islam is the only truth

[umair]

islam is the only and complete truth, and i would love to entertain any of your questions regarding islam.

[HughDP]

It is a shame that a small number of Muslims sully the religion by demanding the death of anti-Islamic authors and uncomplimentary cartoonists. Unfortunately this is all that many people ever remember about Islam.

Unfortunately it is not a "small" number of people who support these ideals. 70% of Muslim schoolchildren in Britain (not Saudia Arabia, but Britain) felt that harming another was justified in defense of their faith.

70%. not 7%, not 1%.. 70%.

there are countless similar studies you can look up on the internet. I'll post the link to the website I found this statistic so you can verify when I get home, I'm at work and don't remember where it was, but its on bookmark at home.

I would be interested to see the survey. The term 'defence of their faith' is quite a broad one. I might, for example, consider harming another in the defence of my right to be an atheist.

I know a few Muslims (although not many I admit) and I don't know of one who supported the death threats on Salman Rushdie or the cartoonists.

[achilles12604]

achilles
Ok so you want us to start completely over and you want me to take the entire burden of proof over again?

LOL

How about you address posts 206-210 first.

You made the claim that the universe was begun by the splitting of the primary nebula (the big bang).

I showed that there is no indication at all the this was the process of the big bang and that there was no nebula at all.

How about you marry this with the Koran first and then we can move on?



I will make it simple for you.

Question: Does the Koran state that the big bang occurred from the "smoke" of a "primary nebula"?

well why dont you make it clear that allah says in the quran , that
“Do not the Unbelievers see
that the heavens and the earth
were joined together (as one
unit of Creation), before
We clove them asunder?”
[Al-Qu’ran 21:30

ie: whether it be a singularity
or a nebula, both can be disintegrated.

then further he adds that he ordered for the formation of the earth and the sky:
“Moreover, He Comprehended
in His design the sky,
and it had been (as) smoke:
He said to it and to the earth:
‘Come ye together,
willingly or unwillingly.’
They said: ‘We do come (together),
in willing obedience.’”
[Al-Qur’an 41:11]


and then there are even further explanations regarding the red shift ie : the expansion of the universe as:
“With power and skill
did We construct
the Firmament:
For it is We Who create
the vastness of Space.”
[Al-Qur’an 51:47]
The Arabic word
musioon
is correctly translated as
‘expanding it’, and it refers to the creation of the
expanding vastness of the universe.

So you are changing your opinion that the Koran claims that the universe was created from a primary nebula and that this refers to the big bang?

I am trying to get you to stick to one point. In previous posts you were certain that the Koran indicated that this "smoke" was the "primary nebula" which was clove assunder. You even tried to "prove" this point by claiming that a nebula could have a really high density.

You have abandoned this position then?

[umair]

So you are changing your opinion that the Koran claims that the universe was created from a primary nebula and that this refers to the big bang?

I am trying to get you to stick to one point. In previous posts you were certain that the Koran indicated that this "smoke" was the "primary nebula" which was clove assunder. You even tried to "prove" this point by claiming that a nebula could have a really high density.

You have abandoned this position then?

hello achilles ,

well i am not changing what the quran says, but yes i have changed what i said, and it is still quite interesting for me to see that the verses of the quran are still perfectly validating with the singularities as well.

[Goat]

So you are changing your opinion that the Koran claims that the universe was created from a primary nebula and that this refers to the big bang?

I am trying to get you to stick to one point. In previous posts you were certain that the Koran indicated that this "smoke" was the "primary nebula" which was clove assunder. You even tried to "prove" this point by claiming that a nebula could have a really high density.

You have abandoned this position then?

hello achilles ,

well i am not changing what the quran says, but yes i have changed what i said, and it is still quite interesting for me to see that the verses of the quran are still perfectly validating with the singularities as well.

Pesonally, it seems to me that you are taking things, and having to really twist it around to have it fit.

[umair]

So you are changing your opinion that the Koran claims that the universe was created from a primary nebula and that this refers to the big bang?

I am trying to get you to stick to one point. In previous posts you were certain that the Koran indicated that this "smoke" was the "primary nebula" which was clove assunder. You even tried to "prove" this point by claiming that a nebula could have a really high density.

