Spiritual Israel, or 144,000 Jews?

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Spiritual Israel, or 144,000 Jews?

Post #1

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My question is, “Who are the 144,000?
Following is Jehovah’s promise to his people, Israel:

Ezekiel 37:21-28, "Thus saith the LORD God; Behold, I will take the children of Israel from among the heathen (Gentile nations) whither they are gone, and will gather them on every side, and bring them into their own land: (May 14, 1948) I will make them (12 Tribes) one nation --- they all shall have one shepherd (Jesus), they shall also walk in my judgments, and observe my statutes, -----I (the LORD) will make a covenant of peace with them; it shall be an everlasting covenant --- And the nations shall know that I the LORD do sanctify Israel, when my sanctuary shall be in the midst of them for evermore."

A 7-year covenant of peace with Israel fulfills Daniel 9:27, Jesus is the covenant, and the messenger of the covenant.

Scriptures contain 29 lists of the 12 tribes of Israel in both the Old and New Testaments. Never are more than 12 tribes mentioned. When one tribe is left out, another is inserted, usually the tribe of Levi. From Levi came the priest.

Revelation 7 mentions 12 tribes numbering 144,000. Is there any justification for spiritualizing the number or the names of the tribes in these passages? Never in scripture are the 12 tribes represented as the church.
In Genesis 32:28, the Lord changes Jacob’s name to Israel. Jacob his earthly name, Israel his heavenly name. The 12 sons of Jacob were born of four mothers, Jacob being the common father. Leah and Rachel were Jacob’s wives, and Bilhah and Zilpah were his concubines.

In Exodus 28:21-29, 39:14, the 12 tribes were on the breastplate of the high priest, twelve precious stones arranged in four rows, each name engraved on a stone.

Raëlism, states that the chosen people, 144,000 will continue humanity in case of a disaster.
Jehovah’s Witnesses claim to be spiritual Israel.
Mormons believe they are the 144,000

So, what is the truth?

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Re: Spiritual Israel, or 144,000 Jews?

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Post by placebofactor »

placebofactor wrote: Sat Feb 01, 2025 4:48 pm My question is, “Who are the 144,000?
Following is Jehovah’s promise to his people, Israel:

Ezekiel 37:21-28, "Thus saith the LORD God; Behold, I will take the children of Israel from among the heathen (Gentile nations) whither they are gone, and will gather them on every side, and bring them into their own land: (May 14, 1948) I will make them (12 Tribes) one nation --- they all shall have one shepherd (Jesus), they shall also walk in my judgments, and observe my statutes, -----I (the LORD) will make a covenant of peace with them; it shall be an everlasting covenant --- And the nations shall know that I the LORD do sanctify Israel, when my sanctuary shall be in the midst of them for evermore."

A 7-year covenant of peace with Israel fulfills Daniel 9:27, Jesus is the covenant, and the messenger of the covenant.

Scriptures contain 29 lists of the 12 tribes of Israel in both the Old and New Testaments. Never are more than 12 tribes mentioned. When one tribe is left out, another is inserted, usually the tribe of Levi. From Levi came the priest.

Revelation 7 mentions 12 tribes numbering 144,000. Is there any justification for spiritualizing the number or the names of the tribes in these passages? Never in scripture are the 12 tribes represented as the church.
In Genesis 32:28, the Lord changes Jacob’s name to Israel. Jacob his earthly name, Israel his heavenly name. The 12 sons of Jacob were born of four mothers, Jacob being the common father. Leah and Rachel were Jacob’s wives, and Bilhah and Zilpah were his concubines.

In Exodus 28:21-29, 39:14, the 12 tribes were on the breastplate of the high priest, twelve precious stones arranged in four rows, each name engraved on a stone.

Raëlism, states that the chosen people, 144,000 will continue humanity in case of a disaster.
Jehovah’s Witnesses claim to be spiritual Israel.
Mormons believe they are the 144,000

So, what is the truth?
Today, there are approximately 7,000,000 Jews living in Israel: Worldwide, there are approximately 15,000,000 Jews. Their growth is much lower than other populations, rising only .2% each year.
Scripture speaks of a small remnant that has always been set aside for Jehovah’s purposes. We know the LORD saved only eight from the flood.

