Paganism Vs. Mainstream beliefs.

[Coyotero]

From another thread:

yeah but noone belifs that billions of people believes in christianity...

but do you actuly belief that stuff?

So, my beliefs have been challenged on the basis of them being older and less popular (these days) Than Christianity... Although one could also consider Islam, Judaism, Buddhism, or just about anything else while we're on the subject.

Topic for debate: Are beliefs systems such as Asatru, Wicca, Shinto, Native tribal religions, or anything else generally referred to as "pagan" any less valid than more mainstream systems such as Christianity? Why?

[Jrosemary]

Topic for debate: Are beliefs systems such as Asatru, Wicca, Shinto, Native tribal religions, or anything else generally referred to as "pagan" any less valid than more mainstream systems such as Christianity? Why?

I've always had a soft spot for Pagan mythology, so I've watched the rebirth and reconstruction of various Pagan beliefs with interest. (I know 'Paganism' is not the preferred term for all these religions, so forgive me for using it out of convenience.) While these Pagan faiths are not for me, I don't view them as less valid than Judaism. I may have particular quarrels with them--but I have particular quarrels with most religions, including my own. However, the Pagan religions I've studied teach a basic morality and don't seek to convert the world. Those are, in my opinion, two reasons to admire them.

Coyotero and I are already having a conversation about issues like monotheism, polytheism, monism, etc., so I won't get into that here. (And yes, I will get my response up! I'm working on it, lol.) I will say this: while I'd certainly go to a Pagan wedding, handfasting, or baby-welcoming rite or what have you, I wouldn't participate in prayers directed to Pagan deities. I'd just sit or stand respectfully and keep quiet.

I wouldn't mean my non-particiapation to be an insult; it would just be me being true to Judaism. (We don't pray to anyone but the God of Israel.) In the same fashion, there are many prayers I don't join when I'm at a Christian wedding or christening. I don't pray to Jesus, so I just sit or stand respectfully when the Christians do.

I do think the reborn and reconstructed Pagan religions are still undergoing some birth pangs; that's an outsider's observation, but I've known Pagans who have agreed. It takes time to gain 'respectability'--to prove that a new (or reborn or reconstructed) religion is going to stick around, and that the members are serious about it. But as more and more Pagan clergy participate in joint religious councils, as more Pagan groups participate in joint food banks and interreligious dialogue, that respect will come. It's just going to take some time.

(Of course, the mainstream religions should welcome their Pagan counterparts in such activities.)

[Jonah]

I would just throw out the word "pagan" and go with what a group really calls itself. I haven't run into any group that seriously claims the word pagan. The pejorative nature of the word just sort of lends itself to oppositional relationship. I know some wiccans that might like the word because it has power in contending with Christian fundamentalists, but it would be just be a bone of contention. Yes, in the dictionary, you could select a non-contentious meaning for the word. But, in my opinion, letting everyone just be who they say they are is the easier route.

Now. Mainstream. Hmmm. Is that just a market share reality?...based on what today? Truth is, within everything that would call itself Mainstream, you have lots of sub-groups.

I've always been interested in the Bahai. You can keep your Mainstream whatever, and still hang with them. They must know something....

[Goat]

I would just throw out the word "pagan" and go with what a group really calls itself. I haven't run into any group that seriously claims the word pagan. The pejorative nature of the word just sort of lends itself to oppositional relationship. I know some wiccans that might like the word because it has power in contending with Christian fundamentalists, but it would be just be a bone of contention. Yes, in the dictionary, you could select a non-contentious meaning for the word. But, in my opinion, letting everyone just be who they say they are is the easier route.

Now. Mainstream. Hmmm. Is that just a market share reality?...based on what today? Truth is, within everything that would call itself Mainstream, you have lots of sub-groups.

I've always been interested in the Bahai. You can keep your Mainstream whatever, and still hang with them. They must know something....

The word 'Pagan' , in the dictionary, refers to any religion that is not of the 'abrhamic' faiths,,.. I.E.. not Jewish/Christian/Islamic. That makes it 'overly broad' as a definition IMO.

[Jonah]

Yes. In one dictionary I looked at, 4 definitions were given, the last being "hedonist". So. Even while the dictionary puts "hedonist" at the bottom of the pile, I am afraid in popular thinking, it's higher...so the utility of the word is in question, in my opinion.

And then, there are religions that straddle the mainstream/non-mainstream. One could waste a lot of time debating on which side Mormonism is, but what does it matter? Let the Mormons be the Mormons.

[Coyotero]

Well, a discussion of semantics wasn't really my intention.

Take my religion for example. Asatru is sometimes referred to as a pagan religion, although we don't really take the term for ourselves.

[Jonah]

Understood.

I don't know anything about your religion, but my personal commitment would be to not devalue it because it is not-my religion. Now, if I found something in your religion that I thought was destructive, I would at least devalue that component. And I would expect the same in reverse.

[Vikingr]

Paganism means, from Latin paganus, meaning "country dweller", "rustic". which travels a journey to Heathen. as in heath dweller.

A more obvious translation is non believer, as in the big 3.

A more subtle mix is,

"The more common meaning of classical Latin p�g�nus is "civilian, non-militant" (adjective and noun). Christians called themselves mīlitēs, "enrolled soldiers" of Christ, members of his militant church, and applied to non-Christians the term applied by soldiers to all who were "not enrolled in the army"."

The Latin connotations of the word and the eventual ownership of Latin by the church, to me make it a derogative word.

I am an Odinist follower of the old way i believe that the religion of Odinism dates back to the dawn of humanity. Man has been a hunter for several hundred thousand years–a farmer for ten thousand years–and a factory worker for two hundred years. Odinism is the religion of man the hunter.

[nygreenguy]

Topic for debate: Are beliefs systems such as Asatru, Wicca, Shinto, Native tribal religions, or anything else generally referred to as "pagan" any less valid than more mainstream systems such as Christianity? Why?

Its seems to me, validity is simply the number of adherents.

Well, unless your hindu or buddhist.

Actually, come to think of it, the only valid religions to the person you are asking, is the religion of the person you are asking.

[Feralbeest]

Topic for debate: Are beliefs systems such as Asatru, Wicca, Shinto, Native tribal religions, or anything else generally referred to as "pagan" any less valid than more mainstream systems such as Christianity? Why?

Its seems to me, validity is simply the number of adherents.

Well, unless your hindu or buddhist.

Actually, come to think of it, the only valid religions to the person you are asking, is the religion of the person you are asking.

That is one of the best answers so far IMO!