The End Times Are Very Near

axeplayer · Post by **axeplayer** » Fri Mar 04, 2005 11:04 pm

There is a lot of evidence supporting the idea that the end times and the rapture are very near to happening. for example, the United Nations fulfill the prophesy that very near to the end times, the world will be united as one, and there will be peace on the earth(even though we're a long way from peace). also, barcodes, credit cards etc. are an early warning to the mark of the beast being used to pay for all of our expenses. In college station, Texas, there are stores where you can pay for your groceries, appliances, etc., with your thumbprint. So what does everyone else think? Are the end times and Judgement Day near?

perplexed101 · Post by **perplexed101** » Tue Jun 21, 2005 11:57 pm

McCulloch wrote:Is this close to what you are asserting? You must pray the will of God in order for prayer to be answered; you must believe the Bible in order to understand the Bible; and the is the Word of God, therefore it is true. This is called circular reasoning.

Just because you state it in the way you want so you can disbelieve dont make it so.

you can either look at the glass half empty or half full, your choice.

Cathar1950 · Post by **Cathar1950** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 12:54 am

McCulloch wrote:

Is this close to what you are asserting? You must pray the will of God in order for prayer to be answered; you must believe the Bible in order to understand the Bible; and the is the Word of God, therefore it is true. This is called circular reasoning.

I think God has to choose you too. I seems that if you pray for the will of God your just going thru the motions if his will is unchangeable. I don't think they really understand the Bible, I think they understand their dogma.
Part of that dogma is the Bible is the Word of God and then they use it like an oracle. I guess God didn't repent that he made man he sighed or relented. I wonder why he made them in the first place. Lack of foresight?

perplexed101 · Post by **perplexed101** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 2:12 am

Cathar1950 wrote:McCulloch wrote:
Is this close to what you are asserting? You must pray the will of God in order for prayer to be answered; you must believe the Bible in order to understand the Bible; and the is the Word of God, therefore it is true. This is called circular reasoning.

I think God has to choose you too. I seems that if you pray for the will of God your just going thru the motions if his will is unchangeable. I don't think they really understand the Bible, I think they understand their dogma.
Part of that dogma is the Bible is the Word of God and then they use it like an oracle. I guess God didn't repent that he made man he sighed or relented. I wonder why he made them in the first place. Lack of foresight?
is this what you are asserting? your predisposition must be that what is impossible must be taken priority? therefore, it cant be possible because it is impossible any anything that show contrary is impossible therfore it cant happen since its impossible and anything to show contrary cant be possible so therefore it is impossible.... like that?

Bro Dave · Post by **Bro Dave** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 3:01 am

CONDITIONS OF EFFECTIVE PRAYER

If you would engage in effective praying, you should bear in mind the laws of prevailing petitions:
1. You must qualify as a potent prayer by sincerely and courageously facing the problems of universe reality. You must possess cosmic stamina.
2. You must have honestly exhausted the human capacity for human adjustment. You must have been industrious.
3. You must surrender every wish of mind and every craving of soul to the transforming embrace of spiritual growth. You must have experienced an enhancement of meanings and an elevation of values.
4. You must make a wholehearted choice of the divine will. You must obliterate the dead center of indecision.
5. You not only recognize the Father's will and choose to do it, but you have effected an unqualified consecration, and a dynamic dedication, to the actual doing of the Father's will.

Urantia Book, Paper 91

Cathar1950 · Post by **Cathar1950** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 6:13 am

perplexed101 wrote:

is this what you are asserting? your predisposition must be that what is impossible must be taken priority? therefore, it cant be possible because it is impossible any anything that show contrary is impossible therfore it cant happen since its impossible and anything to show contrary cant be possible so therefore it is impossible.... like that?