Isaiah 1:9, “Except the LORD of hosts had left unto us (the Jews) a very small remnant, we should have been as Sodom, and we should have been like unto Gomorra (completely destroyed).”

1 Kings 19:14, Elijah said to the LORD, “I, even I only, am left; and they (Jezebel’s people) seek my life, to take it away.” The LORD replied, verse 18, “I have left me (for myself) seven thousand in Israel.” It is estimated the remnant was about one-tenth of one present.

Isaiah 10:22, “For though your (Isaiah’s) people Israel be as the sand of the sea, yet a remnant of them shall return:”

On May 13th, 2025, Israel will complete 77 years of statehood. Matthew 24:34, tells us "This generation will not pass, until all these things are fulfilled." In May of 2028, the generation will be 80 years old.

Revelation 7:1 reads, “I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree.” Verse 3, “Hurt not the earth neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads.”

The wording is clear in Revelation 7 and 14. One hundred and forty-four thousand will receive God’s seal on their foreheads before the Great Tribulation begins. 12,000 Jews from each of the 12 tribes of Israel shall be sealed; total # sealed, 144,000.

Revelation tells us they will be gathered from the earth. They will carry the seal of God on their foreheads. Once they are marked, going into the Tribulation, the world will know who they are, and who sent them. I also believe, like the mark God gave Cain, no man will be able to kill them. I understand they will work hand and hand with God's two Witnesses. What will they be doing? They will finish what Jesus started. Jesus finished
3 1/2 years of the new covenant he brought with him. The 144,000 will bring their testimony to the Gentile nations. They will go throughout the earth with the gospel of Jesus Christ. The two Witnesses will give their testimony to the Jews in Israel I believe on Mt. Moriah, alongside the abomination of desolation, the Dome of the Rock. As long as the witnesses of God are alive, the antichrist and his armies will not have the power to overthrow the Jews. But when the two are killed and taken to heaven, death and hell will be turned loose upon the earth and the wrath of God will be known and felt by every living creature on earth.

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Re: Spiritual Israel, or 144,000 Jews?

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placebofactor wrote: Sat Feb 01, 2025 4:48 pm My question is, “Who are the 144,000?
Following is Jehovah’s promise to his people, Israel:

Ezekiel 37:21-28, "Thus saith the LORD God; Behold, I will take the children of Israel from among the heathen (Gentile nations) whither they are gone, and will gather them on every side, and bring them into their own land: (May 14, 1948) I will make them (12 Tribes) one nation --- they all shall have one shepherd (Jesus), they shall also walk in my judgments, and observe my statutes, -----I (the LORD) will make a covenant of peace with them; it shall be an everlasting covenant --- And the nations shall know that I the LORD do sanctify Israel, when my sanctuary shall be in the midst of them for evermore."

A 7-year covenant of peace with Israel fulfills Daniel 9:27, Jesus is the covenant, and the messenger of the covenant.

Scriptures contain 29 lists of the 12 tribes of Israel in both the Old and New Testaments. Never are more than 12 tribes mentioned. When one tribe is left out, another is inserted, usually the tribe of Levi. From Levi came the priest.

Revelation 7 mentions 12 tribes numbering 144,000. Is there any justification for spiritualizing the number or the names of the tribes in these passages? Never in scripture are the 12 tribes represented as the church.
In Genesis 32:28, the Lord changes Jacob’s name to Israel. Jacob his earthly name, Israel his heavenly name. The 12 sons of Jacob were born of four mothers, Jacob being the common father. Leah and Rachel were Jacob’s wives, and Bilhah and Zilpah were his concubines.

In Exodus 28:21-29, 39:14, the 12 tribes were on the breastplate of the high priest, twelve precious stones arranged in four rows, each name engraved on a stone.

Raëlism, states that the chosen people, 144,000 will continue humanity in case of a disaster.
Jehovah’s Witnesses claim to be spiritual Israel.
Mormons believe they are the 144,000

So, what is the truth?
Well it's not the Mormons' belief. They say that God had sex with Mary like any other sex act to produce a son. Anything they believe is tainted and spurious, coming from the imagination of some troublesome charlatan who made up stories by putting his face in a hat behind a screen.

