Question for Theists

[fried beef sandwich]

Just another simple question for the theists out there: what would it take to cause you either doubt or otherwise not believe in the existence of God (or gods)?

[ipu]

And perhaps one day I might choose to engage in a life of immorality than follow the teachings of Jesus (though I hope not).

I do find it offensive to equate morality exclusively with the teachings of Jesus or any God. Perhaps you could rephrase "immorality" as "Christian immorality?" It is another topic, but I find the morality of the OT to be rather sad, and not justifiable by excuses of the time and place of those bound by it (e.g., stoning unruly children, not touching menstruating women, etc.).

On a more related note, let me share a story of a previous neighbor of mine that I considered to be quite intelligent. He frequently discussed the Bible with me, knowing I did not believe. After failing to convince him of contradictions in the Bible, I asked him how he would respond, hypothetically, if I were to discover a clear contradiction in the Bible for which he nor any of his Christian friends could avoid seeing the absolute logical contradiction? His answer was that under no cirmstances should I share such a discovery with him. That is, no amount of evidence to the contrary could cause him to loose his faith in the perfection of the Bible.

-- Alan

[otseng]

And perhaps one day I might choose to engage in a life of immorality than follow the teachings of Jesus (though I hope not).

I do find it offensive to equate morality exclusively with the teachings of Jesus or any God.

Following the teachings of Jesus should equate to living a moral life. However, it does not mean that not following the teachings of Jesus equates to not living a moral life. It is possible to live a moral life without being a Christian. But I do not think it is possible to live an immoral life and be called a Christian.

[ipu]

Following the teachings of Jesus should equate to living a moral life. However, it does not mean that not following the teachings of Jesus equates to not living a moral life. It is possible to live a moral life without being a Christian.

Thanks for clarifying. I mistakenly thought you were suggesting that you were considering the alternative to following Christ, that being a life of immorality.

To your last point:

But I do not think it is possible to live an immoral life and be called a Christian.

I though Christian theology claims you can live an immoral life, yet accept Christ in your last days and therefore be a Christian and go to heaven. Sorry if I am just nit-picking your wording too much.

-- Alan

[otseng]

But I do not think it is possible to live an immoral life and be called a Christian.

I though Christian theology claims you can live an immoral life, yet accept Christ in your last days and therefore be a Christian and go to heaven. Sorry if I am just nit-picking your wording too much.

Certainly that can happen. But who knows when the last day would be? Probably the only way to have any certainty is to commit suicide. But, that's another topic for debate - if a person accepts Christ and then commits suicide, would that person make it into heaven?

[justanotherperson]

To me, the only thing that anyone could do to make me stop believing in God would be to show me that I did not exist.

I believe that if I exist, I was created by something. No, not just by my mother, but humanity itself was created by something. I cannot believe evolution and the theories that go along with it because I see too much error in it and to much complexity in life for it to plausibly work (which is another topic).

Therefore if you can make an argument to make me believe that I do not exist, you will effectively make me stop believing in God. And I will be impressed at that, because I would think it to be hard.