I was being sarcastic and facetious. What are you talking about?
If something is impossible by definition it can't happen.
What I am saying is your predisposition distorts what you read out of the Bible and it is not necessarily what is being presented or read. Your projecting your belive into the text and looking at it from an already developed christology. I see no need to make Jesus conceived of the Holy Wind. God does not father people like like Zeus or the other gods.
Luke misunderstood Isaiah's passage which was a mistranslation in the septuagint. the NT Gospel authors were looking for prophesy that pointed to Jesus. They often twisted the meaning. I don't belive that God requires a sacrifice to forgive sins. Jesus does not have to be God to announce the Kingdom. He was pointing to God. His message was from the prophetic tradition and was a social commentary and critique, a call to compassion.
The best of humanism. I see God as the most humanistic if I ignore the terrible things said about him or done in his name. I am not sure that Christianity as a whole is even close. Mark at least the one we have now was a tamed tapered down version. It was for the uninitiated. Maybe what he said was lost and we just don't get it. Saying the Holy Spirit guides us is begging the question. To many things were done by people who felt and swore that they were following God. Love God with all your Heart mind and soul..but the other is like it Love your neighbor as yourself. This is the only way we can honor God. God does not need our praise or worship But maybe our friendship. Praying for my farm so it will not be destroyed by a storm is silly what about my neighbors farm? Jesus taught use to Pray Our father Give us this day forgive us as we forgive and do It in a closet. Bro dave's List maybe insightful but it is more formula and devotional then useful. It belongs in a self help section. which seems kind of an oxymoron. I remember falling down my steps and giving a little prayer "help me God" then I apologized. Like God didn't care about the millions who suffer , hunger and are killed daily?
I don't know all the answers but I do know that they are not all in the Bible or that believing a certain idea makes the world better. Feeding the hungry, clothing the naked, visiting the sick, remembering the poor, the widow, the children this makes sense. It is apart of the universe with or with out God. If God asked for it it was because it was right not right because God said so. I find it interesting that if the Bible had all the answers why does it say so little? Why are the examples so bad? If it was from God why does it lack so much? You may think it does because you need to think it does. Jesus never said pray to him. Lord was a salutation or respect not a declaration of divinity. Christianity is a superstition at most in it's present form. At least the Jews could question and argue.
Even with God! There is now way one can take the Bible literally as inerrant or infallible with out over looking most of it. The KJV is one of the worse translations we have come a long way in knowledge and understanding. They had some of the worse manuscripts we have some of the best. There has been changes and errors even in the oldest available copies. Being a Bible believer doesn't make you a Christian. Being a Christian doesn't make you right. And it doesn't make it all truth. Prophets couldn't even agree with prophets and disciples couldn't agree with disciples. Most of the time Paul just prattles on, and his letters were not doctrine but letters. Not all that are attributed to him are his such as Timothy, Hebrews and Titus. John's words that he put in Jesus mouth are doubtful. If your going to belive in God formulas don't cut it. Believing in the Bible doesn't get you off the hook and praising Jesus is not the same as God. Live with it. Struggle, don't pretend that Jesus did it all like some kind of magic formula. Faith is Faithfulness not Believing dumb things. The best faithfulness is how we deal with others in a sypathetic union, we share our suffering and joy.

perplexed101 · Post by **perplexed101** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 6:24 am

I was being sarcastic and facetious. What are you talking about?

i was being sarcastic as well, im glad we are doing the same thing.

If something is impossible by definition it can't happen.

if that is your priority then so be it.

What I am saying is your predisposition distorts what you read out of the Bible and it is not necessarily what is being presented or read.

Y

and what im saying is that your predisposition prevents giving it an ounce of credibility.

our projecting your belive into the text and looking at it from an already developed christology.

already developed? dont you mean already predetermined by what is represented in written english?

McCulloch · Post by **McCulloch** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 8:50 am

perplexed101 wrote:
McCulloch wrote:Is this close to what you are asserting? You must pray the will of God in order for prayer to be answered; you must believe the Bible in order to understand the Bible; and the is the Word of God, therefore it is true. This is called circular reasoning.
Just because you state it in the way you want so you can disbelieve dont make it so.
you can either look at the glass half empty or half full, your choice.

The reasoning is still circular.

perplexed101 · Post by **perplexed101** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 9:09 am

The reasoning is still circular.

if that is where you stand then so said, so done from your perspective.
You can believe my reasoning is circular while i hold the same about yours. At least im going back to the original language and clarifying areas of controversy while keeping an open mind and if i see a contradiction i point it out IE: the latin name Lucifer in early hebrew text due to a translation error. While, all i see here is bunch of retorts after another except for a few or so.. Tilia and Dillante's debate is very interesting and informative i might add.

McCulloch · Post by **McCulloch** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 12:28 pm

perplexed101 wrote:
The reasoning is still circular.
if that is where you stand then so said, so done from your perspective.
You can believe my reasoning is circular while i hold the same about yours.
Circular reasoning is not a matter of perspective. Either it is circular or it is not. Please point out to me where my reasoning is circular. Yours seems to be that you cannot understand the bible without believing it and you cannot believe it without understanding it.

perplexed101 · Post by **perplexed101** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 12:35 pm

Circular reasoning is not a matter of perspective. Either it is circular or it is not. Please point out to me where my reasoning is circular. Yours seems to be that you cannot understand the bible without believing it and you cannot believe it without understanding it.

before i brought any evidence about the find with professor Charles Hapgood, all your reasoning was based on what you throw out as being irrational. You may still throw it out for the very same reasons but you know what? i dont care whether you do or you dont because that is based on how you see things not from mine.