I haven't heard of Raelism but where would proponents of that get the idea that the 144,000 would need to "continue humanity in case of disaster"? There won't be any disasters in Paradise.

For an excellent precis on the subject of the 144,000 see Insight on the Scriptures, Vol.I, p.1234 under the "Israel of God." I would like your thoughts on the article. (I'm sure you can get a copy from your relatives.)

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Re: Spiritual Israel, or 144,000 Jews?

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placebofactor wrote: Sat Feb 01, 2025 4:48 pm My question is, “Who are the 144,000?
...
So, what is the truth?
And I heard the number of those having been sealed: one hundred forty four thousands, having been sealed out of every tribe of the sons of Israel:
Rev. 7:4
And I said to him, Sir, you know. And he said to me, These are those coming out of the great tribulation; and they washed their robes and whitened them in the blood of the Lamb.
Rev. 7:14
And they sing as a new song before the throne, and before the four living creatures and the elders. And no one was able to learn the song except the hundred and forty four thousands, those having been redeemed from the earth. These are the ones who were not defiled with women, for they are virgins. These are the ones following the Lamb wherever He may go. These were redeemed from among men as a firstfruit to God and to the Lamb. And no guile was found in their mouth, for they are without blemish before the throne of God.
Rev. 14:3-5
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Re: Spiritual Israel, or 144,000 Jews?

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Post by placebofactor »

onewithhim wrote: Sun Feb 02, 2025 6:38 pm
placebofactor wrote: Sat Feb 01, 2025 4:48 pm My question is, “Who are the 144,000?
Following is Jehovah’s promise to his people, Israel:

Ezekiel 37:21-28, "Thus saith the LORD God; Behold, I will take the children of Israel from among the heathen (Gentile nations) whither they are gone, and will gather them on every side, and bring them into their own land: (May 14, 1948) I will make them (12 Tribes) one nation --- they all shall have one shepherd (Jesus), they shall also walk in my judgments, and observe my statutes, -----I (the LORD) will make a covenant of peace with them; it shall be an everlasting covenant --- And the nations shall know that I the LORD do sanctify Israel, when my sanctuary shall be in the midst of them for evermore."

A 7-year covenant of peace with Israel fulfills Daniel 9:27, Jesus is the covenant, and the messenger of the covenant.

Scriptures contain 29 lists of the 12 tribes of Israel in both the Old and New Testaments. Never are more than 12 tribes mentioned. When one tribe is left out, another is inserted, usually the tribe of Levi. From Levi came the priest.

Revelation 7 mentions 12 tribes numbering 144,000. Is there any justification for spiritualizing the number or the names of the tribes in these passages? Never in scripture are the 12 tribes represented as the church.
In Genesis 32:28, the Lord changes Jacob’s name to Israel. Jacob his earthly name, Israel his heavenly name. The 12 sons of Jacob were born of four mothers, Jacob being the common father. Leah and Rachel were Jacob’s wives, and Bilhah and Zilpah were his concubines.

In Exodus 28:21-29, 39:14, the 12 tribes were on the breastplate of the high priest, twelve precious stones arranged in four rows, each name engraved on a stone.

Raëlism, states that the chosen people, 144,000 will continue humanity in case of a disaster.
Jehovah’s Witnesses claim to be spiritual Israel.
Mormons believe they are the 144,000

So, what is the truth?
You wrote, "Well it's not the Mormons' belief. They say that God had sex with Mary like any other sex act to produce a son."

You're correct; they teach the American Indians are the 144,000, but I'm not sure they still do. That's what happens with the cults, they're all over the map.

You wrote, "I haven't heard of Raelism but where would proponents of that get the idea that the 144,000 would need to "continue humanity in case of disaster"?

No, no, the 144,000 are not going to continue humanity in case of disaster. They will be doing the Lord's work. They with the two witnesses will finish confirming the Lord's new covenant with the Jews during the "Time of Jacobs trouble " My understanding is based on Revelation 14:4, "These (the 144,000) were redeemed from among men, being the first fruits unto God (the Father) and the Lamb (Jesus)."