You have abandoned this position then?

hello achilles ,

well i am not changing what the quran says, but yes i have changed what i said, and it is still quite interesting for me to see that the verses of the quran are still perfectly validating with the singularities as well.

Pesonally, it seems to me that you are taking things, and having to really twist it around to have it fit.

well if you go through the whole conversation , then you,ll surely know that who has been deliberately hanging around.

[Wyvern]

well if you go through the whole conversation , then you,ll surely know that who has been deliberately hanging around.

Although it is commendable that you are hanging around to actually defend your positions but if all you are going to do is change your interpretations as each position is invalidated it hardly matters.

On another note I find it interesting that according to the Koran the earth and earth's atmosphere were at one time separate SENTIENT entities and it took Allah to force them both together.

[carolineislands]

So you are changing your opinion that the Koran claims that the universe was created from a primary nebula and that this refers to the big bang?...

hello achilles ,

well i am not changing what the quran says, but yes i have changed what i said, and it is still quite interesting for me to see that the verses of the quran are still perfectly validating with the singularities as well.

Ahhh... so it's sort of a one size fits all proof, aye? So you can change the claim from primary nebula to big bang and back again... whatever you want -- and the quote from the Quran still works?



Umair? Don't you get it? Your "proof" works for any claim because you are stretching the "proof" to fit whatever claim you make. It's ludicrous Umair. You're making a fool of yourself. You're not converting or convincing anybody of anything other than how rediculous you can be and how far you can twist and stretch logic to prop up your agenda.

What's amazing to me is that they're still toying with you.

LOL

[umair]

So you are changing your opinion that the Koran claims that the universe was created from a primary nebula and that this refers to the big bang?...

hello achilles ,

well i am not changing what the quran says, but yes i have changed what i said, and it is still quite interesting for me to see that the verses of the quran are still perfectly validating with the singularities as well.

Ahhh... so it's sort of a one size fits all proof, aye? So you can change the claim from primary nebula to big bang and back again... whatever you want -- and the quote from the Quran still works?



Umair? Don't you get it? Your "proof" works for any claim because you are stretching the "proof" to fit whatever claim you make. It's ludicrous Umair. You're making a fool of yourself. You're not converting or convincing anybody of anything other than how rediculous you can be and how far you can twist and stretch logic to prop up your agenda.

What's amazing to me is that they're still toying with you.

LOL

well its quite amazing to see that how some people ,by twisting and turning the talk feel that they have taken over.

if youll analyze then youll see that in this topic i have given answers to each and evry question , and my answers were not baseless,

and yes the last active topic that has been going on is 'quran and modern science' with achilles, in which i accept that at one place there might have been a bit complications but still along with that topic there are many more facts which i had presented and which were not complicated to understand.what about those?

what i have found is that people over here would neglect hard bold facts , and keep hanging with smaller facts which they are unable to understand

plz dont forget that the quran has no flaws like the bible, and so i am always ready for any comments, but what i want you to realize is that you should look at the bible, which as an older version of gods words, and has been distorted from its originality.

[Fallibleone]

[carolineislands]

... we at no cost are allowed to force or convert people to islam.which i guess is a misconception.

http://www.iht.com/articles/2006/08/27/news/mideast.php
http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/Re ... F33AC1D274

Qur'an 8:59 "The infidels should not think that they can get away from us. Prepare against them whatever arms and weaponry you can muster so that you may terrorize them. They are your enemy and Allah's enemy." Qur'an 8:71 "He will give you mastery over them." Qur'an 8:39 "So, fight them till all opposition ends and the only religion is Islam."

Ishaq:587 "Our onslaught will not be a weak faltering affair. We shall fight as long as we live. We will fight until you turn to Islam, humbly seeking refuge. We will fight not caring whom we meet. We will fight whether we destroy ancient holdings or newly gotten gains. We have mutilated every opponent. We have driven them violently before us at the command of Allah and Islam. We will fight until our religion is established. And we will plunder them, for they must suffer disgrace."

http://www.dccsa.com/greatjoy/islamP11.jpg

http://husaria.files.wordpress.com/2007 ... headed.jpg

http://www.betar.co.uk/articles/betar1088415770.php




Gee -- I don't know why people would get the idea that Muslims use force or violence to convert (or keep) people to Islam...

:2gun: Islam is a religion of peace, after all.