Fundamental christianity, is it narcissistic?

[bernee51]

In another thread the following exhange took place:

Me: You live a blinkered existence, blinded by your own perspective and a sociocentic, narcisstic religion.

Al: Narcissism? I'm am not a homosexual.

Me: Do you understand what is actually meant by narcissism? And why do you assocaiate it with homosexuality?

Al: You do know the story don't you? It is the reflection of the human body that should provide the empiricism necessary to accurately describe sex acts, the what and where.

But is that what it means. The 'story' of Narcissis is well known - the beautiful youth who fell in love with his own reflection and so on. But what does the myth mean and how does it relate to religion.

(Please note, the following discussion reflects on belief systems and does not indicate or mean to imply pathologies of any sort amongst the followers of these religions.)

In psychology narcissism (and borderline pathologies) indicate a problem with realistic emotional boundaries to the self. The individual lacks a sense of cohesive self. The self either treats the world as an extension of itself (narcissistic), or is constantly invaded and tortured by the world (borderline).

So let's look at fundamental religious belief. Any parallels? I have been told often enough by believers that if I do not embrace the teachings of Jesus I am bound for hell. The world at large, in fact, is really (or is believed should be) an extension of the dogma of the proscribed religiosity.

Or, as we have seen in other threads, there can arise amongst those who have these beliefs a definite feeling that the world is out to get their religion. That forces are gathering to bring them down - their beliefs are being invaded and tortured by, for example, 'hate speech' legislation.

Narcissism can be summed up in the statement "My country right or wrong" (of course you can subsitiute any belief system you like in place of the word country)

Fundamental religious beliefs are clearly sociocentric (the social equivalent of egocentrism). The world is seen from only one perspective. Development out of these mindsets can be defined as a successive decrease in sociocentrism. It is the development of an apersptectival, truly pluralist worldview.

Fundamental religion does not offer that as an option. It is definitely a case of - my religion, right or wrong, take it or leave it. And, by the way, if you leave it you are doomed.

[AlAyeti]

Nacissus, was in "love" with himself and could not "do" anything about it.

He was in love with someone of the same sex.

Narcissus was insane. He only loved what could please himself. That is a perfect description of homosexual sex. Pure selfish gratification. The Homosexual activists that forced the removal of homosexuality from Psychiatry will not hesitate to employ the selfish self aggrandizing actions that they did by force and coersion, to eliminate homosexuality as a mental illness from the DSM if narcissism was applied correctly to their behavior.

Fundamental Christianity sees the worth of non-believers and indeed "others" to the point of leaving the comforts of home to bring the message of safety to others. A Christian doesn't get any more a place in heaven for converting others. That is guaranteed at the individual Christians moment of accepting Christ as Lord and Savior. Nothing can affect that. So there is really no need to "help others" and you would think that a Christian would be the most selfish religious person on Earth, just being content to look at themselves in the mirror and knowing what a beautiful condition there are in.

It would be more logical to assume that once a Christian was "Saved" that it would be the perfect time to sit in a corner a commit suicide and go off to heaven. From baptismal font to cliffs edge to heaven.

But is well documented since the the beginning of recorded Christian history secular or in house, Christians see others as MORE important than themselves.

Indeed Narcissus finds his exact opposite in a Christian that believes "fundamentally" in what Christ Jesus said and in fact did.

[bernee51]

Nacissus, was in "love" with himself and could not "do" anything about it.

He was in love with someone of the same sex.

Al it is a myth, it is symbolism. It is not literal.

It is NOT (primarily) about sexual attraction.

Narcissus was insane. He only loved what could please himself.
That is a perfect description of homosexual sex. Pure selfish gratification.

I don't believe this is an accurate asessment

From Wikipedia.

Narcissism, in psychology is the pattern of thinking and behaving which involves infatuation and obsession with one's self to the exclusion of others.... For the narcissist, self-worth is the belief that he/she is superior to his/her fellow humans; it is not enough to be "okay" or "pretty good," the narcissist can only feel worthwhile by experiencing him/herself as the "best".

