Are Jews going to Hell if they do not accept Jesus?

[cnorman18]

Are Jews going to Hell if they do not accept Jesus as Savior and Lord?

[alaa_kalala]

Even though i remember that we discussed that issue before, but i will again.
The Quran is inerrant and reliable, and the Bible (including the New Testament) is not inerrant and not reliable, because of one main reason : The chains of people who delivered the Quran to us are not broken, and those people are known for their honesty and credibility and muslims have many big biography books which assure their honesty and credibility.
Whereas we don't know the chain of people who delivered the Gospels of the New Testament to us, because Christians were persecuted for 300 years by the Romans and Jews, and we know very few about the first three centuries, and there are many disputes about the authors or the gospels and their date of authorship.
Do you understand the difference accurately ? Hope you become muslim one day.

If the Quran truly is inerrant and reliable, I have a few questions concerning that book's manifestly hostile and even hateful attitude toward Jews.

Are Jews really descended from dogs and pigs?

Is it really a religious obligation of Muslims to murder Jews?

Is it acceptable, even praiseworthy, for Muslims to commit suicide in order to murder innocent Jews?

These things are being taught by those in "the unbroken chain" that you claim are proven to be "honest and credible."

What about it?

Jews are not descended from dogs and pigs. But after God sent Muhammad, all the people (including Jews and Christians) must believe in Muhammad and the Quran, so Muslims must fight Jews and Christians until they become Muslims or pay a tax (called Al-Jizya) to Muslims.
These innocent Jews you talk about left their countries and conquered Palestine, and they kicked the Palestinians out of their country and killed the Palestinians before the Palestinians started killing them.

[cnorman18]

Even though i remember that we discussed that issue before, but i will again.
The Quran is inerrant and reliable, and the Bible (including the New Testament) is not inerrant and not reliable, because of one main reason : The chains of people who delivered the Quran to us are not broken, and those people are known for their honesty and credibility and muslims have many big biography books which assure their honesty and credibility.
Whereas we don't know the chain of people who delivered the Gospels of the New Testament to us, because Christians were persecuted for 300 years by the Romans and Jews, and we know very few about the first three centuries, and there are many disputes about the authors or the gospels and their date of authorship.
Do you understand the difference accurately ? Hope you become muslim one day.

If the Quran truly is inerrant and reliable, I have a few questions concerning that book's manifestly hostile and even hateful attitude toward Jews.

Are Jews really descended from dogs and pigs?

Is it really a religious obligation of Muslims to murder Jews?

Is it acceptable, even praiseworthy, for Muslims to commit suicide in order to murder innocent Jews?

These things are being taught by those in "the unbroken chain" that you claim are proven to be "honest and credible."

What about it?

Jews are not descended from dogs and pigs. But after God sent Muhammad, all the people (including Jews and Christians) must believe in Muhammad and the Quran, so Muslims must fight Jews and Christians until they become Muslims or pay a tax (called Al-Jizya) to Muslims.

Sorry, you're dodging the question. Will you denounce those teachings as heresies, or will you confirm them as authentic teachings of Islam?

These innocent Jews you talk about left their countries and conquered Palestine, and they kicked the Palestinians out of their country and killed the Palestinians before the Palestinians started killing them.

You're dodging the question again. Whether or not the foundation of Israel was proper (and that is not the issue under consideration here), it happened almost 60 years ago, and there are few who were adults then still living. The unarmed civilians--families at weddings and bar mitzvahs, teenagers at discotheques and pizzerias, pregnant women and infants at bus stops, children on school buses--that are quite deliberately targeted by Palestinian terrorists today are manifestly innocent of any of those crimes. By your own standard, attacks against the IDF and Israeli authorities might be justified--but schoolchildren and infants?

Further, do not pretend that all the innocents murdered by Islamist terrorists have been Israelis. Jews have been murdered in Europe and South America as well, not to mention the Jews and non-Jews murdered on 9/11/01 by Osama bin Laden on explicitly religious grounds.

I ask again; is the mass murder of innocents via suicide bombing an authentic teaching of Islam supported by the Quran?

