Is desiring to live without an objective purpose irrational?

[Lucian Hodoboc]

Is desiring to experience life (with its struggles and occasional moments of happiness) while being aware that your existence is an incredibly limited, meaningless, accidental period of awareness in the middle of an eternity of nothingness a rational behavior, from a psychological point of view? What do you think? Is desiring to remain alive without believing in an objective purpose and an afterlife rational?

[Tcg]

On the grounds that I find desiring temporary existence to be irrational,...

It is not a matter of desire, but rather a matter of what one finds to coincide with reality.

...and I only find rationality in a state of painless immortality.

Rationality is based on what is reasonable to believe. Choosing to believe that which brings you comfort is not rationality but rather wishful thinking.

[steveb1]

[Replying to post 1 by Lucian Hodoboc]

As Jungian psychology demonstrates, our "rational side" is only one among several mental functions, and when we permit the "rational intellect" to reign supreme in our psyches, it quickly moves from being a servant to a tyrant who is armed with any number of cutting tools. A healthier psychology would have the psyche's different sides being/staying in communication with each other, toward the goal of psychic balance. It's quite true that the soul or the heart knows things that the rational mind is unaware of or can only guess at, and that we can learn from our dreams, fantasies, imagination and intuition.

The choice is not a stark decision between being "rational" or being "intuitive/feeling". It's a matter of cultivating inner balance and being open enough to accept promptings from the personal, and the collective, unconscious. Living a really rational life would be to incorporate the entirety of the psyche in all its dimensions, including its non-rational thoughts and its archetypal material.

[dianaiad]

On what grounds do you base your belief that experiencing consciousness is better that (or superior to) not experiencing anything at all?

On what grounds do you base your belief that experiencing consciousness with a purpose assigned to you by an invisible eccentric better than not experiencing anything at all?

On the grounds that I find desiring temporary existence to be irrational, and I only find rationality in a state of painless immortality.

This is a slightly frightening POV, frankly.

Sometimes it's easy to see life as meaningless, and that 'painless immortality' is better. The problem with that idea is this: that sort of 'immortality' isn't. Dead is dead. You won't "BE" there to enjoy the quiet. That is, if those who say that this life is all there is are correct.

No pain, certainly. No sadness...and no contentment, joy, beauty or anything else, either. No chance to FIND any of those things, or have a 'do over."

Now me, I'm a dyed in the wool theist, but I'm not afraid of being dead if 'dead' is...'nothing.' The 'dying' part sucks, though.

ANYway, the idea is, if there isn't anything to hand you a purpose, to make one for yourself. Why should you need someone, or Someone/Something else to provide your life purpose? I don't and I believe in a God, for crying out loud. Our bodies and our minds have been designed....either by Deity or by accident of evolution, to find pleasure in physical things, and pleasure in helping others, being with friends and family, and the ability to recover from betrayal by any of those things.

Or, as someone I once knew said...he was a humanist and what he said struck me quite forcibly..."if there is no god to provide a purpose for humanity, then it is up to us to become god and provide purpose for ourselves."

Well, there you go. Nihilism never was a good idea for a lifestyle. It really spoils a party mood.

[imhereforyou]

Is desiring to experience life (with its struggles and occasional moments of happiness) while being aware that your existence is an incredibly limited, meaningless, accidental period of awareness in the middle of an eternity of nothingness a rational behavior, from a psychological point of view? What do you think? Is desiring to remain alive without believing in an objective purpose and an afterlife rational?

Why would it be irrational? By what definition are we using the term irrational here?

[bluethread]

It is interesting the what the OP referred to as objective purpose, was quickly turned into divine purpose, by a poster. Whether one has a divine purpose or not, having a purpose is integral to life. If one has no objective purpose one will not only not achieve much, but will deteriorate and quickly find oneself on the ash heap of history. This is not a matter of theology, but of basic practical psychology.