Sounds like fundamental religion to me.

Fundamental Christianity sees the worth of non-believers and indeed "others" to the point of leaving the comforts of home to bring the message of safety to others. ..."

The discussion is not about what an christian does or doesn't' do. No one is arguing how self-sacrificinfg some christians can be. The issue is fundamental religion as a system of belief - not the individual believers.

Look at the fundamental of narcissim - self is 'right' to the exclusion of all others. Compare that to fundamental religion - it is right to the exclusion of all others.

No difference is there?

Indeed Narcissus finds his exact opposite in a Christian that believes "fundamentally" in what Christ Jesus said and in fact did.

Not at all - as demonstrated above. To the exclusion of all others 'Jesus' {cf. the self} is right.

Pure narcissism.

Care to comment on the borderline issue? Attacked from all sides? Concentration camps for christians?

[Lainey]

Nacissus, was in "love" with himself and could not "do" anything about it.

He was in love with someone of the same sex.

I don't think that was the point of the story...I'm surprised that anyone would see it from that angle.

Narcissus was insane. He only loved what could please himself. That is a perfect description of homosexual sex. Pure selfish gratification. The Homosexual activists that forced the removal of homosexuality from Psychiatry will not hesitate to employ the selfish self aggrandizing actions that they did by force and coersion, to eliminate homosexuality as a mental illness from the DSM if narcissism was applied correctly to their behavior.

Why is it that everything relates back to homosexuality with you? Narcissus thought that he was the most important person in the whole world. He loved himself more than anything else. By your logic, anyone who's ever indulged in "self-love" (to be euphemistic) is a homosexual. That would be almost everyone in the world.

But not you, Al, right? Never you...

Fundamental Christianity sees the worth of non-believers

Yes, non-believers are worth so much to Christians that they get all warm and fuzzy at the idea that we'll all be suffering in eternal torment for the simple "crime" of disbelieving the unbelievable! Good times, good times...

and indeed "others" to the point of leaving the comforts of home to bring the message of safety to others.

Yes, some Christians are very nice, charitable people. Salt of the earth. So are some Atheists, and some "evolutionists," and some agnostics, and some Muslims (yes, really!), and--well, you get the idea.

But is well documented since the the beginning of recorded Christian history secular or in house, Christians see others as MORE important than themselves.

My best friend is a fundamentalist Christian. She would agree with you on pretty much all of your views. And she is one of the most narcissistic people I have ever met. She doesn't see it that way, of course. She'd say that she saw others as more important than herself, but in reality, in practice, it doesn't turn out that way.

[AlAyeti]

Bernee you failed to make your point IN Narcissus. He died from another menatal illness depression.

The story is a myth but the story is about a man in love with a man. He may have been to stupid to realize what real love is but still the comparisons to the homosexual condition is striking.

You didn't attack my position that if Christians were narcississitic, then they would sit in a corner and cry or kill themselves as soon as they "earned" heaven. But it is absolute history that Christians go out of their way for the good of "others."

You should have tried to denigrate Christianty with another angle. Narcissism fits the selfishness of the atheist perspective far better than a Christian one. An atheist by self-definition is doing everything by and for themselves.

Why is it that everything relates back to homosexuality with you? Narcissus thought that he was the most important person in the whole world. He loved himself more than anything else. By your logic, anyone who's ever indulged in "self-love" (to be euphemistic) is a homosexual. That would be almost everyone in the world.

But not you, Al, right? Never you...

Trolling for views of my sex life? Privacy is key to my position on sex. Please leave personal questions out of cyber debate. I preach repentance. Playboy pages constitutes adultery in the Christian concept.

Most people I hope, do not pleasure themselves by looking at their own reflection. Yeee!

That was too easy a comeback.

[AlAyeti]

My best friend is a fundamentalist Christian. She would agree with you on pretty much all of your views. And she is one of the most narcissistic people I have ever met. She doesn't see it that way, of course. She'd say that she saw others as more important than herself, but in reality, in practice, it doesn't turn out that way.