[alaa_kalala]

Even though i remember that we discussed that issue before, but i will again.
The Quran is inerrant and reliable, and the Bible (including the New Testament) is not inerrant and not reliable, because of one main reason : The chains of people who delivered the Quran to us are not broken, and those people are known for their honesty and credibility and muslims have many big biography books which assure their honesty and credibility.
Whereas we don't know the chain of people who delivered the Gospels of the New Testament to us, because Christians were persecuted for 300 years by the Romans and Jews, and we know very few about the first three centuries, and there are many disputes about the authors or the gospels and their date of authorship.
Do you understand the difference accurately ? Hope you become muslim one day.

If the Quran truly is inerrant and reliable, I have a few questions concerning that book's manifestly hostile and even hateful attitude toward Jews.

Are Jews really descended from dogs and pigs?

Is it really a religious obligation of Muslims to murder Jews?

Is it acceptable, even praiseworthy, for Muslims to commit suicide in order to murder innocent Jews?

These things are being taught by those in "the unbroken chain" that you claim are proven to be "honest and credible."

What about it?

Jews are not descended from dogs and pigs. But after God sent Muhammad, all the people (including Jews and Christians) must believe in Muhammad and the Quran, so Muslims must fight Jews and Christians until they become Muslims or pay a tax (called Al-Jizya) to Muslims.

Sorry, you're dodging the question. Will you denounce those teachings as heresies, or will you confirm them as authentic teachings of Islam?

These innocent Jews you talk about left their countries and conquered Palestine, and they kicked the Palestinians out of their country and killed the Palestinians before the Palestinians started killing them.

You're dodging the question again. Whether or not the foundation of Israel was proper (and that is not the issue under consideration here), it happened almost 60 years ago, and there are few who were adults then still living. The unarmed civilians--families at weddings and bar mitzvahs, teenagers at discotheques and pizzerias, pregnant women and infants at bus stops, children on school buses--that are quite deliberately targeted by Palestinian terrorists today are manifestly innocent of any of those crimes. By your own standard, attacks against the IDF and Israeli authorities might be justified--but schoolchildren and infants?

Further, do not pretend that all the innocents murdered by Islamist terrorists have been Israelis. Jews have been murdered in Europe and South America as well, not to mention the Jews and non-Jews murdered on 9/11/01 by Osama bin Laden on explicitly religious grounds.

I ask again; is the mass murder of innocents via suicide bombing an authentic teaching of Islam supported by the Quran?

Mass murder of innocents via suicide bombing is not an authentic teaching of Islam, and Islam does not approve what happened on 09/11/01. Jihad in Islam (fighting) must be declard by the ruler of muslims (or the ruler of an islamic country), and individuals can't start fighting disbelievers and others by themselves, and muslims must fight only the military people (not civilians).
(But i think there are specific rules for the case of Palestine, i will investigate about that)

[cnorman18]

Mass murder of innocents via suicide bombing is not an authentic teaching of Islam, and Islam does not approve what happened on 09/11/01. Jihad in Islam (fighting) must be declard by the ruler of muslims (or the ruler of an islamic country), and individuals can't start fighting disbelievers and others by themselves, and muslims must fight only the military people (not civilians).
(But i think there are specific rules for the case of Palestine, i will investigate about that)

Thank you for your reasoned and humane response.

I will now share with you that I have defended Islam on other fora (I am relatively new to this one) as an ancient and honorable religion worthy of reverence and respect, and am as opposed to anti-Muslim and anti-Arab bigotry as I am to antisemitism.

I think it one of the great tragedies of our time that, at least in the public mind in the West, your religion has been hijacked by radical extremist thugs who commit heinous crimes in the name of Allah the Merciful. The true followers of the Prophet and the Religion of Peace deserve better.

Salaam to you and yours.

[ken1burton]

Alaa_kalala.

I have not known of any decent person, Decent book, or decent acts done, That have not been slandered, called lies, Declared as never happened. Etc, That comes with the Territory.

Can we not use Muhammad and the Quran as an example? Does everyone speak well of Muhammad and the Quran?, Or does is seem that the more righteous a person or book is, the more hate it seem to draw from those who do not wish it to be true?

There are those on this earth that try to soil everything they can. They are full of hate, and anything that is decent is an enemy to them, Be it a person, a book, or an act of goodness.

I know there are problems with the New Testament, But I mainly go by the Old Testament as that is what God is foretelling He would do, and as Jesus had to fulfill every jot and Tittle, I need to study what those jots and tittle are.

Also, I do not care if an insect with a pen wrote the Gospel of John. All I care about is did God inspire the insect? I look to the Message, Not to the Messenger, God’s message does not contradict another of God’s messages.