[Dimmesdale]

[Replying to post 3 by Lucian Hodoboc]

I'll have an eternity to be dead. I've got just a few years to enjoy what I can. This isn't hedonism, it's acceptance of the fact that as long as I am alive, possibilities exist. Possibility isn't a goal for me, but it provides a groundwork for why I persist. There are so many things I haven't seen or done. And I'm really curious. Future me can rot in the ground, since that's what all living beings do. He's not gonna be around to admire amazing things.

But I'm here now. I'm seeing things I've never seen before, done things I'll never get to do when I expire.

Things exist. Isn't that awesome? Death can wait until my turn is done.

This reminds me of a quote: “You can think of death bitterly or with resignation, as a tragic interruption of your life, and take every possible measure to postpone it. Or, more realistically, you can think of life as an interruption of an eternity of personal nonexistence, and seize it as a brief opportunity to observe and interact with the living, ever-surprising world around us.� - Barbara Ehrenreich

Not saying I agree 100% but its a good perspective to have.

[BeHereNow]

[Replying to post 3 by Lucian Hodoboc]

I'll have an eternity to be dead. I've got just a few years to enjoy what I can.

You had eternity to not exist before being born. Did that bother you when you first started to become aware that you're alive? On what grounds do you base your belief that experiencing consciousness is better that (or superior to) not experiencing anything at all?

You need to update your understanding of "eternity".

Eternity means without beginning or end.
I understand that in casual conversation eternity can simply mean a long time. [I had to wait an eternity to get my double mocha frapped cappuccino with chocolate sprinkles.]
Discussions such as this are not casual conversations. There can not be an eternity before some event, which would imply an ending to the time period.

[The Three-buddy Problem]

You're question is a non-starter. In fact, the desire to live can only be rational WITHOUT and objective purpose.

Look...once you've realized you're a random clump of atoms in a random universe, you're free to create whatever meaning you want; in other words, you're free to decide what has intrinsic value and what has not.

(Or maybe no intrinsic value at all...and there'd be nothing wrong with that, though THAT would be the case where the desire to live kinda becomes irrational as you said.)

On the other hand, let's say an omnipotent omniscient being appears to all of mankind and says that the objective meaning of life is to worship it. In this case, I'd wanna cease existing because I'd realize that my only purpose is to feed this god's ego (like how the only purpose of a watch is to tell its user time) who apparently doesn't find intrinsic value in me or any human...so why find intrinsic value in anything?

[Menotu]

Is desiring to experience life (with its struggles and occasional moments of happiness) while being aware that your existence is an incredibly limited, meaningless, accidental period of awareness in the middle of an eternity of nothingness a rational behavior, from a psychological point of view? What do you think? Is desiring to remain alive without believing in an objective purpose and an afterlife rational?

Meaningless? Says who? You? Why would anyone else agree, much less care what someone would say about that?
When someone makes a blanket statement like 'life is meaningless', it says more about that person's POV than anything else.

[Dimmesdale]

Is desiring to experience life (with its struggles and occasional moments of happiness) while being aware that your existence is an incredibly limited, meaningless, accidental period of awareness in the middle of an eternity of nothingness a rational behavior, from a psychological point of view? What do you think? Is desiring to remain alive without believing in an objective purpose and an afterlife rational?

I am a firm theist who believes in immortality, but I feel, at this point in my life, that if reality really was ephemeral, then I would respond, not with bitterness or cynicism, but with an open heart, and help whatever souls came my way, even though our journeys would be all-too-short.

There would still be a certain cast-over feeling of sadness, of melancholy, which would tinge my overall attitude. But I would know, that still, love is love. In other words, there is beauty, love and goodness such that it is worth fighting for, to quote a certain hobbit. To give in to nihilism then would be paradoxically to turn my back on all that I have learned. I don't believe reality is so bifurcated that love can exist alongside nihilism, but if it did, then love would still be love. And I would not be able to turn my back on it.

I would guide people not merely out of duty, but out of love. To do anything else would be to be a slave of ego and my own selfish need for meaning. It would be in effect an abuse of meaning. Thankfully, meaning is not like a drug. It is firmly rooted inlove.