Why God sent Jesus on earth?

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gospel
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Why God sent Jesus on earth?

Post #1

Post by gospel »

For God so greatly loved and dearly prized the world that He [even] gave up His only begotten (unique) Son, so that whoever believes in (trusts in, clings to, relies on) Him shall not perish (come to destruction, be lost) but have eternal (everlasting) life.

redstang281
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Post #11

Post by redstang281 »

The Bible shows that very thing. "Let us make man after our image and after Our likeness." Almost every religion in the history of human beings show that god or gods come in recognizeable forms. Even the children of the raven cry out to God when they are hunger[y].

We do tend to make gods after our own image, don't we.
Not always, what about all the ancient cultures that worshipped a deity based off an animal or solar object?

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McCulloch
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Post #12

Post by McCulloch »

McCulloch wrote:The Bible shows that very thing. "Let us make man after our image and after Our likeness." Almost every religion in the history of human beings show that god or gods come in recognizeable forms. Even the children of the raven cry out to God when they are hunger[y].
We do tend to make gods after our own image, don't we.
redstang281 wrote:Not always, what about all the ancient cultures that worshipped a deity based off an animal or solar object?
Certainly true. Religion and our view of the supernatural has evolved.
Examine everything carefully; hold fast to that which is good.
First Epistle to the Church of the Thessalonians
The truth will make you free.
Gospel of John

redstang281
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Post #13

Post by redstang281 »

AlAyeti wrote:
The world does not look like a story in Buddhist writings. Does it?
The Buddhists seem to think it does. Does the world look like the story in the Christian writings?

I think that it does. Just to name a few....

Science shows that all humanity descended from one woman which they refer to as Mitochondrion Eve. The Bible says Eve is the mother of all living.

DNA is much more complex then anything that could ever be written in a computer program yet we are supposed to believe no one designed it. The Bible says God created all life.

The entire earth is built up of layers of rocks and other formations that show signs of a flood in addition to all the fossil (fossils are formed from rapid burial). The Bible says there was a great flood across the entire world.

The Jews have been hated and persecuted throughout history. They've been taken out of their homeland and restored back. The Bible predicts it all.

Little children seem to learn on their own to lie, steal, and otherwise misbehavior. Parents typically don't teach those qualities. The Bible says man kind if born with a sinful nature.

The gospel is changing lives all over the world and Christianity is still around. The Bible predicts this as well.

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Post #14

Post by redstang281 »

McCulloch wrote:
McCulloch wrote:The Bible shows that very thing. "Let us make man after our image and after Our likeness." Almost every religion in the history of human beings show that god or gods come in recognizeable forms. Even the children of the raven cry out to God when they are hunger[y].
We do tend to make gods after our own image, don't we.
redstang281 wrote:Not always, what about all the ancient cultures that worshipped a deity based off an animal or solar object?
Certainly true. Religion and our view of the supernatural has evolved.
I wouldn't put it that way. Judaism, which is essentially Christianity clothed, has the same basic principals from the earliest texts to the latest. Even secularly Judaism is one of the oldest established faiths. Not only that but many ancient religions based on "more primitive" deities are still around.

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Bro Dave
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Post #15

Post by Bro Dave »

redstang281 wrote:
The message is Love. No problem there.
You're right God is love but because of that he also has hate for sin. A Holy God can not tolerate sin so it must be dealt with.
God has no limitations as to what He "can tolerate". Certainly condemming ALL of mankind for ETERNITY, for some stupid supposed infraction by very finite mortals, whom He created, understanding full well, the very frail nature He gave us. No, that kind of vendictive nonsense is mortal man imposing how we think on our loving Father.
But, God has an INFINITE capability to Love, and the reason he sent Jesus, was not to be slaughtered so He, God, could get past some VERY finite "sin" of some VERY remote ancestor.
The sins of our ancestors is relevant because it's the corrupted nature we inherited.
If you want to play word games, this "corrupt nature" becomes a "design flaw!"
That is what we can not overcome without what Christ has accomplished for us on the cross. Jesus's sacrifice provided the way.
While it is certailnly true that Jesus provided and still provides our access to God, our Father, his coming here was not to have his body beaten to a bloody pulp and his blood drained on a cross, just to appease an infinitely loving Father/God for their natural immature conditions, or the "sins of thier fathers".
Romans 8:3 - For God has done what the law, weakened by the flesh, could not do: sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and for sin, he condemned sin in the flesh,


Let's try to use the wonderful brain God has given you, and his Spirit which Jesus shared with us all when he left to decide what is reasonable. God is in your heart. The Bible is an external authority, and therefore a lesser reference. You can ask God DIRECTLY. Why would you want to trust a book that has over 400 translations, which are in dispute?

