Do you really care that I am going to hell?

[Cmass]

I don't think you really believe I will fry in Hell for being an Atheist. I don't think you really truly believe any of your non-believing family will either. I think deep down, you know it just isn't true.

If you do believe they will all fry and are not doing absolutely everything in your power to stop it, I would suggest that you are a very cold, dispassionate person. If you really believed your dearly beloved mother was going to burn in hell right next to Cmass and Charles Manson then you would stop at nothing to convince her to accept Jesus. You would not just gently encourage, you would be emotionally and perhaps even physically engaged on a daily and hourly basis. You most certainly would not be reading this silly OP right now. Not if you REALLY cared.

Think about it. If you saw your mother being beaten by someone on the street, would you stop to help save her? Would you put your own life at risk to keep her from drowning? Is there anything you would not do to help her? OK, what about eternal torture in hell? Doesn't this concern you? What about all the other people in your life who are going to hell? Doesn't this leave you feeling devastated? If I believed there was a hell and that so many people would be going - especially any of my friends or family - I would be in constant agony myself and would devote my life to stopping it. Or, I would be numb.

Does your knowledge that so many people will be in eternal torture bother you very much on a daily basis?

This OP came about after reading commentary by some of our more conservative Christian friends in here. Some seem to have no real problem with all us atheists burning in hell forever. Granted, there are probably some personal anger issues involved but still, I have always been uneasy with how casual many Christians are when it comes to discussing eternal damnation. Some get more upset over running over a kitty than the eternal torture of their best friend.

Nonetheless, I give most the benefit of the doubt: I don't think they are really that cold. I just don't think they really believe as much in the hell concept as they report.

[Openmind]

Hell is in the center of the earth. I have seen hell in a dream, or I was taken (my spirit) by angels to view it,

Come on Biker...you rely on your dreams? I love dreams, don't get me wrong, especially lucid dreams (the ones where you suddenly realise that you are dreaming and can do whatever you want!) - but I never kid myself into thinking they are real!

Angels in your dreams? I've had dragons and aliens and unicorns in my dreams. Doesn't mean they are real.

[Zzyzx]

Hell is in the center of the earth. I have seen hell in a dream, or I was taken (my spirit) by angels to view it, I'm not sure which! I didn't go into hell proper, but was in the foyer or entrance way. I could hear hell itself and smell it. It is real, I have been to the entrance and seen a very disturbing scene, that shook me to the very core of my being.

This explains a lot of the attitudes conveyed in Biker posts. A dream!!!!!!

Dreams are a form of delusion. The events are not real. "Some cannot distinguish between reality and delusion.

From Merriam Webster: 1 : a series of thoughts, images, or emotions occurring during sleep 2 : an experience of waking life having the characteristics of a dream: as a : a visionary creation of the imagination : DAYDREAM b : a state of mind marked by abstraction or release from reality : REVERIE c : an object seen in a dreamlike state : VISION

Visions" like the above form the basis of much religious conviction.

Thank you, Biker, for sharing your dreams.

[Cmass]

Biker wrote:

I didn't go into hell proper, but was in the foyer or entrance way. I could hear hell itself and smell it. It is real, I have been to the entrance and seen a very disturbing scene, that shook me to the very core of my being.

Are you taking any antidepressants by chance? Same question for Adlemi.
Certain antidepressants can cause very lucid dreams including flying around the room and up into space (heaven?) as well as plunging into the bed and into the ground. I know this from first hand experience! I have taken antidepressants before and one of them caused dreams like this that were so real I actually looked forward to the next night's "trip". Where would I go tonight!? Would I meet Galileo and travel to the stars or perhaps see an Angel or perhaps even meet God? One night I was quite sure I met the Devil. It was a horrid creature that absolutely terrified me (I was under a lot of stress at work too and felt trapped) I could hardly describe but, oddly I felt I could whoop it's ass if I really staid myself - but he still scared the crap out of me.
Thankfully, I don't have need for those drugs anymore.

[Biker]

Biker wrote:

I didn't go into hell proper, but was in the foyer or entrance way. I could hear hell itself and smell it. It is real, I have been to the entrance and seen a very disturbing scene, that shook me to the very core of my being.

Are you taking any antidepressants by chance? Same question for Adlemi.
Certain antidepressants can cause very lucid dreams including flying around the room and up into space (heaven?) as well as plunging into the bed and into the ground. I know this from first hand experience! I have taken antidepressants before and one of them caused dreams like this that were so real I actually looked forward to the next night's "trip". Where would I go tonight!? Would I meet Galileo and travel to the stars or perhaps see an Angel or perhaps even meet God? One night I was quite sure I met the Devil. It was a horrid creature that absolutely terrified me (I was under a lot of stress at work too and felt trapped) I could hardly describe but, oddly I felt I could whoop it's ass if I really staid myself - but he still scared the crap out of me.
Thankfully, I don't have need for those drugs anymore.

I have never once in my life taken an antidepressant!
The only drug I have taken in the past 34 years is antibiotics a few times!
Do you always ridicule what you don't understand?

Biker

[Biker]

Joel 2:28-29. "And it will come about after this That I will pour out My Spirit on all mankind; And your sons and daughters will prophesy, Your old men will dream dreams, Your young men will see visions. And even on the male and female servants I will pour out My Spirit in those days."
If one is not swallowed up in a narcisistic life style and is curious spiritually, and has their eyes open to things going on around them, and an open mind, one could see the fulfillment of this inerrant Scripture. Right now!

