ISLAM'S ANSWER TO THE RACIAL PROBLEM

[TrueReligion]

ISLAM'S ANSWER TO THE RACIAL PROBLEM

BY A GERMAN DIPLOMAT





It is a great and, as I feel, rather undeserved, honour which the Organizers of this Conference have so very kindly and generously done me by inviting me to address you and thus to contribute to the aims of the Conference, namely to develop closer relations with other religious groups, to present the teachings of Islam as they actually are. and to remove misunderstandings about, as it has been called, the most misunderstood religion in the West. so that the Western World may see it in its true image. I am most grateful for this honour and I pray to Almighty Allah* for His help and guidance so that I may be able to do justice to the task which lies before me.

The topic I have been asked to speak about is:

"Islam and the Racial Problem." When it was proposed to me I accepted it very readily, even eagerly, for some very personal reasons which I may kindly be permitted to mention very briefly.

*'ALLAH: Allah is the proper noun for God Almighty in the Semitic languages, ie- in the language of Moses, Jesus and Muhummed (peace be upon them all). See "WHAT IS HIS NAME" by Ahmed Deedat.

When I was introduced to you. you were told that I am a German Muslim, a German convert to Islam. As a German national, who was born in the late twenties, I spent my childhood and my youth under a political regime which, by the gross and utterly shameful atrocities perpetrated upon racial minorities and by its dogmatic belief in, and its ruthless application of. the "Herrenrasse" — or Master — Race Theory, meaning nothing less than the absolute supremacy of a "Germanic Race" over all other races living on this earth, has become synonymous with racism and all the ills and evils. the misery and suffering the injustice and brutality' that go with it.

Though by sheer accident of birth, not by any personal virtue or merit — and accident of birth, nothing more and nothing less, decides life and death, happiness and misery, freedom and bondage under a racist regime — I was spared the fate of becoming a victim myself of this obnoxious and pernicious creed. I cannot and shall never forget the terror and excesses which marked its rule in my country, nor shall I ever forget the plight and agonies of the innocent objects and targets of this diabolic and inhuman system of dividing man and man as I saw it practised around me in the formative years of my life.

It is against this background and with these personal experiences with racism and its problems and consequences indelibly engraved in my mind and memory that I so eagerly and readily responded to the invitation to expound, as far as my limited knowledge of Islam permits, the Islamic concept of inter-human relation, its high ideal of human brotherhood and the actualization of this ideal in history, in contrast to the antagonism between the different races of man as preached and practiced by racism.

Let me commence by taking you on a pilgrimage to the Holy Places of Islam in and around the venerable city of Mecca, in present day Saudi Arabia, the city of the "Ka'aba," the Sacred Mosque, which, according to the Holy Quran, is the first house that was ever built on earth for the worship of the One and Only God — to Mecca, the birthplace of the Holy Prophet Mohummed, upon whom be peace and the blessings of Allah, the city in which, and in whose vicinity, the Holy Prophet received the first and a large part of the remaining revelations from On High.

THE HAJJ

This annual pilgrimage, or "Hajj," as it is called in the Arabic language, is one of the "Five Pillars," one of the five fundamental religious duties to be performed by Muslims.

Without going further into the details of the conditions to be fulfilled in order to be able to proceed on this pilgrimage, or of the rites and rituals to be observed in its course, let me describe in a few words the most striking and unforgettable sight that will present itself to your eye upon reaching the sacred territory:

You will see a multitude of men, women and also children, close perhaps to 2 million, from every corner of the world, black and brown of complexion. yellow and white. Arabs and Iranians. Turks and Malays. Chinese and Africans, black and white Americans, blond and blue-eyed Europeans -— in short to quote one of our great Germanic Poets, Friedrich Schiller :"Who knows the nations, who the names of all who here together came?

NO DISTINCTION

And there is still more that fills us with wonder:

Whether black or brown, yellow or white, rich or poor, young or old, every male that our eye beholds is dressed alike, wearing two white seamless sheets of simple material, thus eliminating completely all marks and signs of distinction of dress between the African and American, the Asian. Australian and European, the mighty and wealthy and the poor and lowly. Here they have come, brother unto brother, sister unto sister, bearing witness to the brotherhood of mankind, to the equality of all human beings before their Creator, for it is to worship Him and to extol His glory that has brought them here. They have heard and heeded His call. and their reply uttered, nay cried out by all and sundry, echoing and re-echoing from the surrounding mountains is:

"LABBAIK. ALLAHUMMA LABBAIK" — HERE AM I, O ALLAH. HERE AM I. THERE IS NONE WHO IS THY PARTNER. ALL PRAISE AND BLESSING BELONG TO THEE ALONE. FOR THOU ART THE SOVEREIGN, AND THOU HAST NO PARTNER."

The pilgrimage to Mecca, the huge assembly of believers from all five continents, the gathering together of a multitude of worshippers of all races on the plain of Arafat is perhaps the most spectac1-cular expression, symbol and proof of unity and brotherhood of man as enunciated and upheld by the religion of Islam, and it is equally a symbol and proof of the equality of man before Allah, the Supreme Being, as taught by this religion.

The concept and idea of the oneness of humanity is Islam's unique contribution to human civilization. and it came as a natural sequel to its cardinal doctrine, the doctrine of "Tauhid," or the unity of God.

The doctrine, which runs through all teachings of the Holy Quran like a red thread, has found its most concise and terse expression in the 112th chapter of the Holy Book. called "Al-lkhlaas," or "Purity of Faith."

"Say: He is God, the One and Only;

God, the Eternal, Absolute;

He begetteh not, nor Is He begotten;

And there Is None like unto Him."

Holy Quran 112:1-4

(Read these verses and the verses following in conjunction with their commentary by A. Yusuf Ali.)

THE RABB

He, Allah, the One and Only, is the author of all existence; He is our Creator, to Him we belong and to Him is our return. And He is more than mere author and creator: He is also the "Rabb" of His creation and His creatures; and "Rabb" according to the great authority on the Holy Quran. Imam Raghib. in Arabic it signifies "THE CHERISHER, SUSTAINER AND FOSTERER OF A THING IN SUCH A MANNER AS TO MAKE IT ATTAIN ONE CONDITION AFTER ANOTHER UNTIL IT REACHES ITS GOAL OF COMPLETION AND PERFECTION." "Thus, Allah being the "Rabb ul-AlamIn," the "Rabb of the Worlds" as He is called in the opening chapter, of the Holy Quran and of all of us, whom He created." HE DEALS WITH ALL OF US ALIKE, NO MATTER TO WHICH RACE. NATION. TRIBE OR PARENTAGE WE MAY BELONG, for He created us all alike, as the Holy Quran further elucidates in numerous verses and words, such as:

"AND MANKIND IS NAUGHT BUT A SINGLE NATION."

Holy Quran 2:213

We are all the children of Adam. and Adam was made of dust. Here dawned the idea for the first time in human history that all men have a common origin and that, because of their common origin, because we belong to Allah, all and sundry, to Whom is our ultimate return, the whole of humanity is but one family, one nation, and should, ideally, form one fraternity, the universal brotherhood of man.

The differences of colour and languages, of build and of features are not regarded as differences of quality, or as marks or degrees of excellence, but as an expression of the diversity in nature:

Says the Holy Quran:

"AMONG HIS SIGNS IS THIS, THAT HE CREATED YOU FROM DUST: AND THEN. BEHOLD, YE ARE MEN SCATTERED (FAR AND WIDE)"

"AND AMONG HIS SIGNS IS THE CREATION OF THE HEAVENS AND THE EARTH. AND THE VARIATIONS AND DIVERSITY OF YOUR TONGUES AND OF YOUR COLOUR; VERILY IN THAT ARE SIGNS FOR THOSE WHO KNOW."