God, being I_N_F_I_N_I_T_E, is unattainable by the human mind. Human concepts of God were frighteninlgy human, and so, Jesus came to show mankind God in every why we are capable of understanding Him. Jesus is God's personal representative; our personal access to God. So, yes, Jesus DID come to show us how to attain eternity. But, that attainment in no way required his being slaughtered!. God has no need for anyone to suffer, and surely not a innocent Son!
Yes it did. Mankind's sins had to be paid otherwise God could not fairly allow us access to heaven. God would contradict his own nature if he forgave sins without a payment because that would be unfair and God is just.
You are just repeating your religious programming. I am asking you what is reasonable. Clearly limiting how God can or cannot forgive anything is just silly. The love we are able to share is but a shadow of that infinite personal love that God IS! We were created to start as imperfect beings. God understood that we would make many many mistakes. The point of it all was for us to get experience from those mistakes, and then we would become wise. Had He made us perfect, then we would have been informed, but lacking wisdom. His plan is GREAT! Isn't it?
Hebrews 9:22 - Indeed, under the law almost everything is purified with blood, and without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness of sins.


This is the kind of theology that Jesus came to remove. Mankind LOVES blood sacrifices. He came to show us a NEW way; Loving one another. That lesson certainly would be strange if only a hate filled slaughter was needed to bring it about!

God is more loving than that! (Heck, I'm more loving that that!)
It's God's love that he was willing to punish himself for us.

John 15:13 - Greater love has no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.
Well, Jesus know the cost of showing his absolute trust in God's asking him to complete his mission, even suffering that horrible death. THAT was the lesson of the cross; Trusting that Gods' plan is always the best way, because he knows and loves us in eternity, not just for this tiny lifetime.
The Angel watched agasted as this all unfolded, for the lesson Jesus taught was for the entire Universe, not just egocentric mankind.

Bro Dave
:) :) :)

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Post #16

Post by redstang281 »

The message is Love. No problem there.

You're right God is love but because of that he also has hate for sin. A Holy God can not tolerate sin so it must be dealt with.

God has no limitations as to what He "can tolerate". Certainly condemming ALL of mankind for ETERNITY, for some stupid supposed infraction by very finite mortals, whom He created, understanding full well, the very frail nature He gave us. No, that kind of vendictive nonsense is mortal man imposing how we think on our loving Father.
God can do anything, he has no limitations. God chooses not to tolerate sin because of what he wants heaven to be, that is Holy and perfect and an acceptable place for him and us. Currently God is tolerating sin on earth and you see the example we have of what happens with compromise.

But, God has an INFINITE capability to Love, and the reason he sent Jesus, was not to be slaughtered so He, God, could get past some VERY finite "sin" of some VERY remote ancestor.

The sins of our ancestors is relevant because it's the corrupted nature we inherited.

If you want to play word games, this "corrupt nature" becomes a "design flaw!"
Not really, a flaw is a mistake. I believe God intended for man kind to have the potential to take two paths, the easy way or the hard way. We chose the hard way.

That is what we can not overcome without what Christ has accomplished for us on the cross. Jesus's sacrifice provided the way.

While it is certailnly true that Jesus provided and still provides our access to God, our Father, his coming here was not to have his body beaten to a bloody pulp and his blood drained on a cross, just to appease an infinitely loving Father/God for their natural immature conditions, or the "sins of thier fathers".

Quote:
Romans 8:3 - For God has done what the law, weakened by the flesh, could not do: sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and for sin, he condemned sin in the flesh,

Let's try to use the wonderful brain God has given you,
Why resort to belittling? I am being respectful of you.
and his Spirit which Jesus shared with us all when he left to decide what is reasonable. God is in your heart. The Bible is an external authority, and therefore a lesser reference. You can ask God DIRECTLY. Why would you want to trust a book that has over 400 translations, which are in dispute?
Because there are other spiritual influences that would mislead us down a different path to Hell. God gives us the Bible as a foundation to judge spiritual influences. God is able to keep a books message faithfully. All the Christian translations of the Bible have the same meaning just a few different words here and there that don't make a difference in the message of the verse.
God, being I_N_F_I_N_I_T_E, is unattainable by the human mind. Human concepts of God were frighteninlgy human, and so, Jesus came to show mankind God in every why we are capable of understanding Him. Jesus is God's personal representative; our personal access to God. So, yes, Jesus DID come to show us how to attain eternity. But, that attainment in no way required his being slaughtered!. God has no need for anyone to suffer, and surely not a innocent Son!

Yes it did. Mankind's sins had to be paid otherwise God could not fairly allow us access to heaven. God would contradict his own nature if he forgave sins without a payment because that would be unfair and God is just.

