God the Pornographer

[Nick_A]

Between modern sex education and religous fundamentalism making sex something dirty, it amazes me that some kids have not yet gone off the deep end.

http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/28679588/?GT1=43001

It is the rage of the day for young kids to take nude pictures of themselves, give them to the opposite sex, and have them posted on the Internet. Of course not knowing how to handle it, the powers that be have said that they are engaging in child pornography. This means that a naked picture of a fourteen year old girl is by definition pornographic. Since this body was designed by God, it makes God a pornographer as well. As spock would say: fascinating.

Without the variable of intent, the body of a young girl must be considered pornographic and its creator a pornographer.

Do you believe it is right to call a young naive girl a pornographer for giving a naked picture of herself to a boy with just an innocent intent to impress?

Is this really primarily a matter for the police? Is this willingness to turn it over to them really just indicating our collective ignorance in being able to communicate to a young girl anything meaningful about sex, sex energy, and how to value her body?

I can see protecting young girls from predators but teaching the value of values should come from their parents and other adults. Somehow this basic understanding seems to have become lost in the shuffle. What happened? Can understanding about such basic aspects of life ever become common knowledge?

[Nick_A]

It is a question we prefer to avoid but look at the consequences. One girl commits suicide. Doesn't it seem absurd that we are so ignorant as to sex, sex energy, and the value of the body that we simply cannot communicate something to a young girl that she wouldn't feel the need to be part of a fashion or a fad? But we don't understand so defend our ignorance and pass the buck on to the police. Sad but true.

http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/us_worl ... ting_.html

[thepuppettheatre]

Here's my favorite part of this whole scenario:

The only problem anyone sees in this situation is the fact that the girl took naughty pictures of herself and sent them to someone. If that's as bad as the world gets... I'm sure we'll find a way to trudge though.

The problem I see is in a society so terrified of sex - hell, just nudity - that it lashes out violently at the perpetrator. This girl took a nudie and it got out, and? She didn't hang herself for that, FYI. She hung herself because our society is so sick that he ripped at her until she eventually caved.

Picture this, if all of her friends and family who saw the picture said "hey, that's a good picture, you look very sexy" or "are you ok with people seeing you naked? if so, good for you" Would this girl have hung herself? If the government didn't look on her like a villain and all the people she sent the picture to as if they were disgusting perverts I doubt seriously this would be a topic for discussion.

Let's stop pointing fingers at nudity and sex. Let's identify the real problem... our awe struck terror of the subject.

[Cathar1950]

Here's my favorite part of this whole scenario:

The only problem anyone sees in this situation is the fact that the girl took naughty pictures of herself and sent them to someone. If that's as bad as the world gets... I'm sure we'll find a way to trudge though.

The problem I see is in a society so terrified of sex - hell, just nudity - that it lashes out violently at the perpetrator. This girl took a nudie and it got out, and? She didn't hang herself for that, FYI. She hung herself because our society is so sick that he ripped at her until she eventually caved.

Picture this, if all of her friends and family who saw the picture said "hey, that's a good picture, you look very sexy" or "are you ok with people seeing you naked? if so, good for you" Would this girl have hung herself? If the government didn't look on her like a villain and all the people she sent the picture to as if they were disgusting perverts I doubt seriously this would be a topic for discussion.

Let's stop pointing fingers at nudity and sex. Let's identify the real problem... our awe struck terror of the subject.

Good point.
Maybe a little more "those guys are assholes but you will live through this, it will pass" might have helped or "at least you look good".
It take many most of their lives to learn from their mistakes while some think we should give kids little chance to learn and grow before they treat them worse then habitual sex offenders.
The poor little thing was probably humiliated and then they add insult to injury where lack of experience and life is rejected.

[Nick_A]

So the bottom line is that we don't know how to communicate with a young person anything meaningful about sex, sex energy, and their body from any perspectives other then from fundamentalism and secularism. No wonder our ignorance can lead to suicide.

[Cathar1950]

So the bottom line is that we don't know how to communicate with a young person anything meaningful about sex, sex energy, and their body from any perspectives other then from fundamentalism and secularism. No wonder our ignorance can lead to suicide.

I think we do.
We could start with sex education.
But how much is society suppose to teach other's children?
I suppose if we let things like this that happen known then they at least get some feedback.
We humans learn all our lives, including sex.
I read that our love maps are shaped by the time we are 5 and 6 even before there is sexual interest provided by adolescent hormones.
2000 years ago girls were married at 12 and 13 and if they didn't die in child birth they and lived they usually became young widows as the men tended to be older.
Is there really just two choices or many?
Even fundamentalist may have more then one perspective.
What do we know about sex that would have helped this girl?
Is sex even the issue or a by-product of unmet needs?
Do we even know what the problem is?
What do legal processes accomplish and for what ends and by what means?

[userr123]

Between modern sex education and religous fundamentalism making sex something dirty, it amazes me that some kids have not yet gone off the deep end.

http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/28679588/?GT1=43001

It is the rage of the day for young kids to take nude pictures of themselves, give them to the opposite sex, and have them posted on the Internet. Of course not knowing how to handle it, the powers that be have said that they are engaging in child pornography. This means that a naked picture of a fourteen year old girl is by definition pornographic. Since this body was designed by God, it makes God a pornographer as well. As spock would say: fascinating.

Without the variable of intent, the body of a young girl must be considered pornographic and its creator a pornographer.

Do you believe it is right to call a young naive girl a pornographer for giving a naked picture of herself to a boy with just an innocent intent to impress?

Is this really primarily a matter for the police? Is this willingness to turn it over to them really just indicating our collective ignorance in being able to communicate to a young girl anything meaningful about sex, sex energy, and how to value her body?