Holy Quran 30:22

Allama Yusuf Ali, commenting on this verse. remarks: "All mankind were created of a single pair of parents; yet they had spread to different climates and developed different languages and different shades of complexions. And yet. their basic unity remains unaltered. They feel in the same way, and are equally under God's care".

Whatever the country in which a people lives, whatever the language they speak, whatever the colour of their skin. they are recognized as one family, living under one roof — the canopy of heaven scattered, but of common origin:

Says the Holy Quran:

"O MANKIND! REVERENCE YOUR GUARDIAN-LORD, WHO CREATED YOU FROM A SINGLE PERSON, CREATED, OF LIKE NATURE, HIS MATE, AND FROM THEM TWAIN SCATTERED (LIKE SEEDS) COUNTLESS MEN AND WOMEN."

Holy Quran 4:1

UNITY OF MANKIND

There is one verse in the Holy Quran, however, which not only re-states the common origin of man, explains the division of humanity into nations, or race. and tribes, tells us that the object and purpose of this division was also the ultimate unification of humanity, but goes a step further It points out to us the one and only criterion, the only standard by which man is judged by God, and thus by which we

should also judge our fellow-man. As you will presently see. THIS CRITERION IS NOT HIS COLOUR. NOR HIS RACE. NOT HIS SOCIAL STANDING OR CASTE. NOT EVEN HIS SKILL AND THE DEGREE OF HIS INTELLIGENCE. It is something which to achieve lies within reach of every human being, black or brown. white or yellow, rich or poor, if only he made an effort to cultivate it within himself.

Says the Holy Quran:

"O MANKINDI WE CREATED YOU FROM A SINGLE (PAIR) OF A MALE AND A FEMALE, AND MADE YOU INTO NATIONS AND TRIBES, THAT YE MAY KNOW EACH OTHER NOT THAT YE MAY DESPISE EACH OTHER. VERILY THE MOST HONOURED OF YOU IN THE SIGHT OF GOD IS (HE WHO IS) THE MOST RIGHTEOUS OF YOU. AND GOD HAS FULL KNOWLEDGE AND IS WELL ACQUAINTED (WITH ALL THINGS)."

Holy Quran 49:13

"The principle of the brotherhood of man laid down here", observes an author of an English translation of the Holy Quran, "Is based on the broadest foundation. The address here Is not to believers: but to men In general, who are told that they are all, as It were, members of one family, and their divisions Into races, nations, tribes and families should not lead to estrangement from, but to a better knowledge of each other. Superiority of one over another In this vast brotherhood does not depend on race, nationality, wealth or rank but on righteousness, on the careful observance of duty towards God and fellow-man, on moral greatness", to which I may be permitted to add: and on the strength of one's "IMAN", of faith in the one and only God because it is through faith and through submission unto the will of God only through which we can attain to moral greatness.

This verse of the Holy Quran is the answer of Islam to racism, an answer which, as far as the Muslim community is concerned, did not remain a pious exhortation but sounded the death knell of racial discrimination in the World of Islam as borne out not only by the example set by the Holy Prophet Mohummed (P.B.U.H.); but also by subsequent events in the history of all Muslim nations and by the general attitude of the Muslims until the present day. I am inclined by personal experiences gathered during travels in almost all Muslim countries in the course of the last 25 years, to insist that. in consequence of these teachings of Islam and their translation into practice by the Holy Prophet (P.B.U.H.); such a complete change was wrought in the minds and hearts of all who embraced Islam, in the minds and hearts of all Muslims that is. that to them racial differences present no problems at all. nay, that they are largely almost totally unaware of. and most certainly little disturbed or embarrassed by, such differences,

A BEAUTIFUL PATTERN OF CONDUCT

There are instances galore in the life of the Holy Prophet Mohummed, upon whom be peace and the blessings of God, which show us that, as is the case with regard to all injunctions of the Holy Quran, he was the perfect exemplar, the beautiful pattern of conduct also with regard to the application and actualization of the principle of the brotherhood of man in his own dealings with his followers as well as in his personal relations with adherents of other faiths. But we can only appreciate fully how formidable a task it was to establish this principle among his followers, if we look at the social conditions which prevailed in Arabia before the advent of the Holy Prophet. Let me, in order to illustrate this point, quote from a book of a non-Muslim author, namely from "The Social Structure of Islam" by Reuben Levy: "The population of Arabia, outside of a few settled communities embedded In it, has throughout historical times been so constituted as to form a number of groups or tribes, very loosely held together either by loyalty to a particular leader or by the assumption of descent from a common ancestor, whether real or legendary. Within each of such groups or tribes, the Independence of Individual units — the tents or families — has always been taken as a matter of course, and the head of each unit has been regarded as being in status the equal of every other. In the heads of the families lies the power to elect the "SHAYKH" or tribal chief, of whom. in theory, no special qualification is required. In actual practice, however, there Is normally a strong prejudice In favour of choosing the "SHAYKH" from amongst the members of particular families. At the time of the rise of Mohammed such families held a position of great influence within the community, so that in any claim to authority the factor of birth was considered of paramount importance. Noble ancestry was the supreme test of nobility, and no person whose genealogy was not entirely free of hereditary taint — for example ancestors of servile or Negro origin — could be regarded as conforming to the requisite standard. Such persons were relegated to the humbler ranks of society and were thus compelled to undertake careers that Inevitably marked them as inferior beings ... In the same way that the old nobility resisted the assumption of equality by other Arabs, so the Inhabitants of Arabia as a whole refused to consider foreigners as being their peers."

The Arabs regarded themselves as a superior race. And as regards the Negroes they did not recognize them except as slaves.

It is to this situation to which the Holy Qur'an refers in the following verse:

"AND HOLD FAST ALL TOGETHER, BY THE ROPE WHICH GOD (STRETCHES OUT FOR YOU), AND BE NOT DIVIDED AMONG YOURSELVES; AND REMEMBER WITH GRATITUDE GOD*S FAVOUR ON YOU; FOR YE WERE ENEMIES. AND HE JOINED YOUR HEARTS IN LOVE, SO THAT BY HIS GRACE YE BECAME BRETHREN; AND YE WERE ON THE BRINK OF THE PIT OF FIRE. AND HE SAVED YOU FROM IT. THUS DOTH GOD MAKE HIS SIGNS CLEAR TO YOU: THAT YE MAY BE GUIDED."*
Holy Qu'ran 3:103

Among the measures introduced by the Holy Prophet of Islam to level the differences of rank and of race among his steadily growing community perhaps prayer ought to be mentioned in particular. Five times a day the Muslims meet together for prayer. Among the first Muslims were members of the noblest Arab families as well as a good number of Negro slaves. At prayers they all stood shoulder to shoulder before the Almighty, and when. in the further course of prayer, they prostrated before their Lord. it might well have been that the head of a noble Arab praying in a row behind a Negro slave rested at the latter's feet. In prayer and in the company of the Holy Prophet no differences of status was recognized between the two.

UNITY IN PRAYER

From standing side by side in the ranks of prayer, the next step was a mere corollary; they mingled freely on terms of perfect equality on all other occasions. Service to God was thus the door through which the fraternization of humanity was effected ... The Negro slaves and the noble Arab were made to meet together on terms of equality in prayer and in religious gatherings. It was thus impressed on their minds, that they were all equal before God. and life once moulded on these lines led to the natural consequence that the Negro slaves and the Arab nobility enjoyed equal status in society.

In the first Muslim community a Negro slave, Bilal, was chosen by the Holy Prophet himself to deliver the "Adhan", the call to prayer, while the Holy Prophet himself was the "Imam" or leader of congregation. Thus. of the two office-bearers of the Mosque, the Holy Prophet himself, of noble blood and birth, was one, the other being Bilal, a Negro.

