is it someone who believes the jews were not put in camps ?
or people that question WW2 and the 6 million dead jew number?
what is a holocaust denier?
Moderator: Moderators
Post #11
My first post on this thread answered that question, I did not say
you have , are you being deliberately obtuse."So a holocaust denier is someone who believes ww2 never happened? no such thing as Jew's or Hitler? non-existent Jew's were put in camps that didn't exist?"
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cnorman18
what is a holocaust denier?
Post #13Mazzaroth,
Here are some informative sites that may help you with the definitions that you seek.
From Wikipedia:
There is much more, on the history, tactics and agenda of the Holocaust denial "movement" and the individuals associated with it.
A very thorough and detailed article can be found on the Jewish Virtual Library website as well.
Here are a few more:
Holocaust denial on trial; the David Irving case, from Emory University
Holocaust Denial: Anti-Semitism Masquerading as History, from the Anti-Defamation League
Holocaust Denial & The Big Lie, from Remember.org
Deceit & Misrepresentation: Techniques of Holocaust Denial, from The Nizkor Project
There are many, many more
I have now posted multiple sources giving the facts on these issues. You have not yet posted a single one for your alleged "facts."
That is, of course, a dead giveaway; there are only two possible reasons for your not giving your sources here - (1) you have none and are making up everything you've posted, or (2) you know your sources are illegitimate and won't stand up to scrutiny.
Post your sources. I dare you.
Oh, by the way; any information from the phony "Institute for Historical Review," or from "CODOH," can safely be dismissed as deceptive and/or simply false. The reasons can be found on the websites I've cited above.
I've dealt with these issues for more than ten years on various forums, and I can tell you this; Holocaust denial (or "revisionism'" if you prefer) boils down to a few simple axioms:
(1) All Jews are ipso facto deliberate and conscious liars. This bigoted and clearly antisemitic assumption is absolutely a prerequisite for dismissing the testimony of thousands of Jewish Holocaust survivors, historians and scholars as falsehood and conspiracy.
(2) Any non-Jew who supports Jewish testimony is ipso facto either a liar or a dupe. This assumption is equally necessary, in order to dismiss the testimony of thousands of non-Jews - including that of Nazi officers and guards.
(3) Any document or evidence that supports the conventional scholarly consensus on the Holocaust must ipso facto be forged or faked, or its existence simply denied. Since there are literally millions of pages of documents that conclusively prove the legitimate professional historians' consensus to be true, this is a particularly laughable claim. Links to some of them can be found at some of the websites linked above.
(4) Any document, evidence, investigation, or testimony that discredits that consensus must ipso facto be genuine and credible - no matter how many times debunked, discredited or exposed as false. Again, see the websites above.
None of these assumptions have anything to do with genuine scholarship or responsible historical study. All of them have to do with bigotry, hatred, deliberate falsehood, and hypocrisy.
Do you have any credible sources at all, or will you blatantly ignore that question again and hope no one notices?
I have no patience with liars or bigots. Take care that you don't prove yourself to be both.
Here are some informative sites that may help you with the definitions that you seek.
From Wikipedia:
Holocaust denial is the claim that the genocide of Jews during World War II—usually referred to as the Holocaust—did not occur at all, or that it did not happen in the manner or to the extent historically recognized. Key elements of this claim are the rejection of any of the following: that the German Nazi government had a policy of deliberately targeting Jews for extermination as a people; that more than five million Jews were systematically killed by the Nazis and their allies; and that genocide was carried out at extermination camps using tools of mass murder, such as gas chambers. Holocaust deniers do not accept the term "denial" as an appropriate description of their point of view, and use the term Holocaust revisionism instead. Scholars use the term "denial" to differentiate Holocaust deniers from historical revisionists, who use established historical methodologies. Most Holocaust denial claims imply, or openly state, that the Holocaust is a hoax arising out of a deliberate Jewish conspiracy to advance the interest of Jews at the expense of other peoples. For this reason, Holocaust denial is generally considered to be an antisemitic conspiracy theory. The methodologies of Holocaust deniers are criticized as based on a predetermined conclusion that ignores extensive historical evidence to the contrary.
There is much more, on the history, tactics and agenda of the Holocaust denial "movement" and the individuals associated with it.
A very thorough and detailed article can be found on the Jewish Virtual Library website as well.