You are just repeating your religious programming.
I'm going by the Bible. Religion is man's attempt to get right with God. Jesus Christ is the most unreligious person to ever walk the face of the earth.
I am asking you what is reasonable.
I feel that it's reasonable to trust the Bible as number one authority considering all other knowledge is subject to mankind fallibility.
Clearly limiting how God can or cannot forgive anything is just silly.
Technically he has already forgiven sin, it's just up to us whether or not we decide to accept his forgiveness. The only way to do that is through belief in Christ's death as payment for our own personal selves.
The love we are able to share is but a shadow of that infinite personal love that God IS! We were created to start as imperfect beings. God understood that we would make many many mistakes. The point of it all was for us to get experience from those mistakes, and then we would become wise. Had He made us perfect, then we would have been informed, but lacking wisdom. His plan is GREAT! Isn't it?
When Adam was created he was already capable of all human development. He was able to name every animal God created. I don't think he was not intelligent. I don't think God's goal for us is to become wise. He just wants us to be saved. Why he loves us and wants to save us is a mystery and I intend to ask him that.
Hebrews 9:22 - Indeed, under the law almost everything is purified with blood, and without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness of sins.

This is the kind of theology that Jesus came to remove. Mankind LOVES blood sacrifices. He came to show us a NEW way; Loving one another. That lesson certainly would be strange if only a hate filled slaughter was needed to bring it about!
Jesus did remove it because he was the final sacrifice. There's no more need for sacrifice because his sacrifice was sufficient. The sacrifices made in the old testament had absolutely nothing to do with hate. They were about offering up to God something that was dear to you in an effort to show your dedication to God and that you would put him before anything else. The Jews didn't have BMW's, Plasma TV's, or Playstations to burn so God required the things they did have that they held in value. Just the same God was willing to give to us what he held in value, namely his only son Jesus Christ.
God is more loving than that! (Heck, I'm more loving that that!)

Quote:
It's God's love that he was willing to punish himself for us.

John 15:13 - Greater love has no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.

Well, Jesus know the cost of showing his absolute trust in God's asking him to complete his mission, even suffering that horrible death. THAT was the lesson of the cross; Trusting that Gods' plan is always the best way, because he knows and loves us in eternity, not just for this tiny lifetime. The Angel watched agasted as this all unfolded, for the lesson Jesus taught was for the entire Universe, not just egocentric mankind.
God would not have asked Jesus to go through with his death if it wasn't imperative for us.

lifeisboring
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Post #17

Post by lifeisboring »

trencacloscas wrote:If it's not a mere fable, the message is hate.

So much God hate man, that he sent his Son to condemn mankind to eternal fire for supposed sins He knows men cannot resist to commit.
Yeah, but God created man, no? So why didn't he just create a more "perfect man" instead of just sacrificing his son for the sins of man?

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Post #18

Post by McCulloch »

redstang281 wrote:I'm going by the Bible. Religion is man's attempt to get right with God. Jesus Christ is the most unreligious person to ever walk the face of the earth.
I am asking you what is reasonable.
I feel that it's reasonable to trust the Bible as number one authority considering all other knowledge is subject to mankind fallibility.
I still have not seen any evidence that the Bible is not a product of human religion. It certainly is not infallible.
redstang281 wrote:God would not have asked Jesus to go through with his death if it wasn't imperative for us.
Isn't Jesus God? Or are you one of those non-Trinitarian Christians? What did you mean?
  1. The Father would not have asked Jesus to go through with his death if it wasn't imperative for us.
  2. God would not have asked God to go through with his death if it wasn't imperative for us.
Examine everything carefully; hold fast to that which is good.
First Epistle to the Church of the Thessalonians
The truth will make you free.
Gospel of John

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Post #19

Post by Sandycane »

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Last edited by Sandycane on Mon Apr 17, 2006 3:03 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Nick Hallandale
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Re: Why God sent Jesus on earth?

Post #20

Post by Nick Hallandale »

gospel wrote:For God so greatly loved and dearly prized the world that He [even] gave up His only begotten (unique) Son, so that whoever believes in (trusts in, clings to, relies on) Him shall not perish (come to destruction, be lost) but have eternal (everlasting) life.
"""Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them."""
Lets examine the fruits of Jesus and his followers since Jesus showed up.

Religious wars
Murder of Heretics
Book burning
Supression of Science
Persecution of Homosexuals
Biblical Support of Slavery
The Dark Ages
The Christian Right
Brother George W Bush

I probably missed a few fruit, but you know what I am writing about.
I am sure the world would have been better without Jesus.

Nick Hallandale

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