In his famous oration, which he delivered on the occasion of his "Farewell Pilgrimage", his last pilgrimage before he closed his eyes forever, the Holy Prophet re-affirmed and re-stated the principle of equality and brotherhood of man in Islam, thus bequeathing it as a sacred legacy to generation after generation of Muslims after him until the present day. Let me quote from the oration:

"YE PEOPLE! LISTEN TO MY WORDS. FOR I KNOW NOT WHETHER ANOTHER YEAR WILL BE VOUCH SAFED TO ME AFTER THIS YEAR TO FIND MYSELF AMONGST YOU AT THIS PLACE."

"YOUR LIVES AND PROPERTY ARE SACRED AND INVIOLABLE AMONGST ONE ANOTHER UNTIL YE APPEAR BEFORE THE LORD ... AND REMEMBER. YE SHALL HAVE TO APPEAR

BEFORE YOUR LORD WHO SHALL DEMAND FROM YOU AN ACCOUNT OF ALL YOUR ACTIONS ... YE PEOPLE. YE HAVE RIGHTS OVER YOUR WIVES. AND YOUR WIVES HAVE RIGHTS OVER YOU. TREAT THEM WITH KINDNESS AND LOVE ... KEEP ALWAYS FAITHFUL TO THE TRUST REPOSED IN YOU."

••YE PEOPLE. LISTEN TO MY WORDS AND UNDERSTAND THEM. KNOW YE THAT ALL MUSLIMS ARE BROTHERS UNTO ONE ANOTHER. YE ARE ONE BROTHERHOOD."

"ALL MEN ARE EQUAL IN ISLAM. THE ARAB HAS NO SUPERIORITY OVER THE NON-ARAB. NOR DOES THE NON-ARAB HAVE SUPERIORITY OVER THE ARAB. SAVE IN THE FEAR OF GOD."

That the Holy Prophet's bequest was heeded and the example set by him was followed by subsequent generations of Muslims throughout the ages and history. It is impossible for me within the limits of the time allotted to me for this talk to render a detailed, much less a comprehensive account of all such facts and incidents which afford proof of my assertion. I can only quote some of them, and I may be permitted to do so at random:

One of the acid tests of unrestrained and unrestricted inter-racial relations are inter-racial marriages. That such marriages were never frowned upon by Muslims is borne out by the fact that many a Ruler of the Umayad and Abasside as well as of later dynasties. had Turkish, Greek or even Negro mothers.

On the other hand. social rank or high office did not bestow upon the bearer special privileges before the law and certainly did not entitle him to ill-treat a brother Muslim with impunity. The following incident which is reported to have occurred during the reign of Omar, the second Caliph after the death of the Holy Prophet is an example of absolute equality of all men in Islam.

EQUALITY BEFORE LAW

Jabbala, King of the Ghassanides, having embraced Islam, set out on a pilgrimage to Mecca. While performing the circumambulation of the Ka'aba. a humble pilgrim engaged in the same sacred duties, accidentally dropped a piece of his pilgrim's dress over the royal shoulders. Jabbala turned round furiously and struck him a blow. The poor man went to the Caliph and prayed for Justice. Omar sent for Jabbala and asked him why he has so ill-treated a brother Muslim. He answered that the man had insulted him, and had it not been for the sanctity of the place, he would have killed him on the spot. Omar replied that his words added to the gravity of his offence, and that. unless he obtained the pardon of the injured man he would have to submit to the penalty of the law. When Jabbala refused to do as he was bidden because — as he retorted — he was a king and the other only a common man, Omar replied "King or no king, both of you are Muslims and both of you are equal in the eye of the law."

But perhaps one of the most instructive examples of the policy of Islam towards different races is furnished by Spain. Permit me to quote from Syed Amir Ali's fundamental work "The Spirit of Islam":

"Immediately on their arrival on the soil of Spain, the Muslims or Saracens published an edict assuring to the subject races, without any difference, the most ample liberty. Suevi, Goth, Vandal, Roman and Jew, were all placed on an equal footing. Their women were Invited to intermarry with the conquerors.

...THE FIDELITY OF THE ARABS IN MAINTAINING THEIR PROMISES. THE EQUAL-HEADED JUSTICE WHICH THEY ADMINISTERED TO ALL RACES AND CLASSES. WITHOUT DISTINCTION OF ANY KIND. SECURED THEM THE CONFIDENCE OF THE PEOPLE ... The Jews profited most by the change of government", and when many centuries later Spain was re-conquered by Ferdinand and Issabella, innumerable Jews left the country for Muslim lands, preferring a life in exile under Muslim rule to life in their home-country under the new rulers of whose racial and religious tolerance they were not convinced.

RELIGIOUS TOLERANCE

And this is another aspect of the principle of the brotherhood of mankind as envisaged and enunciated by Islam: namely religious tolerance.

The essence of the attitude of Islam towards adherents of other faiths is to be found in the charter which was granted to the Jews by the Holy Prophet after his arrival in Medina, and in the message which he sent to the Christians of Najran, a town in Southern Arabia, then largely inhabited by Christians, after Islam had fully established itself in the Arab Peninsula.

"IN THE NAME OF THE MOST MERCIFUL AND COMPASSIONATE GOD." says this first charter of freedom of conscience. "GIVEN BY MOHUMMED. THE HOLY PROPHET. TO THE BELIEVERS. WHETHER OF THE QURESH OR OF YATHRIB — (AS MEDINA WAS THEN CALLED) — AND TO ALL INDIVIDUALS. OF WHATEVER ORIGIN. WHO HAVE MADE COMMON CAUSE WITH THEM: ALL THESE SHALL CONSTITUTE ONE NATION ... THE JEWS WHO ATTACH THEMSELVES TO OUR COMMONWEALTH SHALL BE PROTECTED FROM ALL INSULTS AND VEXATIONS: THEY SHALL HAVE AN EQUAL RIGHT WITH OUR PEOPLE TO OUR ASSISTANCE AND GOOD OFFICES. THE JEWS OF THE VARIOUS BRANCHES — (and here follows the names of the various Jewish tribes of Medina and the surrounding territories) — AND ALL OTHERS DOMICILED IN YATHRIB. SHALL FORM WITH THE MUSLIMS ONE COMPOSITE NATION; THEY SHALL PRACTICE THEIR RELIGION AS FREELY AS THE MUSLIMS; THE CLIENTS — MEANING THE PROTECTED. AND THE ALLIES OF THE JEWS SHALL ENJOY THE SAME SECURITY AND FREEDOM."

This was a paraphrase of the Charter granted by the Holy Prophet to the Jews after he had arrived in Yathrib. a town which because of him became known as MEDINAT-UN-NABI — THE CITY OF THE HOLY PROPHET, or in short Medina, while the message to the Christians of Najran, sent to them almost at the end of the Holy Prophet's mission, runs as follows:

MESSAGE TO CHRISTIANS

"TO THE CHRISTIANS OF NAJRAN AND THE NEIGHBOURING TERRITORIES. THE SECURITY OF GOD AND THE PLEDGE OF HIS PROPHET ARE EXTENDED FOR THEIR LIVES, THEIR RELIGION, AND THEIR PROPERTY — TO THE PRESENT AS WELL AS THE ABSENT AND OTHERS BESIDES, THERE SHALL BE NO INTERFERENCE WITH THE PRACTICE OF THEIR FAITH OR THEIR OBSERVANCES; NOR ANY CHANGE IN THEIR RIGHTS OR PRIVILEGES; NO BISHOP SHALL BE REMOVED FROM HIS BISHORPIC; NOR ANY MONK FROM HIS MONASTERY, NOR ANY PRIEST FROM HIS PRIESTHOOD, AND THEY SHALL CONTINUE TO ENJOY EVERYTHING GREAT AND SMALL AS HERETOFORE: NO IMAGE OR CROSS SHALL BE DESTROYED. THEY SHALL NOT OPPRESS OR BE OPPRESSED; THEY SHALL NOT PRACTICE THE RIGHTS OF BLOOD VENGEANCE AS IN THE DAYS OF IGNORANCE — (the era before the advent of Islam) — ; NO TITLES SHALL BE LEVIED FROM THEM NOR SHALL THEY BE REQUIRED TO FURNISH PROVISIONS FOR THE TROOPS."

