IF GOD SO LOVED "EVERYONE", THEN WHY DID HE HATE ESAU?

[Eddie Ramos]

It seems like John 3:16 is by far the most widely memorized verse among people who know anything about the Bible because it speaks about God loving the world. While this verse may seem like "good news" to everyone who reads it, it does not stand alone from the rest of the scriptures. No verse does.

So, as most people are glad to memorize that verse, what happens when they come across a verse like this?:

Romans 9:13 (KJV) 13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

Malachi 1:2-3 (KJV)
2 I have loved you, saith the LORD.
Yet ye say, Wherein hast thou loved us?
Was not Esau Jacob's brother? saith the LORD:
yet I loved Jacob,
3 And I hated Esau,
and laid his mountains and his heritage waste for the dragons of the wilderness.

Psalms 5:5 (KJV)
5 The foolish shall not stand in thy sight:
thou hatest all workers of iniquity.

Psalms 11:5 (KJV)
5 The LORD trieth the righteous:
but the wicked and him that loveth violence his soul hateth.

Psalms 5:6 (KJV)
6 Thou shalt destroy them that speak leasing:
the LORD will abhor the bloody and deceitful man.

How does John 3:16 look in light of these passages? Did God change? No, God does not change (Malachi 3:6). This teaches us that we can't just focus on John 3:16 and conclude that God's love for the world, in the giving of his Son, is actually not referring to every individual in the world (because there are passages that tell us about God hating others), but rather John 3:16 is referring to certain people within the world. These certain people are also known as God's beloved which means to be loved.

1 John 4:10-11 (KJV) 10 Herein is love, not that we loved God, but that he loved us, and sent his Son to be the propitiation for our sins. 11 Beloved, if God so loved us, we ought also to love one another.

The beloved are thise who were chosen for salvation, those who were called to be saints.

Romans 1:7 (KJV) 7 To all that be in Rome, beloved of God, called to be saints: Grace to you and peace from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ.

My question for this thread is: Can you see that the Bible, on one hand, speaks of God's love in conjunction with those whose sins were laid on Christ? And on the other hand, can you see that those who were hated, are those whose sins were not laid upon Christ? This is what it means to be hated. It means that you have to pay for your own sins by your own death.

[Eddie Ramos]

[Replying to 2ndpillar2 in post #116]

The OP is a pretty interesting challenge to that theology that insists God hates babies or some adults for no reason. Since this is their firm position, there really can’t be any reasonable answer.

It is, however, a reason why some atheists think God is either not there or very cruel for hating Esau from birth. It is not the record of the Bible, not of the history of Esau or God, but when one has selected a preferred theology instead of the truth, not even the Holy Spirit can break through that shield.

The truth is God loved Esau same as every man and gave him land and offspring and protected them for a time….until they started doing grave wrong to people.

God is no respecter of persons as we are and he does not look at the outward appearance as we do, God looks at the heart. And in the Bible, there are only 2 types of hearts insofar as salvation is concerned. A heart of stone if someone is not saved and a heart of flesh if one is truly saved. Both are not to be taken as literal but spiritually. There is no age restriction as to who could and could not be saved. Therefore, if a beautiful baby comes intot his world, our hearts melt with love and compassion for this child, but we can't see the condition of this child's heart, only God can. And if this child does not have the Spirit of God within him (meaning became saved) then he is none of his.

Romans 8:9 (KJV 1900)
But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

This is why there was a requirement to be born again, because the initial physical birth did nothing for the new born baby who was not yet saved.

John 3:7 (KJV 1900)
Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

And it isn't that God hates some pople "for no reason" as you say, but it's for the most important reason of all, it's because of sin. This is why God speaks of unsaved people this way:

Psalm 58:3–5 (KJV 1900)
3  The wicked are estranged from the womb:
They go astray as soon as they be born, speaking lies.
4  Their poison is like the poison of a serpent:
They are like the deaf adder that stoppeth her ear;
5  Which will not hearken to the voice of charmers,
Charming never so wisely.

Of course, this is all spiritual language, but nevertheless, God helps us pinpoint that sin in the life of the child begins at conception.

Psalm 51:5 (KJV 1900)
5  Behold, I was shapen in iniquity;
And in sin did my mother conceive me.

So , the truth is NOT that God loved Esau, because the clearly scriptures declare otherwise, but God in fact hated Esau, meaning thatGod did not pay for Esau's sins. And Esau represents all those who have not had their sins paid for by Christ.

Lastly, earthly blessings are not a measure of God's love for an individual. Remember:

Matthew 5:45 (KJV 1900)
......for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.

We can look through the scriptures and see countless of people who were given earthly blessings yet were under the wrath of God their whole life. How about all the wicked kings of Israel? They had all the power and wealth of the nation and yet their earthly blessings meant absolutely nothing insofar as their salvation (the Love of God) was concerned. Thus, we can look at Esau's earthly life and certainly say that he was blessed with possesions, but that is here for a moment and gone when compared to eternity.