrat of North Carolina, agreed.

''I don't see much other than a shell game going on here, moving something from one agency to another and in the process weakening the bargaining power of poorer families and their ability to get affordable housing,'' Mr. Watt said."

[Wyvern]

So you admit the impeachment did not make it through and he served out both of his presidential terms.

You're asking two different questions.

Impeachment of Bill Clinton
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopediaJump to:navigation, search

Floor proceedings of the U.S. Senate during the impeachment trial of President Bill Clinton in 1999, Chief Justice William H. Rehnquist presiding. House managers are seated beside the quarter-circular tables on the left and the president's personal counsel on the right.Bill Clinton, President of the United States, was impeached by the House of Representatives on December 19, 1998, and acquitted by the Senate on February 12, 1999. The charges, perjury, obstruction of justice, and malfeasance in office, arose from the Monica Lewinsky scandal and the Paula Jones lawsuit. The trial proceedings were largely partisan, with no Democratic Senators voting for conviction and only five Democratic Representatives voting to impeach. In all, 55 senators voted not guilty, and 45 voted guilty on the perjury charge. The Senate also acquitted on the charge of obstruction, with 50 votes cast as not guilty, and 50 votes as guilty.[1] It was only the second impeachment of a President in American history, following the impeachment of Andrew Johnson in 1868.

So you admit the impeachment did not go through which means he was not impeached and served the remainder of his term.

One of the supposed rapes happened during his time at Oxford another was in 1972 at Yale and yet another in '74 when he was still a student what power did he have then to silence anyone?

Do you deny he used his official power to silence and intimidate some of his victims?

I ask again what official powers did he have while a student at Yale and Oxford? You made claims of rape well before he had any more power than your average citizen.

Are you now trying to claim that the current deficit is exclusively from a health care bill that has been in effect for an extremely short time? The two wars and the mismanagement of the economy had absolutely nothing to do with our current deficit?

The mismanagement of the economy was bad which is why I dislike Chris Dodd and Barney Frank.

So you do not lay blame on the president that makes the economy bad but you do blame the president that has to pick up after the president that created the horrible situation in the first place. The president is ultimately responsible for what happens during his administration and refusing to lay blame squarely where it belongs with Bush is just sad.

It was the far right wing conservatives that were arguing for no regulations in the financial sector. They argued business can regulate itself and what happened when they got their way and were able to finally remove most of the regulations? The businesses acted in a way which nearly brought the world economy to its knees.

Funny, according to this New York Times article Bush tried to rein in Fannie & Freddie but were opposed by congressional Democrats:

The commoditization of home loans and the creation of the derivatives market did much more to cause the severe economic downturn. The loan originators no longer had any reason to deny loans based on ability to pay because they simply handed off the loans to bigger financial groups, as with any other unregulated financial you take away the risk and unrestricted greed will take over.

[East of Eden]

So you admit the impeachment did not go through which means he was not impeached and served the remainder of his term.

Reread the Wikipedia article. He was impeached by the House. I never claimed he was removed from office. You are confusing the issues.

I ask again what official powers did he have while a student at Yale and Oxford? You made claims of rape well before he had any more power than your average citizen.

When he raped Ms. Wiley he was either Attorney General of Gov. of AR.

So you do not lay blame on the president that makes the economy bad but you do blame the president that has to pick up after the president that created the horrible situation in the first place. The president is ultimately responsible for what happens during his administration and refusing to lay blame squarely where it belongs with Bush is just sad.

And yet you refuse to blame Obama over a year into his presidency. Obama acts like he's the first president to inherit problems. I don't recall Reagan whining about Carter as Obama classlessly does about Bush.

The commoditization of home loans and the creation of the derivatives market did much more to cause the severe economic downturn. The loan originators no longer had any reason to deny loans based on ability to pay because they simply handed off the loans to bigger financial groups, as with any other unregulated financial you take away the risk and unrestricted greed will take over.

Agreed, that was crazy, but so was the Democrat's urging banks to give loans to unqualified borrowers. The lenders were in a position where they could have been sued for discrimination or profiling if they turned anyone down, and consequenntly you had homeowners with no collateral and $30K in debt getting loans.

[Wyvern]

So you admit the impeachment did not go through which means he was not impeached and served the remainder of his term.

Reread the Wikipedia article. He was impeached by the House. I never claimed he was removed from office. You are confusing the issues.

No I am not confusing the issue the house voted to impeach him and the senate did not thus he was not impeached. If he was not removed from office that means he was not impeached, simple as that.

I ask again what official powers did he have while a student at Yale and Oxford? You made claims of rape well before he had any more power than your average citizen.

When he raped Ms. Wiley he was either Attorney General of Gov. of AR.

And again what was he when he supposedly raped women during his years at Yale and Oxford. Ignoring the issue does not make it go away, your claim simply does not follow. You provided a list of women Clinton supposedly raped over the years and then claimed due to his political power was able to avoid charges but a number of them happened before he had attained any elected office so if he had in fact raped these women how could he have avoided charges then?

So you do not lay blame on the president that makes the economy bad but you do blame the president that has to pick up after the president that created the horrible situation in the first place. The president is ultimately responsible for what happens during his administration and refusing to lay blame squarely where it belongs with Bush is just sad.

And yet you refuse to blame Obama over a year into his presidency. Obama acts like he's the first president to inherit problems. I don't recall Reagan whining about Carter as Obama classlessly does about Bush.

Most of what Obama has done has been in response to actions taken by Bush. Did Obama start two wars or cause the economy to collapse? Did Reagan inherit a couple of wars and a collapsed economy? The answer to both questions is no. Are you ready yet to lay blame for the state the economy is in on Bush where it belongs or are you going to continue to blame those that come after just as you have blamed FDR for the great depression.

Agreed, that was crazy, but so was the Democrat's urging banks to give loans to unqualified borrowers. The lenders were in a position where they could have been sued for discrimination or profiling if they turned anyone down, and consequenntly you had homeowners with no collateral and $30K in debt getting loans.

It was worse than that, the lenders had no cares whether the loans would be paid off or not, after they made the loan larger financial institutions then bought out the loans in order to turn them into a commodity and to make it more profitable they needed an ever increasing number of loans which is why by the end the majority of subprime loans were not even made by any kind of financial institution.