"This document," observes Syed Amir Ali in his book quoted before "has furnished the guiding principle to all Muslim rulers in their mode of dealing with their non-Muslim subjects, and if they have departed from it In any Instance the cause Is to be found in the character of the particular king. If we separate the political necessity which has often spoken and acted in the name of religion, no faith is more tolerant than Islam to the followers of other creeds. "Reasons of State" may have led a sovereign here and there to display a certain degree of intolerance, or to insist upon a certain uniformity of faith; BUT THE SYSTEM ITSELF HAS EVER MAINTAINED THE MOST COMPLETE TOLERANCE. Christians and Jews, as a rule, have never been molested in the exercise of their religion, or forced to change their faith. If they are required to pay a special tax, It Is in lieu of military service, and it Is but right that those who enjoy the protection of the State should also contribute in some shape to the public burdens. Towards the Idolaters there was greater strictness In theory, but in practice the law was equally liberal. If at any time they were treated with harshness, the cause is to be found In the passions of the ruler of the population. The religious element was used only as pretext."

If there have been instances of religious intolerance in the history of the Muslim nations, these instances — and that should be very clearly understood — did not happen because of Islam but inspite of Islam and they only betray lack of knowledge of the teachings of Islam, and of understanding of the spirit and principles of that religion.

You might like to interpose here that the idea of racial equality and of the brotherhood of mankind is not the exclusive property of Islam, nay that these ideas have been proclaimed by different individuals and ideologies in different places of our globe and at different times. You might like to quote to me — as I did to you — from various sacred and profane works of the most dissimilar authors, and you will certainly insist that in the West — in Europe and America — this idea has been accepted and adopted as a principle or policy, of organized society, since the 18thcentury at the latest when the Age of Enlightenment had dawned and the French Revolution had sounded the clarion call of "Liberte, Egalite, Fraternlte!"

EQUALITY IN ACTION

I certainly cannot and shall not claim that the idea of racial equality and of human brotherhood is the invention of Islam and has only been proclaimed by that religion and by nobody else. BUT I CLAIM AND INSIST THAT ONLY IN AND AMONG THROUGH ISLAM HAS THIS IDEA EVER BEEN REALIZED IN ACTION OVER CENTURIES AND AMONG THE MOST DIFFERENT AND DISSIMILAR NATIONS AND RACES.

Inspite of the lofty ideals of Enlightenment and of the French Revolution the West did not and has still not solved the racial problem, nor has the West been able until today to establish racial equality everywhere in its hemisphere. It is barely thirty years ago racism raised to the position of State Philosophy — the most brutal and barbaric racism that can be imagined — the one I referred to at the very beginning of my talk, was crushed in my own country. Racism in the shape of "Apartheid" is still allowed to raise its ugly head in South Africa, and racism is certainly not eradicated in the United States inspite of the abolition of slavery that took place some time ago and inspite of legislation introduced after the Second World War, aiming at the levelling of differences between the various racial groups and at the doing away with racial discrimination. In the Socialist World. Marxism Leninism or Communism has introduced its own brand and type of racism — namely what I may be permitted to call "IDEOLOGICAL RACISM" WHICH IS AS HATEFUL AND ABHORRENT AS BIOLOGICAL RACISM. So. wherever we look we find that neither the ideals of Age of Enlightenment and of the French Revolution, nor the UN Charter of Human Rights, the latest exercise in bringing about racial equality and in abolishing racial discrimination have been able to achieve their goal. while Islam has most certainly done so.

I may be forgiven if at this place I narrate some of my own personal experiences as a Muslim:

I mentioned before that in the course of the last 25 years or so I have visited almost every Muslim country and I have been posted for longer or shorter periods in about half a dozen of them. Wherever I went I was immediately accepted by the local Muslims as one of theirs, and my religious affiliation proved to have an incomparably stronger and deeper effect on them than my nationality or the colour of my skin. As a matter of fact the latter were of absolutely no consequence at all in their attitude towards me. And when I married a young Muslim lady from Pakistan, more than 22 years ago, it did not create the slightest embarrassment to the family of my wife nor to us. the young couple. The marriage was accepted with the same naturalness as any marriage of two Pakistanis, and no one of my Muslim relatives or friends ever considered or treated our children as half cast in the ugly meaning of that word, nor were my children ever made to feel any different from full-blooded Pakistani, or full-blooded German children. They. who grew up among Muslims never knew of racial differences between men until — yes, until in the wake of one of our numerous transfers from one post to another we perforce had to make a brief sojourn in South Africa. There they saw for the first time in their life those ugly signs "For Whites Only." And it was there that they were made to realize that in a country where racism reigns, Ahmed cannot play football in the street with John. and Laila cannot just drop in at Linda's to admire her new doll. And what a shock they got when they saw that their father and their mother, in order to do such a simple transaction as to buy postage stamps, had to enter the post office through different doors.

— But then they stood in front of a beautiful church. and their perturbed minds were set at rest when,— for it was Christmas time — they read the invitation written in bold letters above the door: "ALL ARE WELCOME." UNTIL THEY NOTICED. IN SMALLER. MUCH SMALLER LETTERS, ONCE AGAIN THE UGLY SIGN "FOR WHITES ONLY!" So even here. in the House of God. and during Christmas, the Festival of Joy and of Love. there was no bridge to cross the deep. deep gap between fellow human-beings who have everything else in common — except the colour of their skin.

THE SUCCESS OF ISLAM

Why. then, has Islam succeeded' where other systems and ideologies seem to have failed? What is the secret of its success, and in what way can the religion of Islam contribute to the solution of the racial problem under which millions and millions of our fellow human-beings are still reeling?

In my humble opinion Islam has succeeded where other systems and ideologies have failed because of two decisive factors: NAMELY THE UNIVERSALITY OF ITS TEACHINGS AND THE DIVINE SANCTION ON WHICH THE ISLAMIC CONCEPT OF THE BROTHERHOOD OF MANKIND IS BASED.

A Muslim believes that Islam is not only the last of the world's great religions but also an all-inclusive religion which contains within itself all religions which went before it. It is one of its most striking characteristics that it requires its followers to believe that all great religions of the world that preceded it have been revealed by God. and it is a fundamental principle of Islam that a Muslim must also believe in all prophets who were raised up before the Holy Prophet Mohummed (P.B.U.H.). Prophets, according to the express teachings of the Holy Quran were sent by God to all nations:

Says the Holy Quran:

"AND THERE IS NOT A NATION BUT A WARNER HAS GONE AMONG THEM."

Holy Quran 13:7

But whereas all previous prophets were sent with SPECIFIC MISSIONS TO THEIR OWN PEOPLE ONLY. the Holy Prophet Mohummed (P.B.U.H.) was SENT TO ALL NATIONS OF THE EARTH, as the Holy Quran teaches us:

"O MANKIND! I AM THE APOSTLE THAT HATH COME TO YOU IN TRUTH FROM GOD:

Holy Quran 4:170

and elsewhere:

"WE SENT THEE NOT BUT AS A MERCY FOR ALL NATIONS."