There can only be one first fruit of a harvest; it was picked in Matthew 27:52-53, The graves of the ancient Jews were opened, and many (like the sand of the sea) who were dead were raised to life. This Greek word many is interesting. It's counted as the blades of grass in a field, or sand in the sea, therefore easily, 144,000 Jews were raised unto the Father and to the Lamb.

When? Verse 53, "After" (Jesus) was resurrected. What did they do? "They walked into the holy city (Jerusalem) and were witnessed by many."

You wrote, "There won't be any disasters in Paradise."

Not talking about Paradise or the 1000-year reign of Jesus Christ. The work of the 144,000 will be in the period called the Great Tribulation. How long? 3 1/2 years. When the 3 1/2 years is over, they will be called by Jesus Christ on Mt. Zion in Israel, not in heaven.

For an excellent precis on the subject of the 144,000 see Insight on the Scriptures, Vol.I, p.1234 under the "Israel of God." I would like your thoughts on the article. (I'm sure you can get a copy from your relatives.)
I'll take a look at it and get back to you shortly.

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Re: Spiritual Israel, or 144,000 Jews?

Post #6

Post by placebofactor »

placebofactor wrote: Mon Feb 03, 2025 10:06 am
onewithhim wrote: Sun Feb 02, 2025 6:38 pm
placebofactor wrote: Sat Feb 01, 2025 4:48 pm My question is, “Who are the 144,000?
Following is Jehovah’s promise to his people, Israel:

Ezekiel 37:21-28, "Thus saith the LORD God; Behold, I will take the children of Israel from among the heathen (Gentile nations) whither they are gone, and will gather them on every side, and bring them into their own land: (May 14, 1948) I will make them (12 Tribes) one nation --- they all shall have one shepherd (Jesus), they shall also walk in my judgments, and observe my statutes, -----I (the LORD) will make a covenant of peace with them; it shall be an everlasting covenant --- And the nations shall know that I the LORD do sanctify Israel, when my sanctuary shall be in the midst of them for evermore."

A 7-year covenant of peace with Israel fulfills Daniel 9:27, Jesus is the covenant, and the messenger of the covenant.

Scriptures contain 29 lists of the 12 tribes of Israel in both the Old and New Testaments. Never are more than 12 tribes mentioned. When one tribe is left out, another is inserted, usually the tribe of Levi. From Levi came the priest.

Revelation 7 mentions 12 tribes numbering 144,000. Is there any justification for spiritualizing the number or the names of the tribes in these passages? Never in scripture are the 12 tribes represented as the church.
In Genesis 32:28, the Lord changes Jacob’s name to Israel. Jacob his earthly name, Israel his heavenly name. The 12 sons of Jacob were born of four mothers, Jacob being the common father. Leah and Rachel were Jacob’s wives, and Bilhah and Zilpah were his concubines.

In Exodus 28:21-29, 39:14, the 12 tribes were on the breastplate of the high priest, twelve precious stones arranged in four rows, each name engraved on a stone.

Raëlism, states that the chosen people, 144,000 will continue humanity in case of a disaster.
Jehovah’s Witnesses claim to be spiritual Israel.
Mormons believe they are the 144,000

So, what is the truth?
You wrote, "Well it's not the Mormons' belief. They say that God had sex with Mary like any other sex act to produce a son."

You're correct; they teach the American Indians are the 144,000, but I'm not sure they still do. That's what happens with the cults, they're all over the map.

You wrote, "I haven't heard of Raelism but where would proponents of that get the idea that the 144,000 would need to "continue humanity in case of disaster"?

No, no, the 144,000 are not going to continue humanity in case of disaster. They will be doing the Lord's work. They with the two witnesses will finish confirming the Lord's new covenant with the Jews during the "Time of Jacobs trouble " My understanding is based on Revelation 14:4, "These (the 144,000) were redeemed from among men, being the first fruits unto God (the Father) and the Lamb (Jesus)."

There can only be one first fruit of a harvest; it was picked in Matthew 27:52-53, The graves of the ancient Jews were opened, and many (like the sand of the sea) who were dead were raised to life. This Greek word many is interesting. It's counted as the blades of grass in a field, or sand in the sea, therefore easily, 144,000 Jews were raised unto the Father and to the Lamb.