Here are a few more:
Holocaust denial on trial; the David Irving case, from Emory University
Holocaust Denial: Anti-Semitism Masquerading as History, from the Anti-Defamation League
Holocaust Denial & The Big Lie, from Remember.org
Deceit & Misrepresentation: Techniques of Holocaust Denial, from The Nizkor Project
There are many, many more
I have now posted multiple sources giving the facts on these issues. You have not yet posted a single one for your alleged "facts."
That is, of course, a dead giveaway; there are only two possible reasons for your not giving your sources here - (1) you have none and are making up everything you've posted, or (2) you know your sources are illegitimate and won't stand up to scrutiny.
Post your sources. I dare you.
Oh, by the way; any information from the phony "Institute for Historical Review," or from "CODOH," can safely be dismissed as deceptive and/or simply false. The reasons can be found on the websites I've cited above.
I've dealt with these issues for more than ten years on various forums, and I can tell you this; Holocaust denial (or "revisionism'" if you prefer) boils down to a few simple axioms:
(1) All Jews are ipso facto deliberate and conscious liars. This bigoted and clearly antisemitic assumption is absolutely a prerequisite for dismissing the testimony of thousands of Jewish Holocaust survivors, historians and scholars as falsehood and conspiracy.
(2) Any non-Jew who supports Jewish testimony is ipso facto either a liar or a dupe. This assumption is equally necessary, in order to dismiss the testimony of thousands of non-Jews - including that of Nazi officers and guards.
(3) Any document or evidence that supports the conventional scholarly consensus on the Holocaust must ipso facto be forged or faked, or its existence simply denied. Since there are literally millions of pages of documents that conclusively prove the legitimate professional historians' consensus to be true, this is a particularly laughable claim. Links to some of them can be found at some of the websites linked above.
(4) Any document, evidence, investigation, or testimony that discredits that consensus must ipso facto be genuine and credible - no matter how many times debunked, discredited or exposed as false. Again, see the websites above.
None of these assumptions have anything to do with genuine scholarship or responsible historical study. All of them have to do with bigotry, hatred, deliberate falsehood, and hypocrisy.
Do you have any credible sources at all, or will you blatantly ignore that question again and hope no one notices?
I have no patience with liars or bigots. Take care that you don't prove yourself to be both.
Post #14
now im a bigot! ...lol this is classic...lol...
my wife is black/jewish...lol my son has jewish blood...lol... my half brothers are half jewish...lol... now im a bigot...lol
this is classic.. go ahaead keep calling me a bigot.. its all part of you plan how you shut down ANY talk of israel... call megaphone yet?
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cnorman18
Post #15
Interesting that you go straight to defensiveness and distraction without a reason, and (of course) allege that my post is part of a Jewish conspiracy as opposed to answering your questions and providing actual facts. Another dead giveaway.mazzaroth wrote:
now im a bigot! ...lol this is classic...lol...
my wife is black/jewish...lol my son has jewish blood...lol... my half brothers are half jewish...lol... now im a bigot...lol
this is classic.. go ahaead keep calling me a bigot.. its all part of you plan how you shut down ANY talk of israel... call megaphone yet?
Read my post carefully, genius. I never called you a bigot. I said that belief in Jewish control of banks, the media, etc., are a hallmark of hardcore antisemites, and it is; but for all I know, you're just repeating crap you've heard or read elsewhere.
In my post, I answered your question, "What is a holocaust denier," gave some useful and informative links on the subject, and told you to take care NOT to prove you're a liar and a bigot.
Attacking me won't solve your credibility problem. All you've done with this post is dig yourself in deeper. For instance -
...its all part of you plan how you shut down ANY talk of israel...
(sic)
Israel hasn't been mentioned on this thread, and since Israel was not founded till three years after the Holocaust ended, it is irrelevant to the factuality of the genocide. Alleging that the "Holocaust hoax" was the reason for the existence of Israel is another hallmark of the antisemite, as is hauling out the "any criticism of Jews or Israel is automatically called antisemitism" canard. Nice going.
By the way, your claims about your personal life are unprovable, irrelevant, and would remain irrelevant even if proven. Since it is perfectly possible for a person who is himself Jewish to be a bigoted antisemite, the (supposed) presence or absence of Jews in your life means precisely nothing.