Holy Quran 21:107

"There is no question now," say Allama Yusuf Ali in his commentary to this chosen verse, of race or nation, of a 'CHOSEN PEOPLE' or 'THE SEED OF ABRAHAM' or the 'SEED OF DAVID;' or of Hindu Arya-Varta, of Jew or Gentile, Arab or 'Ajam, Turk or Tajik, European or Asiatic, White or Coloured; Aryan, Semitic, Mongolian, or African; or American, Australian or Polynesian." The Holy Prophet Mohummed, upon whom be peace and the blessings of God, was sent to them all — and that distinguishes him from all other prophets, and that also distinguishes Islam from all other religions. The message that was revealed to the Holy Prophet Mohummed (P.B.U.H.) from On High was a message addressed to all nations on earth, and the principles set forth in that message applied universally to the whole mankind. He was the last of the prophets, and Islam, based on the revelation which the Hoty Prophet received is the final and perfect expression of the Divine Will.

Says the Holy Quran:

"THIS DAY HAVE I PERFECTED YOUR RELIGION FOR YOU, COMPLETED MY FAVOUR UPON YOU. AND HAVE CHOSEN FOR YOU ISLAM AS YOUR RELIGION."

Holy Quran 5:4

It is the self-same God. the Supreme Being, the Ultimate Cause, the One and Only, our Lord and Creator Who has also spoken to us. through the mouth of the Holy Prophet Mohummed (P.B.U.H.). the words which I have already quoted earlier and which I should like to call back into our memory:

AND MANKIND IS NAUGHT BUT A SINGLE NATION."

Holy Quran 2:213

"VERILY. O MANKIND. WE CREATED YOU FROM A SINGLE (PAIR) OF A MALE AND A FEMALE AND MADE YOU INTO NATIONS AND TRIBES. THAT YE MAY KNOW EACH OTHER. (NOT THAT YE DESPISE EACH OTHER). VERILY THE MOST HONOURED OF YOU IN THE SIGHT OF GOD IS HE WHO IS THE MOST RIGHTEOUS (AND GOD-FEARING. DUTIFUL) OF YOU."

Holy Quran 49:13

In Islam and to every single one of its followers the equality of man and the brotherhood of mankind are not the figment of the human brain and mind. They are guiding principles decreed by God.

Equality and Fraternity, as well as liberty, according to the teachings of Islam, are religious categories. and only where they are conceived as such can these lofty ideals become reality.

There is no road to the unification of humanity, no road to a brotherhood of man which knows no boundaries of colour, race. country, language and rank except through God. the Creator and "Rabb" of all that is in the heavens and on earth. Without absolute and unreserved faith in Him. and in the truth and universality of His revelation — without the will to serve Him, which is the purpose of our creation, and to follow His commandments and guidance this goal can never be achieved as history tells us.

ABSOLUTE VALUES

Only God. the Absolute, has established absolute values by which we can assess our and our fellow-

"VERILY THE MOST HONOURED OF YOU IN THE SIGHT OF GOD, O MEN, IS HE WHO IS THE MOST RIGHTEOUS, THE MOST GOD-FEARING, OF YOU."

Holy Quran 49:13

This is the yard stick by which in Islam man is measured, and not his race, caste, or rank.

Peace and mutual trust among individuals and nations alike can only be brought about if we base our inter-human relations on the recognition of. and strict adherence to. ABSOLUTE VALUES. Materialism. humanity's ideal in modern times, lacks all prerequisites because its VALUE CONCEPTS CHANGE FROM TIME TO TIME AND FROM PLACE TO PLACE. Islam is the only force which provides man with the spiritual and moral foundation on which lasting peace and mutual trust and respect among the nations of the world can be built. Islam is, first and foremost an international religion, and it is before the grand international ideal of Islam, the ideal of the equality of all races and of the unity of the human kind. an ideal founded on the belief in the Oneness of God. that the curse of racism and narrow minded nationalism, which have been and still are responsible for many of the troubles of the ancient and the modern world, can be swept away.

The Muslim Community, past and present, has not only established true and lasting brotherhood among its members, a brotherhood that encompasses everyone who belongs to it, irrespective of racial or social differences, it has also shown us by its example the road to this goal. THE STARTING

POINT IS FAITH, UNQUESTIONING FAITH IN GOD. THE "RABB" OF THE WORLD. From there it leads us to submission unto His will — the stage at which we willingly and cheerfully obey His commandments and actualize the principles laid down by Hi m for our actions and conduct — until we reach the stage of superegatory service to God and men. The road leads us. to use Arabic terms, from IMAN, FAITH, to ISLAM, SUBMISSION and ULTIMATELY to IHSAN (Goodness). And this is the road we have to tread if we want to bring about mutual respect and trust among men, the road to the abolition of all racial and social discriminations, the road to the unification of mankind, to the universal brotherhood to which the assembly of Muslims of all races and from every nook and corner of the world at Mecca during the day of Hajj of Pilgrimage bears witness. But this assembly also shows us that our unity lies in God, and in God only.

May we be inspired by their faith and example; may we follow their road, A'ameen!

Mohummed Aman Hobohm

[cnorman18]

From Wikipedia:

"224 of 300 suicide terror attacks from 1980 to 2003 compiled by the Chicago Project on Suicide Terrorism involved Islamist groups or terrorist acts in Muslim-majority lands.[42] Another tabulation found a massive increase in suicide bombings in the two years following Papes study and that the overwhelming majority of these bombers were motivated by the ideology of Islamist martyrdom.[43] According to still another estimate, as of early 2008, 1,121 Muslim suicide bombers have blown themselves up in Iraq alone.[44]"

"The majority of Sunni scholars reject suicide .[52] However, some top authorities support suicide attacks on perceived enemies of Islam. Sheikh Yusuf al-Qaradawi, sometimes called "the world's most quoted independent Islamic jurist",[53] has called martyrdom operations: the greatest of all sorts of Jihad in the Cause of Allah.... Other clerics have supported attacks in connection with Palestine. Sunni Iraqi Cleric, Sheikh Ahmad Al-Qubeisi has proclaimed that "those who commit martyrdom [i.e. suicide] operations who are, by Allah, the greatest martyrs in Islamic history..."[55] Amongst others the Imam of the Grand Mosque in Mecca, Abd Al-Rahman Al-Sudayyis,[56], the former President of Al-Azhar University, Ahmad 'Omar Hashem[57] and Cleric, Sheikh Ibrahim Mudeiris of Gaza[58] have all urged on suicide operations by Muslims."

"Faisal Bodi... has written in The Guardian that, "in the Muslim world, then, we celebrate what we call the martyr-bombers. To us they are heroes defending the things we hold sacred. Polls in the Middle East show 75% of people in favour of martyr-bombings."[53] Nevertheless, Islamist militant organisations (including Al-Qaeda, Hamas and Islamic Jihad) continue to argue that suicide operations are justified according to Islamic law, despite Islam's strict prohibition of suicide and murder.[65][66]"

As you see, some imams and other Muslim authorities DO justify suicide bombing and the murder of innocents, just as I said. Now, what is the bigger problem to you - the fact that these clerics misrepresent and pervert your religion, or the fact that non-Muslims think that that is a problem?

One would hope that you think it's a problem, too, and not label, falsely, those who call attention to it "liars."