When? Verse 53, "After" (Jesus) was resurrected. What did they do? "They walked into the holy city (Jerusalem) and were witnessed by many."

You wrote, "There won't be any disasters in Paradise."

Not talking about Paradise or the 1000-year reign of Jesus Christ. The work of the 144,000 will be in the period called the Great Tribulation. How long? 3 1/2 years. When the 3 1/2 years are over, they will be called by Jesus Christ on Mt. Zion in Israel, not in heaven.

For an excellent precis on the subject of the 144,000 see Insight on the Scriptures, Vol.I, p.1234 under the "Israel of God." I would like your thoughts on the article. (I'm sure you can get a copy from your relatives.)
I'll take a look at it and get back to you shortly.
I checked it out. I disagree with the article on many points, it's written only to support the Witness's teaching of a Spiritual Israel. Here's the issue I have with this Spiritual Israel matter. The phrase Spiritual Israel is not in the Bible. Read these carefully and consider the end of each of the following in black.

Joel wrote between 770-725 B.C.
Joel 3:1-7-20, "Behold, in those days, and in that time, when I (God) shall bring again the captivity of Judah and Jerusalem ... I will raise them out of the place whither ye have sold them ... Judah (Israel) shall dwell forever, and Jerusalem from generation to generation."

Amos was written between 767-740 B.C.
Amos 9:14-15, "I (God) will bring again the captivity of my people of Israel, and they shall build the waste cities, and inhabit them ...And I will plant them upon their land, and they (the Jews) shall no more be pulled up out of their land which I have given them, saith the LORD thy God."

When Jerusalem and the temple were destroyed in 70 A.D. over a million Jews were murdered and 90,000 taken captives. But millions of others remained in the land.

The Zionist movement began in 1881 when Jewish immigrants called (Olim in Hebrew) began to return to Palestine. The successive waves of immigrants to Palestine were known as Aliyah, meaning "to ascend," or "to go up."

The first Aliyah was between 1881 and 1903 when 70,000 Jews returned. The second came between 1904 and 1914, and the third between 1919 and 1923 when thousands more arrived. The 4th between 1924 and 1931, 230,000 (most were fleeing Nazi Germany) immigrated to Palestine. By 1946 there were 678,000 Jews in Palestine.

From 1881 until 1948, Jews purchased thousands of square miles of land in Eretz Israel from Arab landowners who were anxious to sell it. The Arabs thought they were exploiting the Jews by selling them desolate, desert land that was considered worthless. One man called Yehoshua Hankin purchased 150,000 acres of land for Jewish settlements. The Arabs who sold them the land did not realize until it was too late that they had helped lay the foundation for the restoration of the Jewish state.

Here's the good part. By 1948 much of what is today known as Israel had been bought and paid for with Jewish money. On May 14, 1948, the Jewish National Council proclaimed the birth of the modern state of Israel. It was the first time a sovereign Jewish state had existed in Palestine in 3,500 years. Another promise was made to the Jews; Palestine was renamed Israel.

I believe all the above was an act of God, done for the sake of fulfilling his promises to the Jews, and glorifying his name through fulfilled prophesy.

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Re: Spiritual Israel, or 144,000 Jews?

Post #7

Post by onewithhim »

placebofactor wrote: Mon Feb 03, 2025 10:06 am
onewithhim wrote: Sun Feb 02, 2025 6:38 pm
placebofactor wrote: Sat Feb 01, 2025 4:48 pm My question is, “Who are the 144,000?
Following is Jehovah’s promise to his people, Israel:

Ezekiel 37:21-28, "Thus saith the LORD God; Behold, I will take the children of Israel from among the heathen (Gentile nations) whither they are gone, and will gather them on every side, and bring them into their own land: (May 14, 1948) I will make them (12 Tribes) one nation --- they all shall have one shepherd (Jesus), they shall also walk in my judgments, and observe my statutes, -----I (the LORD) will make a covenant of peace with them; it shall be an everlasting covenant --- And the nations shall know that I the LORD do sanctify Israel, when my sanctuary shall be in the midst of them for evermore."