I can see protecting young girls from predators but teaching the value of values should come from their parents and other adults. Somehow this basic understanding seems to have become lost in the shuffle. What happened? Can understanding about such basic aspects of life ever become common knowledge?

God intended sex for marriage. It is definately NOT a bad thing; only when it is used imporperly and immorally.

[czollers]

the greek root for the word porn is "pornea". and, as i see it, pornea is more than two young folks having a romp in the hay, or two lovers having sex before the proper time (i.e. marriage or union). pornea has a certain ...violence attached to it, at least as it seems to me in the greek. there is something loveless, faithless, objectifying, humiliating, defiling, and uni-directional or non-relational in the term. that is NOT the kind of sex condoned anywhere in the bible.

as it relates to pre-teens & sexting (text messages containing nude images of oneself), there has got to be a variety of factors at work, hasn't there?

yes, our puritanical foundation played a role in our national irrational level of modesty. (remember the 5th grade teacher who was sued & fired in texas for taking her students to an art museum where they witnessed all the horrors of a nude statue?) but theres so much more. advertisements are everywhere telling us that sexy people get what they want (smoke marlboros & you'll be a sexy cowboy, wear victoria's secret undies & you'll be a sexpot mistriss, etc. have you freaking seen any abercrombie & fitch ads?? they don't even bother to wear clothes!). television shows show people hopping from bed to bed amongst friends without a care, and it always turns out well funny even. (think friends). popular music videos are entirely made of sexual innuendo, never mind the lyrics: "you & me baby ain't nothin' but mammals, so let's do it like they do it on the discovery channel."

really? nothing but mammals? is that what we really think? or is that what we tell ourselves in order to justify doing what it is we desire to do, despite that it goes against our own morals? i submit to you that there was literally no other way our preteens could have turned out, given american culture.

what can we do? well, we have to find a way to get over it & TALK to our kids about sex, and their bodies. we're all so freaked out about it that we avoid the topic altogether, propetuating the problem. sex is not bad or dirty. god does not hate us, or think us vile sinners, or even get mad at us when we make sexual mistakes (biblically speaking). but the impact of sexual mistakes is long lasting. sometimes it colors our entire lives.

sex at a young age with multiple partners sets a person up for false expectations in marriage. recent studies show that the best time to talk to your kids if you want to be the one to talk to them about sex before some other kid does, is 5th or 6th grade, depending upon the kid. they suggest "nuts & bolts" type discussions where you talk about their bodies and where babies come from and what sex is, and what is & isn't appropriate.

[Bio-logical]

God intended sex for marriage. It is definately NOT a bad thing; only when it is used imporperly and immorally.

Exactly which scriptures say that sex was intended for marriage? honestly asking here, the only scriptures I am aware of that talk about sex are in Leveticus which talk about what not to do, what to do is glanced over at best. The way I interpret it, Marriage was intended to support sex, which in turn was intended to create children. Really, marriage is intended to support children.

This begs the question then, is it sinful to stay married to a sterile person? Is it morally obligatory to leave a baron woman, or just to create a child with an unmarried partner?

I will not argue that sex can be a bad thing when used improperly, but I object to your defining anything other intra-marital sex to be improper if for no other reason than it trivializes the truly improper uses of it. Rape, child molestation, beastiality and I'm sure a few other things I can't think of right now are morally reprehensible, but having sex with somebody you love is not whether you have affirmed your vows or not. Casual sex would, in my opinion, occasionally fall on either side of the line depending on if both parties are in agreement to the level of intimacy. If I lie to a woman and tell her I love her so I can get laid, I am basically raping her. If I tell a woman I am not looking for anything serious and she says she isn't either, we are just two consenting adults enjoying each other's bodies.

Getting back to the point at hand, pornography is inherently linked with a more sexually violent culture and the subjugation and exploitation of women. I do firmly believe the world would be a better place without it. Unfortunately, there is also a lot of money to be made in pornography and as long as it is legal I do not fin anything immoral about the individuals who participate in it. They are not trying to perpetuate violence nor are they attempting to objectify women, they are simply taking adavantage of the fact that in our culture, women are treated as sex objects in many ways and they are exploiting our perversion to make money.

The conclusion that I am getting at is that sex is never immorally used if all parties involved are are voluntarily and freely participating, provided they are all competent enough to make such a decision. In the case of the young girls "sexting" their boyfriends, we may not think they are old enough but in many cultures they could be married by this age and raising children with God's good graces, so who am I to judge?

[Carico]

Between modern sex education and religous fundamentalism making sex something dirty, it amazes me that some kids have not yet gone off the deep end.

Kids have gone off the deep end! Ever since sex 'education" has been allowed in the schools:

1) 1 in 4 17 year olds has an std
2) Millions of babies have been killed
3) More than half of all marriages end in divorce
4) An increase in gender identity confusion to the point that people are trying to change their bodies to match their minds.
5) A huge increase in promiscuity
6) An increase in confusion over what marriage is
7) An increase in confusion over when life begins
8) An increase in confusion over what a pregnant woman is carrying inside of her
9) An increase in human trafficking
10) An increase in pornography, i.e., it's all over the internet, media, and movies
11) An increase in mass murder among our children
12) An increase in homosexuality
13) An increase in pedophilia
14) An increase in teen pregnancy

So it's scary to think what you believe going over the deep-end means. Our children are acting no better than animals who aren't capable of values higher than bodily gratification.

Humans did an excellent job of propagating the species, keeping families together, knowing what marriage is, knowing when life begins, etc. before sex was taught in the schools. So sex "education" hasn't educated anyone. All it's done is place so much focus on sex, that people want to act on it. And worst of all, people wonder why God destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah. unbelievable.