[TrueReligion]

From Wikipedia:

"224 of 300 suicide terror attacks from 1980 to 2003 compiled by the Chicago Project on Suicide Terrorism involved Islamist groups or terrorist acts in Muslim-majority lands.[42] Another tabulation found a massive increase in suicide bombings in the two years following Papes study and that the overwhelming majority of these bombers were motivated by the ideology of Islamist martyrdom.[43] According to still another estimate, as of early 2008, 1,121 Muslim suicide bombers have blown themselves up in Iraq alone.[44]"

"The majority of Sunni scholars reject suicide .[52] However, some top authorities support suicide attacks on perceived enemies of Islam. Sheikh Yusuf al-Qaradawi, sometimes called "the world's most quoted independent Islamic jurist",[53] has called martyrdom operations: the greatest of all sorts of Jihad in the Cause of Allah.... Other clerics have supported attacks in connection with Palestine. Sunni Iraqi Cleric, Sheikh Ahmad Al-Qubeisi has proclaimed that "those who commit martyrdom [i.e. suicide] operations who are, by Allah, the greatest martyrs in Islamic history..."[55] Amongst others the Imam of the Grand Mosque in Mecca, Abd Al-Rahman Al-Sudayyis,[56], the former President of Al-Azhar University, Ahmad 'Omar Hashem[57] and Cleric, Sheikh Ibrahim Mudeiris of Gaza[58] have all urged on suicide operations by Muslims."

"Faisal Bodi... has written in The Guardian that, "in the Muslim world, then, we celebrate what we call the martyr-bombers. To us they are heroes defending the things we hold sacred. Polls in the Middle East show 75% of people in favour of martyr-bombings."[53] Nevertheless, Islamist militant organisations (including Al-Qaeda, Hamas and Islamic Jihad) continue to argue that suicide operations are justified according to Islamic law, despite Islam's strict prohibition of suicide and murder.[65][66]"

As you see, some imams and other Muslim authorities DO justify suicide bombing and the murder of innocents, just as I said. Now, what is the bigger problem to you - the fact that these clerics misrepresent and pervert your religion, or the fact that non-Muslims think that that is a problem?

One would hope that you think it's a problem, too, and not label, falsely, those who call attention to it "liars."

What all you posted, is report given of suicide bombers in Iraq, and from Palestine, who did in Israel.
These acts are purely political base, and not on religious base, so we can;t go deep in this, as its not allowed in this debate.
Just I will say, you yet have to read the post, and other posts where we discuss in details about these attacks, the reason for them, and justification.

Like, what was the justification you can give me for US invading iraq, and killing thousands of people? did you write anything about it? Ofcourse NO.

What justification you can give for Israel attacks on Palestinian people. do you think the Palestine guys will just sit, relax and let Israel keep killing their country-men, raping women, killing innocent children?

What other justification you can give for US and others invading and doing carpet bombing in Afghanistan?

Have you ever wrote or any1 in west protest or writen anything against India, who is killing thousands of Muslims in Kashmir, where UN resolution has passed that Kashmir should be a free state, and India capturing it by force, and if Kashmiris retaliate, they are named as terrorists? is this you call your civilization?

Do you have nay justification for all these? and than you expect that Muslims wil just sit and keep dying ? they dont have right to attack back?

[cnorman18]

From Wikipedia:

"224 of 300 suicide terror attacks from 1980 to 2003 compiled by the Chicago Project on Suicide Terrorism involved Islamist groups or terrorist acts in Muslim-majority lands.[42] Another tabulation found a massive increase in suicide bombings in the two years following Papes study and that the overwhelming majority of these bombers were motivated by the ideology of Islamist martyrdom.[43] According to still another estimate, as of early 2008, 1,121 Muslim suicide bombers have blown themselves up in Iraq alone.[44]"

"The majority of Sunni scholars reject suicide .[52] However, some top authorities support suicide attacks on perceived enemies of Islam. Sheikh Yusuf al-Qaradawi, sometimes called "the world's most quoted independent Islamic jurist",[53] has called martyrdom operations: the greatest of all sorts of Jihad in the Cause of Allah.... Other clerics have supported attacks in connection with Palestine. Sunni Iraqi Cleric, Sheikh Ahmad Al-Qubeisi has proclaimed that "those who commit martyrdom [i.e. suicide] operations who are, by Allah, the greatest martyrs in Islamic history..."[55] Amongst others the Imam of the Grand Mosque in Mecca, Abd Al-Rahman Al-Sudayyis,[56], the former President of Al-Azhar University, Ahmad 'Omar Hashem[57] and Cleric, Sheikh Ibrahim Mudeiris of Gaza[58] have all urged on suicide operations by Muslims."

"Faisal Bodi... has written in The Guardian that, "in the Muslim world, then, we celebrate what we call the martyr-bombers. To us they are heroes defending the things we hold sacred. Polls in the Middle East show 75% of people in favour of martyr-bombings."[53] Nevertheless, Islamist militant organisations (including Al-Qaeda, Hamas and Islamic Jihad) continue to argue that suicide operations are justified according to Islamic law, despite Islam's strict prohibition of suicide and murder.[65][66]"

As you see, some imams and other Muslim authorities DO justify suicide bombing and the murder of innocents, just as I said. Now, what is the bigger problem to you - the fact that these clerics misrepresent and pervert your religion, or the fact that non-Muslims think that that is a problem?

One would hope that you think it's a problem, too, and not label, falsely, those who call attention to it "liars."

What all you posted, is report given of suicide bombers in Iraq, and from Palestine, who did in Israel.
These acts are purely political base, and not on religious base, so we can;t go deep in this, as its not allowed in this debate.

Did you not notice that every one of the authorities quoted above are Muslim clerics and authorities speaking specifically about the religious justification for mass murder? THAT is certainly "allowed" in this debate. The fact that you choose not to address the issue proves my point yet again. For whatever reason, you don't see a problem with your own religious community here, but only the problems of others.

Just I will say, you yet have to read the post, and other posts where we discuss in details about these attacks, the reason for them, and justification.

Like, what was the justification you can give me for US invading iraq, and killing thousands of people? did you write anything about it? Ofcourse NO.

What justification you can give for Israel attacks on Palestinian people. do you think the Palestine guys will just sit, relax and let Israel keep killing their country-men, raping women, killing innocent children?

What other justification you can give for US and others invading and doing carpet bombing in Afghanistan?

Have you ever wrote or any1 in west protest or writen anything against India, who is killing thousands of Muslims in Kashmir, where UN resolution has passed that Kashmir should be a free state, and India capturing it by force, and if Kashmiris retaliate, they are named as terrorists? is this you call your civilization?

Do you have nay justification for all these? and than you expect that Muslims wil just sit and keep dying ? they dont have right to attack back?

Never mind. You have made it clear that you can only blame others for the perversion of Islam and for the horrors both preached and committed by your own co-religionists.

Blowing up innocent teenagers at pizzerias, families at religious services, children on school buses, and children and pregnant women at bus stops can be justified by nothing. Even if your charges here were true, which I do not grant, they would not make those things moral or right. Period, full stop.

Slavery, as in open-air slave markets operated in public in Muslim lands, can be justified by nothing. Cultural traditions count for nothing against the horror of trafficking in human beings, and "we're working on it" is hard to accept as adequate when you claim Islam "eliminated slavery" a thousand years ago.

You are continuing to prove my point; you justify or deny these things, and have still shown no interest at all in eliminating them or even speaking out against them. You won't even admit that they exist or have anything to do with your religion, which is nonsense obvious to everyone.

If you haven't noticed, we have a new Administration in Washington; we threw the guys out that you're complaining about, and in the Congress too. When are Muslims going to do the same? When are you even going to develop a real democracy where that CAN happen?

It would appear that your answer is "Never! It isn't needed! There are no problems of any kind anywhere that can be blamed on Muslims! They are all the fault of evil, lying unbelievers!"

I think I'll just leave it at that. No point in going on with this "debate." my points have all been conclusively proven, and by you.

[Heterodoxus]

Islam is the religion of PEACE, and is spred in the world Peacefully. not like christinaity and Judaism.