A 7-year covenant of peace with Israel fulfills Daniel 9:27, Jesus is the covenant, and the messenger of the covenant.

Scriptures contain 29 lists of the 12 tribes of Israel in both the Old and New Testaments. Never are more than 12 tribes mentioned. When one tribe is left out, another is inserted, usually the tribe of Levi. From Levi came the priest.

Revelation 7 mentions 12 tribes numbering 144,000. Is there any justification for spiritualizing the number or the names of the tribes in these passages? Never in scripture are the 12 tribes represented as the church.
In Genesis 32:28, the Lord changes Jacob’s name to Israel. Jacob his earthly name, Israel his heavenly name. The 12 sons of Jacob were born of four mothers, Jacob being the common father. Leah and Rachel were Jacob’s wives, and Bilhah and Zilpah were his concubines.

In Exodus 28:21-29, 39:14, the 12 tribes were on the breastplate of the high priest, twelve precious stones arranged in four rows, each name engraved on a stone.

Raëlism, states that the chosen people, 144,000 will continue humanity in case of a disaster.
Jehovah’s Witnesses claim to be spiritual Israel.
Mormons believe they are the 144,000

So, what is the truth?
You wrote, "Well it's not the Mormons' belief. They say that God had sex with Mary like any other sex act to produce a son."

You're correct; they teach the American Indians are the 144,000, but I'm not sure they still do. That's what happens with the cults, they're all over the map.

You wrote, "I haven't heard of Raelism but where would proponents of that get the idea that the 144,000 would need to "continue humanity in case of disaster"?

No, no, the 144,000 are not going to continue humanity in case of disaster. They will be doing the Lord's work. They with the two witnesses will finish confirming the Lord's new covenant with the Jews during the "Time of Jacobs trouble " My understanding is based on Revelation 14:4, "These (the 144,000) were redeemed from among men, being the first fruits unto God (the Father) and the Lamb (Jesus)."

There can only be one first fruit of a harvest; it was picked in Matthew 27:52-53, The graves of the ancient Jews were opened, and many (like the sand of the sea) who were dead were raised to life. This Greek word many is interesting. It's counted as the blades of grass in a field, or sand in the sea, therefore easily, 144,000 Jews were raised unto the Father and to the Lamb.
Jesus was the "first fruit" of the harvest. Not the ancient Jews. No one was resurrected until after Jesus was. That scripture in Matthew is very hard to understand, if you go back to the original Greek language you can see it is not clear what happened. I think that my understanding has as much import as your understanding. "The memorial tombs were opened and many bodies of the holy ones that had fallen asleep wereraised up," or as the KJV puts it: "And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose." This means that the earthquake was so strong that bodies of the saints were thrown up out of their graves...still dead. People passing by saw them and went into the city to report what they saw. That's what I get out of it. What else can one get out of the verses?---literally: "and the earth was shaken and the rocks were torn and the tombs were opened and many bodies of the having fallen asleep saints were raised and coming forth out of the tombs after the rising of Him entered into the holy city and were manifested to many." Basically word-for-word from an Interlinear Bible. It's a bit confusing isn't it? Well as I said, no one was resurrected (to rule with Christ in heaven) until after Jesus' own resurrection. There was no reason to resurrect anybody at that time.

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Re: Spiritual Israel, or 144,000 Jews?

Post #8

Post by JehovahsWitness »

placebofactor wrote: Mon Feb 03, 2025 11:05 amThe phrase Spiritual Israel is not in the Bible.
But the teaching /the idea **IS** ...
ROMANS 2: 28, 29

For he is not a Jew who is one on the outside, nor is circumcision something on the outside, on the flesh. But he is -- > a Jew <---who is one on the inside, and his circumcision is that of the heart --- > by spirit < --- and not by a written code.
GALATIANS 6:16
... all those who walk orderly by this rule of conduct, peace and mercy be upon them, yes, upon the Israel of God..
GALATIANS 3:27-29

.... There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor freeman,+ there is neither male nor female,+ for you are all one in union with Christ Jesus. Moreover, if you belong to Christ, you are really Abraham’s offspring , heirs with reference to a promise.
1 PETER 2:5
... you yourselves as living stones are being built up into a spiritual house to be a holy priesthood...
JEHOVAH'S WITNESS


To learn more please go to other posts related to...

