What is a True Christian?

Madeline · Post by **Madeline** » Sun Oct 15, 2006 4:08 am

How do you define a true christian? I know that I am truly trying to repent from all the sins that are effecting my walk with God. However I do have one sin in particular that I struggle with and I engage in it all too often. Some of my friends tell me that those who practice sin aren't christians. I engage in this particular sin to frequently that to me it almost seems as if I am practicing it. But I want to turn away from it. Yet christians I know tell me that I am not a christian for doing this particular sin too often, and it hurts me. Comments?

Love,
Madeline

Madeline · Post by **Madeline** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 11:36 am

FiredUp4jesus wrote:Personally I define a christian as "one who follows the teachings of Christ." It seems to me that what you might really be talking about is salvation or "am I really saved if I am still commiting sins?" Am I correct?

To a certian degree! I'm still battling sin and because of this I have doubts sometimes. But I am truly trying to repent and believe that it is by the Grace of God I am saved.

Love,
Madeline

Madeline · Post by **Madeline** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 11:38 am

Chem wrote:If you are to believe the NT, who did Jesus hang out with, was it the self righteous? I think not.

Why point to only the NT? Abraham was declared righteous because of his 'faith' in God, and not because of his deeds. However good deeds and obedience is the result of faith in God.

Love,
Madeline

Chem · Post by **Chem** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 11:47 am

Chem wrote:
If you are to believe the NT, who did Jesus hang out with, was it the self righteous? I think not.

Why point to only the NT? Abraham was declared righteous because of his 'faith' in God, and not because of his deeds. However good deeds and obedience is the result of faith in God.

Relative lack of knowledge of the Bible, that's why.

Cathar1950 · Post by **Cathar1950** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 2:14 pm

Madeline wrote:
Chem wrote:If you are to believe the NT, who did Jesus hang out with, was it the self righteous? I think not.
Why point to only the NT? Abraham was declared righteous because of his 'faith' in God, and not because of his deeds. However good deeds and obedience is the result of faith in God.

Love,
Madeline

It may read that Abraham declared himself righteous because he believed God not believed in him.
Trusting or believing God is a deed.
Believing in him is a proposition.

Madeline · Post by **Madeline** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 2:33 pm

Cathar1950 wrote:It may read that Abraham declared himself righteous because he believed God not believed in him.
Trusting or believing God is a deed.
Believing in him is a proposition.

No, Abraham did not declare himself righteous. God declared him righteous because of his faith!

New Living translation (NLT) Romans 4:22
And because of Abraham's faith, God declared him to be righteous.

I never heard of anyone declaring themself righteous. That sounds like the epitome of self-righteousness!

Love,
Madeline

Goat · Post by **Goat** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 3:03 pm

Madeline wrote:
Chem wrote:If you are to believe the NT, who did Jesus hang out with, was it the self righteous? I think not.
Why point to only the NT? Abraham was declared righteous because of his 'faith' in God, and not because of his deeds. However good deeds and obedience is the result of faith in God.

Love,
Madeline

The point of he was rightous for his faith because his faith translated into action, he trusted God enough that he was willing to sacrifice his son. It is the action of obediance and trust that made him rightous. It might be his faith that let him make that leap, but it was his actions that made him rightous

Madeline · Post by **Madeline** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 3:12 pm

goat wrote:The point of he was rightous for his faith because his faith translated into action, he trusted God enough that he was willing to sacrifice his son. It is the action of obediance and trust that made him rightous. It might be his faith that let him make that leap, but it was his actions that made him rightous

Right! Pretty much the same as I said before. His good deeds and obedience is the 'result' of faith in God. He wouldn't take that leap unless he had true faith.

Love,
Madeline

Cathar1950 · Post by **Cathar1950** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 3:25 pm

Madeline wrote:
Cathar1950 wrote:It may read that Abraham declared himself righteous because he believed God not believed in him.
Trusting or believing God is a deed.
Believing in him is a proposition.
No, Abraham did not declare himself righteous. God declared him righteous because of his faith!

New Living translation (NLT) Romans 4:22
And because of Abraham's faith, God declared him to be righteous.

I never heard of anyone declaring themself righteous. That sounds like the epitome of self-righteousness!

Love,
Madeline

You are repeating Paul's interpretation.
I believe if you read the passage he was referring to in Hebrew it is open as to if it was God that considered his, believing God, right deeds or Abraham that thought that it was counted as right. I have read the arguments among Hebrew scholars and it seems all but clear. It has something about the structure of the language. I don’t remember the source but I suppose we have some Hebrew scholars we could ask. The point is it was the deed of believing God that was considered a right deed and I suppose it is irrelevant which one of them thought it was a good thing to do.

Madeline · Post by **Madeline** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 3:47 pm

Pray tell, why would you need the Hebrew interpretation if the NT was written in Greek? You can easily use a lexicon and see the proper interpretation. His actions or deeds was a result of his 'faith'. James says that Faith without works is called dead faith, Paul says that we are not saved by our works. Paul and James do not contradict each other, simply that genuine faith naturally produces works as with the example of Abraham. And as a result of his actions 'by' his faith, he was reckoned by God as righteous.

Love,
Madeline

Cathar1950 · Post by **Cathar1950** » Thu Oct 19, 2006 4:23 pm

Madeline wrote:Pray tell, why would you need the Hebrew interpretation if the NT was written in Greek? You can easily use a lexicon and see the proper interpretation. His actions or deeds was a result of his 'faith'. James says that Faith without works is called dead faith, Paul says that we are not saved by our works. Paul and James do not contradict each other, simply that genuine faith naturally produces works as with the example of Abraham. And as a result of his actions 'by' his faith, he was reckoned by God as righteous.

Love,
Madeline

Both Paul and who ever wrote James are going back to a Hebrew text that they are reading from the Greek interpretation or the Septuagint.
Of course they are only there opinions and interpretations and if you want to follow them that is fine.
I don’t care what Paul says unless we are discussing what Paul said. I am talking about Abraham.
In this case the works here is he believes God. Granted it may be all grace or favoritism but clearly believing what some ones says when it is incredible is works not faith that something is true. He believed God not a proposition. Now Paul is making a comparison and saying believe what I tell you and it is righteousness.

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What is a True Christian?

What is a True Christian?

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