I've only two things to say here:

• 1: Ottoman Empire, and
  
  2: Armenian genocide.

[TrueReligion]

Did you not notice that every one of the authorities quoted above are Muslim clerics and authorities speaking specifically about the religious justification for mass murder? THAT is certainly "allowed" in this debate. The fact that you choose not to address the issue proves my point yet again. For whatever reason, you don't see a problem with your own religious community here, but only the problems of others.

You are not understanding, the issue is this that the clerics gave permision for these attacks if any rage is made against innocent peoples, like in Iraq, US invade for no reason, and start killing thousands of people, now these people retaliate, against US army, and Iraq police (US-based). So I dont understand how you are proving your point, infact your point is refuted here.

Just I will say, you yet have to read the post, and other posts where we discuss in details about these attacks, the reason for them, and justification.

Never mind. You have made it clear that you can only blame others for the perversion of Islam and for the horrors both preached and committed by your own co-religionists.

Blowing up innocent teenagers at pizzerias, families at religious services, children on school buses, and children and pregnant women at bus stops can be justified by nothing. Even if your charges here were true, which I do not grant, they would not make those things moral or right. Period, full stop.

Slavery, as in open-air slave markets operated in public in Muslim lands, can be justified by nothing. Cultural traditions count for nothing against the horror of trafficking in human beings, and "we're working on it" is hard to accept as adequate when you claim Islam "eliminated slavery" a thousand years ago.

You are continuing to prove my point; you justify or deny these things, and have still shown no interest at all in eliminating them or even speaking out against them. You won't even admit that they exist or have anything to do with your religion, which is nonsense obvious to everyone.

If you haven't noticed, we have a new Administration in Washington; we threw the guys out that you're complaining about, and in the Congress too. When are Muslims going to do the same? When are you even going to develop a real democracy where that CAN happen?

It would appear that your answer is "Never! It isn't needed! There are no problems of any kind anywhere that can be blamed on Muslims! They are all the fault of evil, lying unbelievers!"

I think I'll just leave it at that. No point in going on with this "debate." my points have all been conclusively proven, and by you.

You are again going against the topic and post, I clearly mention that the attacks is allowed, only in case when some1 rage war against you for no reason, and West and US rage war against Muslims for no reason, and so Muslims have full right to attack back. so all your points are given answer, and in the end its concluded that your points came out of ignorance, and no knowledge and history of what is hapening in the world.

[TrueReligion]

Islam is the religion of PEACE, and is spred in the world Peacefully. not like christinaity and Judaism.

I've only two things to say here:

• 1: Ottoman Empire, and
  
  2: Armenian genocide.

Was this because of religious or political reason? you are mixing political and religiogous attacks together my friend, the both you mention comes in category of political fight, which is common in every nation.

What you call forceful conversion of religion, Philipine is an example of that, and Spain as well, where people were converted to Christnaity by force.

[cnorman18]

Did you not notice that every one of the authorities quoted above are Muslim clerics and authorities speaking specifically about the religious justification for mass murder? THAT is certainly "allowed" in this debate. The fact that you choose not to address the issue proves my point yet again. For whatever reason, you don't see a problem with your own religious community here, but only the problems of others.

You are not understanding, the issue is this that the clerics gave permision for these attacks if any rage is made against innocent peoples, like in Iraq, US invade for no reason, and start killing thousands of people, now these people retaliate, against US army, and Iraq police (US-based). So I dont understand how you are proving your point, infact your point is refuted here.

Is it? I am talking about attacks on innocent civilians, not on the Army. Like 9/11, on which date a group of Muslims, for specifically religious reasons, murdered 3,000 innocent American civilians (and when Palestinians, among other Muslims, handed out candy and danced in the streets) - and that was BEFORE the Iraq or Afghanistan wars. Like the incidents I mentioned above; mass murders of unarmed, noncombatant civilians, including children. Like blowing up airplanes filled with people who have nothing to do with your political complaints.

"Retaliation" is not an acceptable reason for any of this. If someone murders your wife, it's not a moral or righteous act to murder HIS wife. If you think that it is, then you believe that murdering innocents, which the Koran specifically prohibits, is moral and good - and you falsify and betray your own religion.

Just I will say, you yet have to read the post, and other posts where we discuss in details about these attacks, the reason for them, and justification.

I'm engaging you on THIS thread, and it's not my job to hunt down your comments elsewhere.

Never mind. You have made it clear that you can only blame others for the perversion of Islam and for the horrors both preached and committed by your own co-religionists.

Blowing up innocent teenagers at pizzerias, families at religious services, children on school buses, and children and pregnant women at bus stops can be justified by nothing. Even if your charges here were true, which I do not grant, they would not make those things moral or right. Period, full stop.

Slavery, as in open-air slave markets operated in public in Muslim lands, can be justified by nothing. Cultural traditions count for nothing against the horror of trafficking in human beings, and "we're working on it" is hard to accept as adequate when you claim Islam "eliminated slavery" a thousand years ago.

You are continuing to prove my point; you justify or deny these things, and have still shown no interest at all in eliminating them or even speaking out against them. You won't even admit that they exist or have anything to do with your religion, which is nonsense obvious to everyone.

If you haven't noticed, we have a new Administration in Washington; we threw the guys out that you're complaining about, and in the Congress too. When are Muslims going to do the same? When are you even going to develop a real democracy where that CAN happen?

It would appear that your answer is "Never! It isn't needed! There are no problems of any kind anywhere that can be blamed on Muslims! They are all the fault of evil, lying unbelievers!"

I think I'll just leave it at that. No point in going on with this "debate." my points have all been conclusively proven, and by you.

You are again going against the topic and post, I clearly mention that the attacks is allowed, only in case when some1 rage war against you for no reason, and West and US rage war against Muslims for no reason, and so Muslims have full right to attack back. so all your points are given answer, and in the end its concluded that your points came out of ignorance, and no knowledge and history of what is hapening in the world.

Sorry; as I said, "I gave that answer somewhere else" isn't acceptable. Either post a link to your previous remarks or briefly repeat them here.

I notice that you have stopped talking about slavery under Muslim rule in the present day. Very well; silence is an answer.

As for suicide bombing and the mass murder of innocents, I'll make it really easy for you: Just explain how deliberately targeting and murdering a bus full of school children is a moral and justified act, under ANY circumstances or for ANY reason. These are the attacks that these clerics sanction. I can't wait to see your explanation of how that is a morally justifiable act. If you don't think that it is, then explain to me why Muslim clerics teaching that it is a SACRED and HOLY act that immediately places the mass murderer's soul in Paradise isn't a Muslim problem.

If you had bothered to read the very article you quoted, you'd have seen that there ARE Muslim clerics who oppose and denounce these false teachings on the part of other Muslim clerics.

Why can't you?

Or do you really believe that there are good reasons for murdering children?

Remember: "You did it first" isn't an acceptable answer, even if it's true. If it was wrong when it was done to you, it's wrong when when you do it to others - and it also removes your right to complain about it being done to you in the first place.

[TrueReligion]

Is it? I am talking about attacks on innocent civilians, not on the Army. Like 9/11, on which date a group of Muslims, for specifically religious reasons, murdered 3,000 innocent American civilians (and when Palestinians, among other Muslims, handed out candy and danced in the streets) - and that was BEFORE the Iraq or Afghanistan wars. Like the incidents I mentioned above; mass murders of unarmed, noncombatant civilians, including children. Like blowing up airplanes filled with people who have nothing to do with your political complaints.