GOD'S KINGDOM , THE 144, 000 and .... SPIRITUAL ISRAEL
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Re: Spiritual Israel, or 144,000 Jews?

Post #9

Post by placebofactor »

JehovahsWitness wrote: Mon Feb 03, 2025 7:41 pm
placebofactor wrote: Mon Feb 03, 2025 11:05 amThe phrase Spiritual Israel is not in the Bible.
But the teaching /the idea **IS** ...
ROMANS 2: 28, 29

For he is not a Jew who is one on the outside, nor is circumcision something on the outside, on the flesh. But he is -- > a Jew <---who is one on the inside, and his circumcision is that of the heart --- > by spirit < --- and not by a written code.
GALATIANS 6:16
... all those who walk orderly by this rule of conduct, peace and mercy be upon them, yes, upon the Israel of God..
GALATIANS 3:27-29

I don't believe you understand the meaning of the verse. Circumcision concerned only the Jewish population, not Gentiles. Paul was in Galatia the land of the Gentile, where the inhabitants were either Jews or new converts. Weak, or new Christians were easily swayed, so Paul was warning them against the Jews who were telling Christian Jews and Gentiles to get circumcised in their flesh, to save them from persecution.

.... There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor freeman,+ there is neither male nor female,+ for you are all one in union with Christ Jesus. Moreover, if you belong to Christ, you are really Abraham’s offspring , heirs with reference to a promise.
1 PETER 2:5
... you yourselves as living stones are being built up into a spiritual house to be a holy priesthood...
Correct, I do not disagree with you, the verse is speaking about the church, consisting of Jews and Gentiles in Christ Jesus.

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GOD'S KINGDOM , THE 144, 000 and .... SPIRITUAL ISRAEL

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Re: Spiritual Israel, or 144,000 Jews?

Post #10

Post by onewithhim »

placebofactor wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 4:11 pm
JehovahsWitness wrote: Mon Feb 03, 2025 7:41 pm
placebofactor wrote: Mon Feb 03, 2025 11:05 amThe phrase Spiritual Israel is not in the Bible.
But the teaching /the idea **IS** ...
ROMANS 2: 28, 29

For he is not a Jew who is one on the outside, nor is circumcision something on the outside, on the flesh. But he is -- > a Jew <---who is one on the inside, and his circumcision is that of the heart --- > by spirit < --- and not by a written code.
GALATIANS 6:16
... all those who walk orderly by this rule of conduct, peace and mercy be upon them, yes, upon the Israel of God..
GALATIANS 3:27-29

I don't believe you understand the meaning of the verse. Circumcision concerned only the Jewish population, not Gentiles. Paul was in Galatia the land of the Gentile, where the inhabitants were either Jews or new converts. Weak, or new Christians were easily swayed, so Paul was warning them against the Jews who were telling Christian Jews and Gentiles to get circumcised in their flesh, to save them from persecution.

.... There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor freeman,+ there is neither male nor female,+ for you are all one in union with Christ Jesus. Moreover, if you belong to Christ, you are really Abraham’s offspring , heirs with reference to a promise.
1 PETER 2:5
... you yourselves as living stones are being built up into a spiritual house to be a holy priesthood...
Correct, I do not disagree with you, the verse is speaking about the church, consisting of Jews and Gentiles in Christ Jesus.

JEHOVAH'S WITNESS


To learn more please go to other posts related to...

GOD'S KINGDOM , THE 144, 000 and .... SPIRITUAL ISRAEL
Placebofactor, so there IS mention of a spiritual Israel in the Bible. And this spiritual Israel is the Christian congregation, fully dedicated to Jehovah God and Jesus Christ. Peter was writing to Christians when he penned IPeter 2:5. He went on:

"But you are a 'chosen race,' a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people for special possession....For you were once not a people, but are now God's people." (IPeter 2:9,10)

So if you read all of IPeter 2:4-10 you will see that there certainly is a spiritual house.

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