Biker

[Cmass]

And this comes from the unmatched master of ridicule:

Biker wrote:

Do you always ridicule what you don't understand?

I understand quite well when I hear what is clearly a description of a dream - what is even called a "dream" by the person who described the scene. (you)

I understand that dreams are fantasies and that they are the product of your brain during times of rest. They can be measured, induced, eliminated, made into good dreams and bad due to life stress, chemicals (including antidepressants), certain food reactions etc..

I understand that if a person claims his dreams are real and has dreams during the wakened state (they have conversations with dream, fantasy creatures) then certain chemicals can go a long way toward eliminating them. In some cases, this waking dream state is called "schizophrenia" which is theorized to be a breakdown of the barrier between the two hemispheres of the brain.

I also understand that in order to enjoy a movie one has to "suspend reality" for the period of time one is watching it. The same goes for a good book. Most people stop suspending reality and return to normal when they leave the theater or close the book. Other people never stop suspending reality when they close The Book choosing to continue the fantasy. These people are called Christian Fundamentalists.

[Zzyzx]

Cmass,

You make an appropriate and thorough response to the Master of Ridicule.

His Dream tale was presented as “proof” of his knowledge of “hell” – and is typical of unverifiable Christian claims about supernatural “events”. Basing decisions on dreams seems typical and “God appeared to me” is a common claim. “Here is what god wants you to do” is what often follows if one has a gullible audience (of course there is never an agenda in such pronouncements, surely not).

The dream / delusion / fantasy explanation applies well to many Christian “visions” and “miracles”. Things that simply do not happen in the real world of nature that we inhabit can “happen” in the human imagination. Omniscient, omnipotent gods can create universes, waters can part to favor certain people, the Earth can stop rotating (sun stand still) so “chosen people” can win battles, all the world’s animals can be gathered onto a wooden boat, angels can fly – in imagination. However, imaginary “events” do not hold up to scrutiny – questioning, investigation.

Dreams, delusions, fantasies, visions and miracles cannot be verified if they are simply occurrences within a human mind. Such “experiences” can be induced by many known causes including: sleep deprivation, mind-altering chemicals, electrical brain stimulation, sensory depravation, starvation, dehydration, trauma, mental anguish, excessive introversion, oxygen deficiency, etc.

It does not seem wise to make life decisions based on dreams, delusions or fantasies, whether they be personal “experiences” or those reported by others (particularly the latter).

[Biker]

As all the freethinkers stumble blindly along tripping over the obvious ignoring the unignorable acting like the see no evil hear no evil speak no evil darwinian monkey man. Selectively misinterpreting, misunderstanding according to their rationalist, naturalist, priori self imposed box!
Joel 2:28 English word "dream" is translated from the Hebrew-Aramaic word halom.
Revelatory dream in which God conveys information to mankind. Of which I enjoy often. Being a believer and follower and disciple and and servant and bond slave of the Most High God. God speaks to me in dreams and gives me understanding of His Revelatory dreams to me.
You are being spoken to by the living God also. Your rebellion blinds you!
He is speaking, your not listening!
Your ignorance deafens you!

Biker

[Scrotum]

As all the freethinkers stumble blindly along tripping over the obvious ignoring the unignorable acting like the see no evil hear no evil speak no evil darwinian monkey man. Selectively misinterpreting, misunderstanding according to their rationalist, naturalist, priori self imposed box!
Joel 2:28 English word "dream" is translated from the Hebrew-Aramaic word halom.
Revelatory dream in which God conveys information to mankind. Of which I enjoy often. Being a believer and follower and disciple and and servant and bond slave of the Most High God. God speaks to me in dreams and gives me understanding of His Revelatory dreams to me.
You are being spoken to by the living God also. Your rebellion blinds you!
He is speaking, your not listening!
Your ignorance deafens you!

Biker

Are you saying all our dreams are messages from God now? Even when we have scientific fact explaining to you what Dreams are and come from as well as how they can be portrayed?


I have no rebellion, If God would speak to me, i would listen, so why does he not speak to me? You seem to make the ludricous falacy to say that If i dont hear him, im "rebelling" against him, erh, how would that work? Everyone not agreeing with oyu and cant see it, is REBELLING, wow.

[Biker]

The prophet Joel spoke this: "And it will come about after this That I will pour out My Spirit on all mankind; And your sons and daughters will prophesy, Your old men will dream dreams, Your young men will see visions. And even on the male and female servants I will pour out My Spirit in those days." (Joel 2:28-29.)

Jesus the Christ (Messiah) spoke this: "But I tell you the truth, it is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper shall not come to you; but if I go, I will send Him to you." (John 16:7.)
Then Jesus spoke this after His death and resurrection before He ascended: "And gathering them together, He commanded them not to leave Jerusalem, but to wait for what the Father had promised, 'Which,' He said, 'you heard of from Me; for John baptized with water, but you shall be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now.'" (Acts 1:4-5.)

Peter said this when the promise through Joel and Jesus was fulfilled: "but this is what was spoken of through the prophet Joel:" (Acts 2:16.)

We live in those days.
I am receiving dreams from God just as Joel said!
Are you?


Biker