You call 9/11 job of Muslims? you must be kidding, every1 knows whats the plan and mind working behind that, seems you make your assumptions only from 1 media, and believe everything which it say, wakeup and see whats in other part of world, so you could know the truth.
By the way, all you talk is muslim terrorists, never I heard here about any other religions here, why?
Out of the good things mentioned about Islam in the article, you choosed only the thing to attack Islam. What a neutral debate you have done, WOW

"Retaliation" is not an acceptable reason for any of this. If someone murders your wife, it's not a moral or righteous act to murder HIS wife. If you think that it is, then you believe that murdering innocents, which the Koran specifically prohibits, is moral and good - and you falsify and betray your own religion.

Yeah, dats the same thing west is doing, that if few bad peoples from Islam, did bad thing, the punishment is being given to all muslims, is this you call morals and your western civilization?

I'm engaging you on THIS thread, and it's not my job to hunt down your comments elsewhere.

Than you have to read the history of terrorism .

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_terrorism

and tell me than who started the terrorist attacks? is it muslims or non-muslims, and why only Muslims are blamed now, if others do, their political reason or some other reason is given, why you people make double standard?

Sorry; as I said, "I gave that answer somewhere else" isn't acceptable. Either post a link to your previous remarks or briefly repeat them here.

I notice that you have stopped talking about slavery under Muslim rule in the present day. Very well; silence is an answer.

And Ive noticec that you brought slavery out of nowhere in this post, rather than topic of the racial problem that Islam eliminate, as well as slavery. but you never talk related to post, and good thing about what is writen, instead you choose something else, means the intention is quite clear, to attack Islam, and not hear any good side of Islam

As for suicide bombing and the mass murder of innocents, I'll make it really easy for you: Just explain how deliberately targeting and murdering a bus full of school children is a moral and justified act, under ANY circumstances or for ANY reason. These are the attacks that these clerics sanction. I can't wait to see your explanation of how that is a morally justifiable act. If you don't think that it is, then explain to me why Muslim clerics teaching that it is a SACRED and HOLY act that immediately places the mass murderer's soul in Paradise isn't a Muslim problem.

No muslim would made such an attack on children., instead these kind of attacks were made by Israel, on the children of Palestine, but the neutral behaviour of every1 here dont even want to listen to that, and call it justification that Palestinians deserve this, This is what you call your morals?

If you had bothered to read the very article you quoted, you'd have seen that there ARE Muslim clerics who oppose and denounce these false teachings on the part of other Muslim clerics.

Why can't you?



Or do you really believe that there are good reasons for murdering children?

Remember: "You did it first" isn't an acceptable answer, even if it's true. If it was wrong when it was done to you, it's wrong when when you do it to others - and it also removes your right to complain about it being done to you in the first place.

Again, murder of children is not done by muslims, instead done by non-muslims of muslim children, but I didnt hear anything from you against that, so does that mean that muslim children are not humans?
But also I have;nt seen any of your justification of attacks on muslim civilians done so far, you keep on insisting about muslims attacking non-muslims, wat about non-muslim attacking muslims? your silence means you are agreeing for that I guess so....

[cnorman18]

Is it? I am talking about attacks on innocent civilians, not on the Army. Like 9/11, on which date a group of Muslims, for specifically religious reasons, murdered 3,000 innocent American civilians (and when Palestinians, among other Muslims, handed out candy and danced in the streets) - and that was BEFORE the Iraq or Afghanistan wars. Like the incidents I mentioned above; mass murders of unarmed, noncombatant civilians, including children. Like blowing up airplanes filled with people who have nothing to do with your political complaints.

You call 9/11 job of Muslims? you must be kidding, every1 knows whats the plan and mind working behind that, seems you make your assumptions only from 1 media, and believe everything which it say, wakeup and see whats in other part of world, so you could know the truth.
By the way, all you talk is muslim terrorists, never I heard here about any other religions here, why?
Out of the good things mentioned about Islam in the article, you choosed only the thing to attack Islam. What a neutral debate you have done, WOW

"Retaliation" is not an acceptable reason for any of this. If someone murders your wife, it's not a moral or righteous act to murder HIS wife. If you think that it is, then you believe that murdering innocents, which the Koran specifically prohibits, is moral and good - and you falsify and betray your own religion.

Yeah, dats the same thing west is doing, that if few bad peoples from Islam, did bad thing, the punishment is being given to all muslims, is this you call morals and your western civilization?

I'm engaging you on THIS thread, and it's not my job to hunt down your comments elsewhere.

Than you have to read the history of terrorism .

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_terrorism

and tell me than who started the terrorist attacks? is it muslims or non-muslims, and why only Muslims are blamed now, if others do, their political reason or some other reason is given, why you people make double standard?

Sorry; as I said, "I gave that answer somewhere else" isn't acceptable. Either post a link to your previous remarks or briefly repeat them here.

I notice that you have stopped talking about slavery under Muslim rule in the present day. Very well; silence is an answer.

And Ive noticec that you brought slavery out of nowhere in this post, rather than topic of the racial problem that Islam eliminate, as well as slavery. but you never talk related to post, and good thing about what is writen, instead you choose something else, means the intention is quite clear, to attack Islam, and not hear any good side of Islam

As for suicide bombing and the mass murder of innocents, I'll make it really easy for you: Just explain how deliberately targeting and murdering a bus full of school children is a moral and justified act, under ANY circumstances or for ANY reason. These are the attacks that these clerics sanction. I can't wait to see your explanation of how that is a morally justifiable act. If you don't think that it is, then explain to me why Muslim clerics teaching that it is a SACRED and HOLY act that immediately places the mass murderer's soul in Paradise isn't a Muslim problem.

No muslim would made such an attack on children., instead these kind of attacks were made by Israel, on the children of Palestine, but the neutral behaviour of every1 here dont even want to listen to that, and call it justification that Palestinians deserve this, This is what you call your morals?

If you had bothered to read the very article you quoted, you'd have seen that there ARE Muslim clerics who oppose and denounce these false teachings on the part of other Muslim clerics.

Why can't you?



Or do you really believe that there are good reasons for murdering children?

Remember: "You did it first" isn't an acceptable answer, even if it's true. If it was wrong when it was done to you, it's wrong when when you do it to others - and it also removes your right to complain about it being done to you in the first place.

Again, murder of children is not done by muslims, instead done by non-muslims of muslim children, but I didnt hear anything from you against that, so does that mean that muslim children are not humans?
But also I have;nt seen any of your justification of attacks on muslim civilians done so far, you keep on insisting about muslims attacking non-muslims, wat about non-muslim attacking muslims? your silence means you are agreeing for that I guess so....

Thanks for making everything so clear.

No response to this post is necessary; it speaks for itself. Just as I said; you refuse to even admit that these things happen, and attribute the bad reputation of Islam to the lies of infidels. If moderate Muslims want to get control of and delegitimize the murderous radicals in your midst, they'll get no help from you; according to you, they don't exist.

I won't even ask who you think is "behind" 9/11. I suspect I know.

We have nothing to talk about.

[TrueReligion]

Thanks for making everything so clear.

No response to this post is necessary; it speaks for itself. Just as I said; you refuse to even admit that these things happen, and attribute the bad reputation of Islam to the lies of infidels. If moderate Muslims want to get control of and delegitimize the murderous radicals in your midst, they'll get no help from you; according to you, they don't exist.

I won't even ask who you think is "behind" 9/11. I suspect I know.

We have nothing to talk about.

Yeah, you prove your point that in your mind its only attacking Islam, and not giving justification about muslims being killed by non-muslims .
This just shows how much neutral you debate here. Its very easy to hurt some1, but if it comes back to you, you will just say that "We have nothing totalk about"

Further, there is no moderate muslims in Islam, muslims are only of 1 kind, which follow the Quran and follow the path of peace. if some1 is beside this path, that person is not consider as Muslim.