Please provide the date you passed your boards and are allowed to be practising Psychology? Otherwise what you wrote is pure opinion and borderline bigotry.

[AlAyeti]

Not at all - as demonstrated above. To the exclusion of all others 'Jesus' {cf. the self} is right.

Pure narcissism.

Obviously (and I'm surprised) you have never read the Gospels.

In your opinion He may be egomaniacal or insane, but certainly not in love with Himself.

Otherwise he would have taken control like a Lenin or Stalin. And we all know how that ended.

The freedom existing in countries where Christianty was developed are still living in freedom. Now, if you want to post your "open and honest" views about Mohammad and Islam, then we may see Narcissisism and religion in a very bright light.

[bernee51]

Bernee you failed to make your point IN Narcissus. He died from another menatal illness depression.

Actually Al - you failed to get the point. The point was well made.

Religious fundamentalism is iobsessed with itself. It allows no view other than its own. It is right and the rest of the world is wrong. The believer is saved, the non-believer doomed.

Get the point.

It has nothing to do with homosexuality.

BTW Narcissus didn't die - he pined away and turned into a flower.

The story is a myth but the story is about a man in love with a man.

No it is the story af a human obsessed with the 'self'. The gender is irrelevent and the obsession is not sexual.

He may have been to stupid to realize what real love is but still the comparisons to the homosexual condition is striking.

To you perhaps but you have shown yourself to be rather obsessed with homosexuality. So I guess you reation should have been of no surprise.

You didn't attack my position that if Christians were narcississitic, ...

There was no need to because I did not claim that christians were narcissistic. Further proof that you have not an inkling of the point being made.

You may have missed this so here it is again:

(Please note, the following discussion reflects on belief systems and does not indicate or mean to imply pathologies of any sort amongst the followers of these religions.)

Narcissism fits the selfishness of the atheist perspective far better than a Christian one.

Naecissism fits the selfishness inherent in any fundamental belief (or non-belief). If the belief (or non-belief) is held to be right to the exclusion of all others then it is narcissistic

An atheist by self-definition is doing everything by and for themselves.

Wrong. An atheist by definition is one who does not believe in god(s).

What an individual atheist may or may not feel is not the point. Just as it is not the point what an individual christian may or may not feel.

[bernee51]

Nacissus, was in "love" with himself and could not "do" anything about it.

He was in love with someone of the same sex.

I don't think that was the point of the story...I'm surprised that anyone would see it from that angle.

I'm not - it is a much misundersttod myth. As myths often are.

My best friend is a fundamentalist Christian. She would agree with you on pretty much all of your views. And she is one of the most narcissistic people I have ever met. She doesn't see it that way, of course. She'd say that she saw others as more important than herself, but in reality, in practice, it doesn't turn out that way.

I;m sure there are narcissist isn al belief systems.

The point of my post is that fundamentalism (regardless of the belief system) is narcissistic. It is self-obsessed to the point where it allows no other belief system to be valid. Moreso, any thay do not agree are doomed. Additionally fundamental belief systems hold that they are under attack from 'hostile forces'. This is true of fundamental christianity and it is true of fundamental islam.

Fundamentalism is a pathology of cultural and/or spiritual development just as narcissism is a pathology of human development.

[Lainey]

Trolling for views of my sex life? Privacy is key to my position on sex. Please leave personal questions out of cyber debate. I preach repentance. Playboy pages constitutes adultery in the Christian concept.

Ha! Ha! No, Al, I was trying to make a point. It seems it went right over your head. It was a rhetorical question. I agree with you, privacy is key.

Please provide the date you passed your boards and are allowed to be practising Psychology? Otherwise what you wrote is pure opinion and borderline bigotry.

As soon as you provide your credentials in Biochemistry. It is my opinion. How is it bigotry? I think my friend is overly concerned with herself. Is that bigotry?