Is being gay anti-god

juber3 · Post by **juber3** » Thu Apr 15, 2004 6:03 pm

My friend is saved and a born again christian. But one bad thing, hes gay. We started talking and the subject 'is it anti-god' came out. I totally blanked out on the question. whats your view

PS Otseng should this be moved to christianity debate?

The Hungry Atheist · Post by **The Hungry Atheist** » Wed Oct 27, 2004 10:49 am

Powerofdaword:

Yo yo! What's up there, homie? Blah, I'm so white and middle-class, I really can't get away with trying to be 'street'. Anyway, sincere congratulations on your reformation - might sound odd to some coming from me, but anything that gets someone off drugs and helps them lead a more productive and happier life can't be all bad. If you don't mind, and if we're not getting too off-topic, I'd like to ask something about your final paragraph.

Powerofdaword wrote:My point is this: if I as a self confessed drug user and hard drinker can still be a useful member of my community and church and am convicted and saved by Christ, why can't a homosexual, thief or prostitute enjoy the same blessings?

No doubt to be saved by Christ would require a change in one's choice of actions as well as in one's opinions and outlook - you would have been hypocritical to claim to be a saved Christian were you still living your old lifestyle, and not making a genuine effort to live a more moral life. You may still have your struggles, but it would be unreasonable to expect you to have perfect success. But what about, for instance, homosexuals? To be saved, and a good Christian, must they try to reform in some way?

Jennifer · Post by **Jennifer** » Wed Oct 27, 2004 1:39 pm

Powerofdaword,

That's awesome that you changed your ways. I also work with drug addicts-it is very rewarding! Just curious-where do you work and could you tell me more about it? I'm finishing up my bachelor's degree and moving to get married. I'm trying to network and find an organization similar to where I work now in Northwest Indiana. Can you tell me more?

Thanks!

Jennifer · Post by **Jennifer** » Wed Oct 27, 2004 1:54 pm

The Hungry Atheist,

That's an awesome question. When someone becomes a Christian by sincerely accepting Jesus' penalty on the Cross for one's sins, God automatically sees him/her as righteous, but he/she is not automatically perfected. The beginning of salvation comes through belief-this is the start of a relationship with God. However, just like a human relationship, it must be nourished to survive. In Isaiah 59:2 it says "But the trouble is that your sins have cut you off from God." Every sin we make distances us from God. That's why we need to get real and honest with God about our mistakes. In the same way that an addict or sinner must turn from his/her past, confess this as sin, and make different choices so must a homosexual. In the same way that addicts must stop drugging (acting on pleasure), so must a homosexual stop acting on pleasure and start acting on principle-according to the truth-to God's word. This shows that the person honors God and is dedicated to that change. This Honesty, Openness, and Willingness opens the door and allows the Holy Spirit to change the homosexual's heart. If the homosexual will take responsibility for his actions and thoughts by confessing them to God and renewing one's mind (Romans 12:1-2), then God will change and heal the insides. That freedom is available if it is desired-I know because Christ freed me from depression and insecurity and now I share this same message to drug addicts who are also being freed.

Post by **otseng** » Wed Oct 27, 2004 2:38 pm

Hi Powerofdaword.

I've got some questions I'd like to ask you as well. I've created a thread for people to ask you questions:
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... .php?t=630

The Hungry Atheist · Post by **The Hungry Atheist** » Wed Oct 27, 2004 5:51 pm

Jennifer,

Thanks for the reply, I guess what sums up the approach in question is the phrase "dedicated to that change" - even if you don't do everything wonderfully, you just need to show that you're serious about whatever changes you want to make, and are willing to dedicate yourself to it.

I guess one thing I was trying to ask, as well, was whether Powerofdaword considers homosexuality another sin from which one must turn away onto the righteous path. I don't imagine this is a great time or place to start yet another discussion about the morality of homosexuality; I'm not sure I've ever known them to be at all productive.

Powerofdaword · Post by **Powerofdaword** » Thu Oct 28, 2004 3:06 pm

Hey hungry wha's happenin homes?
Seriously though, it may surprise you to know that I too am white! I guess we dont have the same attitude here in the UK about black & white guys hanging in each others gangs. Of course we do have exclusively black or exclusively white gangs too but just not to the same extent.
Anyway, to the point, you asked:

I guess one thing I was trying to ask, as well, was whether Powerofdaword considers homosexuality another sin from which one must turn away onto the righteous path. (sorry I dont know how you do that quute thing seperately).

My short answer is yes. Yes I believe homosexuality is a sin and that a Christian homosexual would have to struggle with turning away from that practice. I dont believe there is a righteous path per se. I mean Jesus is The (only) righteous path. If a homosexual confesses Jesus then I believe he is on The righteous path. That may sound a little confusing but what I mean is: I beleieve Jesus is The Way (or righteous path) in that, we are accounted righteous even as sinners if we confess Jesus as Lord. I dont believe that it is possible for a person to become righteous (or acceptable by Gods standards) whichever path he walks without Jesus. Does that make sense?

jon · Post by **jon** » Fri Oct 29, 2004 8:36 pm

i like what i am hearing and agee with it. lets face it we are not sinnless but we are called to repentance and that means to change or turn from. we must leave our past behind. but the bible does not leave a huge time table open for change. some but not years. note that paul to the cor. wrote about idolitry, effeminates, drunkards, revilers... and such were some of you. not are, not trying to get better, but were. past tense. we must understand the limits we are to have to show the urgency in change.

adherent · Post by **adherent** » Sun Nov 07, 2004 3:46 pm

Just a quick question(s)...

Where did our cultures inherent sort of disgust for homosexuality originate?

Like why do most people today and even in the recent past have a prejudice against homos?

Powerofdaword · Post by **Powerofdaword** » Mon Nov 08, 2004 2:24 pm

Its a good question adherent!
My opinion is that people 'know' that it is unnatural.

The Hungry Atheist · Post by **The Hungry Atheist** » Mon Nov 08, 2004 4:05 pm

But what exactly does it mean to 'know' something, in the way you use the word there? Many people can have a gut instinct about things, but such instincts are often far from reliable. Many people's natural repulsion to the idea of homosexuality could quite possibly be mirrored in my own disgust at the thought of broccoli. Many people seem to enjoy indulging in the consumption of such unpleasant vegetation, but to me it just seems hideous and wrong.

Also, what does 'unnatural' mean? Homosexuality certainly appears in nature, and is regularly seen in a number of animals - I'll try finding numbers and specific studies if you like. It may involve things for which parts of our bodies are not strictly biologically intended, but so do many, many kinds of heterosexual activity, among a number of other things.

And, while you're at it, what exactly are you getting at when you say "opinion"? And "people"? And what's "is" supposed to mean? Explain yourself!