They all fit together, So when you have hundreds of interlocking Concepts all fitting together, I do not have to start searching for flaws. They show us quick enough.

One man asked a treasury agent, “You must study a lot of Counterfeit Money?”, The Treasury Agent said “No, I study real Money, And the Counterfeit shows up quickly.”

I do not intend to waste hundreds or thousands of hours to try to verify everything I read, or who wrote it, etc, I will study the Scriptures and what fits shows up, What does not fit shows up also. So that the Building is established on Truth, I know what it is Truth, and I know why other things are not truth, and toss them away.

Technically This is all written by God. Whose hand He used does not matter, So as the writing becomes familiar you see how God says things, The Things He uses, The way He hides a matter. So you know His writing. And you can quickly when another is trying to insert their writing for God’s.

As far as the Gospel of John not written by John?

Acts 4:13 Now when they saw the boldness of Peter and John, and perceived that they were unlearned and ignorant men, they marvelled; and they took knowledge of them, that they had been with Jesus.

John is seen as Unlearned and Ignorant, So John more then likely dictated the words, as He could not read and write, or not very well anyway. For it is the “Gospel, according to John.” Not the Gospel written by John, and John only.

You said “But I want to invite you to believe in the only inerrant holy book on earth: The Quran.

Many Christians call the Bible inerrant.

God or Allah speaks in Similitudes, Uses visions, prophecies, Hides things in mystery, I guess I would have to understand what each and every things written means to have an inerrant understanding of an inerrant book. Or the Value of an inerrant book going through a errant mind.

Ever learn by a mistake? Does all your searches result in the first answer you came up with is always the Correct one? God wants us to know how to search, How to compare, How to rightly divide His words. So that things fit together. And Himself is seen.

Did Jesus fulfill the Prophecies to the Jot and Tittle, and if He did, Do they all interlock without one contradicting another, and did the Disciples see them all correctly? Did Jesus see them all correctly?

And if God pulled off every prophecy He made during 1500 years to those different Prophets, and they were all fulfilled in Christ, Then what if another book shows up 600 years later? Would it also have to agree with the fulfilled Prophecies? And if not?

Muhammad showed a lot of Miracles and prophecies to prove his prophecy?

Those who show a prophecy, foretell something in the Future revealed to them from God. WHEN the Prophecy is fulfilled, then can a prophet be known that God sent them, Not until. And to prove His Prophecy? What Prophecy is that? Be Careful, All the Jots and tittles were fulfilled.

I am a Muslim, a Muslim is a true Believer in God. Jesus and the Disciples seen in the Quran as Muslims. I happen to be a True Believer in God and a Christian (Christ-Like) in that we both look to God the Father, Creator of us all.

As far as “Trust you” that Islam is the only right path which will guide you to Heaven. I think I will Trust God, and put not my trust in mankind. For people are humans.

God invited all mankind, Seek My Name, Seek My Face. Or come to know Me. So that is an open invitation to get to know God. And God is more then able to lead the way.

Ken

[Catharsis]

...But after God sent Muhammad, all the people (including Jews and Christians) must believe in Muhammad and the Quran, so Muslims must fight Jews and Christians until they become Muslims or pay a tax (called Al-Jizya) to Muslims.


Any commentary is superfluous.

Thank you for your frankness, but I as an Orthodox Christian already know this, and many other details about Islam. I just hope the West wakes up.

[RealDeal]

Since this thread seems to have gone off topic, may I take it a little further off topic?

Serious statement that leads me to a question here too:
I find many similarities between Mormonism and Islam. Their prophets, the angels, the books, the "last revelation", etc... of course they differ in their theologies. One being monotheistic and the other being monotheistic in relation to the earth, but polytheistic in the universe.

Any thoughts on this?

[OnceConvinced]

[Second, the Prophet Muhammad was illiterate (he couldn't write or read) and he can't compose a book like the Quran. (God revealed the Quran to Muhammad while he was illiterate, because God wanted to prove to people that the Quran is from God not from Muhammad).

I too am illiterate. I can't read or write. Neither do I know how to type.

Third, many scholars testified that Muhammad saw the angel Gabriel, and these scholars (companions) are known for their honesty and credibility, and their testimory was delivered to us by many credible scholars too.

I'm an honest guy too. I've never lied or decieved anybody in my entire life.

(It's easy to make claims, but a lot more difficult to back them up)