Do you think no one has noticed that you continue to refuse to post a single source for a single claim of fact that you've made here?
My challenge stands unanswered. Give your sources or withdraw your claims.
Post #16
saying "i read somewhere that we sent doctors to inspect the bodies" is NOT a claim of fact... sooorry. that wont work...cnorman18 wrote: Do you think no one has noticed that you continue to refuse to post a single source for a single claim of fact that you've made here?
My challenge stands unanswered. Give your sources or withdraw your claims.
did the united states send anyone to look at the bodies? yes or no..or i dont know..
what was my other "claim"?
look...its your "god" givin right to be as zionisty as you want... dont use this old ploy on me...
you can post NO proof to your 9/11 theory... so i could care less about what proofs YOU want.. im not trying to hide anything...
please quote me on the links you want. please.
Post #17
Just got back from work, see the thread has not progressed any. A couple of things to say on this matter. I think no matter what is posted by any folk on this thread Mazzaroth (the twelve pointed star, not a bright one) will argue, reasoned, methodical, researched and well presented as it may be.mazzaroth wrote:saying "i read somewhere that we sent doctors to inspect the bodies" is NOT a claim of fact... sooorry. that wont work...cnorman18 wrote: Do you think no one has noticed that you continue to refuse to post a single source for a single claim of fact that you've made here?
My challenge stands unanswered. Give your sources or withdraw your claims.
did the united states send anyone to look at the bodies? yes or no..or i dont know..
what was my other "claim"?
look...its your "god" givin right to be as zionisty as you want... dont use this old ploy on me...
you can post NO proof to your 9/11 theory... so i could care less about what proofs YOU want.. im not trying to hide anything...
please quote me on the links you want. please.
Mazzoroth was obviously denied his mothers breast as a child and has spent the rest of his ineffectual life searching for something.
He is a conundrum of human waste, he posts student yet married with children says it all. Playing Loki on forums may be fun but you with your thrust into education need it far more than you are aware.
Post #18
psychiatrist? come on, seriously. you are like some big fat bald guy.. single no kids or friends? honestly.. got any hobbies? i mean if you are going to use your pseudo science on me...is it not fair if i do it?He Who Stands Defiant wrote:Just got back from work, see the thread has not progressed any. A couple of things to say on this matter. I think no matter what is posted by any folk on this thread Mazzaroth (the twelve pointed star, not a bright one) will argue, reasoned, methodical, researched and well presented as it may be.mazzaroth wrote:saying "i read somewhere that we sent doctors to inspect the bodies" is NOT a claim of fact... sooorry. that wont work...cnorman18 wrote: Do you think no one has noticed that you continue to refuse to post a single source for a single claim of fact that you've made here?
My challenge stands unanswered. Give your sources or withdraw your claims.
did the united states send anyone to look at the bodies? yes or no..or i dont know..
what was my other "claim"?
look...its your "god" givin right to be as zionisty as you want... dont use this old ploy on me...
you can post NO proof to your 9/11 theory... so i could care less about what proofs YOU want.. im not trying to hide anything...
please quote me on the links you want. please.
Mazzoroth was obviously denied his mothers breast as a child and has spent the rest of his ineffectual life searching for something.
He is a conundrum of human waste, he posts student yet married with children says it all. Playing Loki on forums may be fun but you with your thrust into education need it far more than you are aware.
Re: what is a holocaust denier?
Post #19Just go to youtube and type in holocaust, there are literally hundreds of videos many of which have documentary footage, if you have seen nothing but drawings you either have you head in the sand or haven't tried.6 million jews died?
post some pics of jews being mistreated while working....PICTURES not drawings.
Hitler invaded Poland after making an agreement with the soviets to split it into two even though Britain warned that it would lead to a declaration of war. Your explanation is exactly the same one given by Russia in the recent conflict in Georgia, and about as true.hitler invaded poland cuz his people were being massacard
Was this before or after kristalnacht? Even if what you say is true does it justify gathering jews into concentration camps and murdering them?jews in germany declared a boycott on ALL german goods and services just before ww2.
The truth of the holocaust came out a long time ago and yet there are still people that cant admit the people and ideology they idolize could do such an inhuman act.my wife is half jewish...my son is part.. peddle your "poor me" all you want... the truth ALWAYS comes out.
