Muhammad in the Bible

[good]

[micatala]

Moderator Intervention



I'll ask good to consult the rules for the forum.

http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6

Moving to Random Ramblings.

[Pazuzu bin Hanbi]

That’s kind of like saying that the coming of Islamic terrorism was already predicted in the Bible, and its name is the current government of Palestine. Yes, the Tanakh has a section somewhere about something evil, and the words used sound a bit like ‘Hamas’.

[Baron von Gailhard]

Hilarious. So now we have two Holy Spirits, the one who was around at the time of Christ, being the Spirit of God, and another one who came later in the form of Mahomet, who seduced his best friend's wife.

Mahomet is certainly prophesied about in the bible, but in Revelation 9:

Rev 9:1 The fifth angel sounded his trumpet, and I saw a star that had fallen from the sky to the earth. The star was given the key to the shaft of the Abyss.

Rev 9:2 When he opened the Abyss, smoke rose from it like the smoke from a gigantic furnace. The sun and sky were darkened by the smoke from the Abyss.

Rev 9:3 And out of the smoke locusts came down upon the earth and were given power like that of scorpions of the earth.

Rev 9:4 They were told not to harm the grass of the earth or any plant or tree, but only those people who did not have the seal of God on their foreheads.

Rev 9:5 They were not given power to kill them, but only to torture them for five months. And the agony they suffered was like that of the sting of a scorpion when it strikes a man.

Rev 9:6 During those days men will seek death, but will not find it; they will long to die, but death will elude them.

Rev 9:7 The locusts looked like horses prepared for battle. On their heads they wore something like crowns of gold, and their faces resembled human faces.

Rev 9:8 Their hair was like women's hair, and their teeth were like lions' teeth.

Rev 9:9 They had breastplates like breastplates of iron, and the sound of their wings was like the thundering of many horses and chariots rushing into battle.

Rev 9:10 They had tails and stings like scorpions, and in their tails they had power to torment people for five months.

Rev 9:11 They had as king over them the angel of the Abyss, whose name in Hebrew is Abaddon, and in Greek, Apollyon. [fn]

[Darias]

As a Christian, I don't think the Bible makes any reference to Muhammad (pbuh).

I do understand that a number of Muslims believe that the Bible and the Torah are holy books but that they've been corrupted over time. I understand that Abraham, Moses, and Jesus are all recognized by Islam. At college, I learned that a number of Muslims believe Islam has always existed.

I can imagine that a Christian not understanding how Prophet Muhammad was foretold in the Bible, is a lot like a Jew not understanding how Christ Jesus is the messiah prophesied about in the Torah.

I'd also like to point out that I doubt the Bible makes any real reference to Muhammad because the authors of the Bible simply would not have known about the introduction of the Islamic religion in AD 622.

The similarity between Christianity and Islam, is that both of our religions borrow from the same principles found in Judaism.

Both of our faiths assume the continuation of the previous. Whereas some Christians see Christianity as the natural evolution of Judaism for all people -- some Muslims believe that Islam is the final and complete expression of the Abrahamic religions.

Correct me if I'm wrong, I'm just making observations; I like to compare things.

[Pazuzu bin Hanbi]

Thanks for that. I like to contribute things to discussions, and I know this represents anecdotal stuff, not actual evidence, but… I’ve almost reached the age of 35. I grew up in a muslim household amongst a community of muslims, etc. Whilst growing up, learning the qur’ân, learning to pray, going to the mosque, etc. people would talk about a LOT of things in regards to other religions. I see these sorts of arguments and debates pop up even now.

Things I never used to hear in a muslim community whilst growing up (by no means a comprehensive list):

• That the world is divided into Muslims and Dar al–Harb (it shocked me that Christians thought this about Islâm when I discovered about it)
• That muslims are not allowed to have non–muslim friends (you can MARRY a Christian/Jewish woman, have sex with her, have children with her, and yet can’t be her friend? Ridiculous!)
• That Muhammad was foretold in the Bible.

I have only noticed the latter point cropping up relatively recently. Perhaps the advent of the internet gave a chance for something like that to spread, but I never even heard of it whilst growing up as a muslim.

Of course, as I stated, this simply represents anecdotal testimony. But, you know…

[Baron von Gailhard]

The similarity between Christianity and Islam, is that both of our religions borrow from the same principles found in Judaism.

Both of our faiths assume the continuation of the previous. Whereas some Christians see Christianity as the natural evolution of Judaism for all people -- some Muslims believe that Islam is the final and complete expression of the Abrahamic religions.

Correct me if I'm wrong, I'm just making observations; I like to compare things.

I think you are giving out the propaganda of Islam. Most "Christians" of the traditional mold, at least over the past five hundred years of so - perhaps not so much now with the modern fuzzy approaches to human rights - regard Islam as only an imposture religiion, whereas Judaism effectively stopped in AD70, but continued on in the form of a completely new religion.

You will actually find it very hard indeed to reconcile Islam with the Old Testament, let alone the New Testament.

[Pazuzu bin Hanbi]

The problem is that Muhammad only learned what he did about Judaism and Christianity from stories he heard from others during business, festivals (Makkah = Mecca served as a centre of pilgrimage, festivals, other goodies), and ‘Arabs who had converted to Judaism. When he finally reached Yathrib (later renamed Madinah = Medina) and came across strongly practising Jews he found out he was terribly wrong. And it shocked him to the core that Judaism and Christianity weren’t simply slight variants of each other but completely different in philosophy.

[Goat]

The problem is that Muhammad only learned what he did about Judaism and Christianity from stories he heard from others during business, festivals (Makkah = Mecca served as a centre of pilgrimage, festivals, other goodies), and ‘Arabs who had converted to Judaism. When he finally reached Yathrib (later renamed Madinah = Medina) and came across strongly practising Jews he found out he was terribly wrong. And it shocked him to the core that Judaism and Christianity weren’t simply slight variants of each other but completely different in philosophy.

It shocks many Christians today... My stepdaughters bf had fundamentalist parents heard a little about Judaism about me, and he was amazed it wasn't 'pre-christianity'..

[Baron von Gailhard]

The problem is that Muhammad only learned what he did about Judaism and Christianity from stories he heard from others during business, festivals (Makkah = Mecca served as a centre of pilgrimage, festivals, other goodies), and ‘Arabs who had converted to Judaism. When he finally reached Yathrib (later renamed Madinah = Medina) and came across strongly practising Jews he found out he was terribly wrong. And it shocked him to the core that Judaism and Christianity weren’t simply slight variants of each other but completely different in philosophy.

Abdullah ibn Salam, Jew, may have been a principal framer of the Koran.
Christian bits may have come from Bahira, a Nestorian monk.

One thing is for sure: Mahomet did not receive it from an angel.