The End Times Are Very Near
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The End Times Are Very Near
Post #1There is a lot of evidence supporting the idea that the end times and the rapture are very near to happening. for example, the United Nations fulfill the prophesy that very near to the end times, the world will be united as one, and there will be peace on the earth(even though we're a long way from peace). also, barcodes, credit cards etc. are an early warning to the mark of the beast being used to pay for all of our expenses. In college station, Texas, there are stores where you can pay for your groceries, appliances, etc., with your thumbprint. So what does everyone else think? Are the end times and Judgement Day near?
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Cathar1950
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Post #61
There are making money, Tax free. That has to count for somethingEvangelical circles are full of talk about how we know that the second coming is imminent (in time!). In fact, that seems to be the motivation for this whole thread. These people are trying to have it both ways, on the one hand saying ' well, we don't really know the day or the hour,' but on the other hand often making very specific predictions that it will occur very soon (eg. Hal Lindsay).
look at john edwards!
Post #62
McCulloch, you asked
I may be the only one in the world with my particular view of Revelation, and I'll admit up front that the chronology of events from Chapter 13 on is somewhat hazy to me.
Now, as to your question about evidence of what constituted the first three seals.
The four sevens following John being transported to the Day of the Lord follow a recurring pattern in scripture. Unfortunately I Just got a phone call and cannot elaborate.
I would be happy to send anyone a free cyber copy of my book for the asking. JED@minister.com
Hopefully I can write more later.
JED
You are quite correct that there is little agreement among Christians regarding the meaning of the seals (and just about everything else in Revelation). Status quo does not establish truth. Just because the vast majority hold a belief doesn't mean it's true.Do you have any evidence of what constituted the first three seals? I am unaware of agreement among christians of the meaning of the seals and the trumps.
I may be the only one in the world with my particular view of Revelation, and I'll admit up front that the chronology of events from Chapter 13 on is somewhat hazy to me.
Now, as to your question about evidence of what constituted the first three seals.
The four sevens following John being transported to the Day of the Lord follow a recurring pattern in scripture. Unfortunately I Just got a phone call and cannot elaborate.
I would be happy to send anyone a free cyber copy of my book for the asking. JED@minister.com
Hopefully I can write more later.
JED
Post #63
Nobody has posted since my previous incomplete post.
In that post I mentioned that there’s a recurring pattern running through the scriptures.
I first became aware of it when studying the temple. The architecture of the temple outlines the history of the world from the creation to the Kingdom Age.
* In the Holy of Holies everything is overlaid with gold. This area denotes the Kingdom Age. (There’s a lot more symbolism going on but this will have to be an overview to keep it brief.)
* Before the Holy of Holies is the holy place. This area represents the ‘church age’.
* Before the holy place is a staircase rising from the brass alter to the holy place. This represents Christ’s ascension.
* The brass alter represents Christ’s sacrifice. It’s in the court known as the court of the Jews. The brass laver in this court represents the crossing of the Red Sea. This court represents the period from Abraham to John the Baptist; the age of the Jews.
* Outside the gates to the court of the Jews is a court known as the court of the gentiles. This represents the period from Adam to the destruction of Babylon.
The first verse in the Bible follows this pattern. Time, space, matter and energy are brought to bear by God at the center of the thought. Not at the center of the syntax of the sentence, but as the agent of the action.
The face of the created earth reflects this pattern as well. The river (representing God) divided the earth into four areas.
The Israelites marched in the wilderness under four banners. Rabbinical tradition maintains these ‘standards’ bore the images of the living creatures before God’s throne, the man, the ox, the eagle and the lion. The tabernacle (at its center) represented the presence of the LORD.
There are four ages appointed to this creation. Each begins with a man who owes his origin to a miracle of God.
* Adam was brought forth from the dust of the ground.
* Isaac was brought forth from the womb of a 90-year-old barren woman.
* Jesus was brought forth from the womb of a virgin, the only begotten Son of God.
* Emmanuel, the first begotten from the dead.
Many argue that the patriarch of the final age is the same as Jesus. It must be remembered that God deals in puns. Isaac was a descendant of Adam, so you could argue that Isaac was 100% human. Yes, but you could also say that Isaac ‘arose’ from Adam. You could also say that Emmanuel ‘arose’ from Jesus, and the pun is sprung. Doesn’t the prophecy say the resurrected Jesus “shall” be called Emmanuel, God with us?
Applying this pattern to Revelation, we find four sevens after John is transported to the day of the Lord: Seven seals, seven trumpets, seven thunders and seven vials (bowls).
The seals are the legacy of the disobedient house of Adam, the trumpets, the legacy of Israel, the thunders; the church of Jesus Christ and the vials; those of that age to come and the patriarch of that age.
In the seals (the focus of this discussion) the first four have a character unlike the final 3. We commonly refer to them as the ‘horsemen of the Apocalypse’. Far too often these are dismissed simply as ‘war, famine, pestilence and death’. What a mockery is made of God’s Word with such a shallow handling of a passage so rich with symbolism.
In each of the seals there is both a horse and a rider. In the relationship of horse and rider, the horse is the vehicle. It is my contention that each horse represents an ideology of man used as a vehicle by the usurper to establish the four walls of hegemony over those who dwell upon the earth.
* The white horse represents the ideology of white supremacy, which is precisely the rationale that gave the white nations of Europe the idea they should subjugate what they considered the inferior races of the earth. Go read Revelation 6, a crown was given to the rider of the white horse. Even today a reference to ‘the crown’ alludes to the crown of England.
* The Red horse is even more obvious, Red Communism has as its modus operandi that it ‘takes peace from the earth’ by creating polarized factions in an otherwise peaceful culture to manufacture strife and confusion in order to subvert and gain power.
** Before I go on, it’s interesting to note that Satan’s counterfeit is complete with the counterfeit of God’s throne in the midst. The axis powers of Germany, Japan and Italy arose in the chronological center of these four horsemen. The black dragon was the symbol of Japan. Rome is the capitol of Italy, and Hitler’s Germany eerily reflects all four ideologies involved in these four horsemen, it was white supremacist, socialist, based upon a fraudulent economy and anti-Semitic to the extreme.
* The Black horse in which commodities and economic austerity measures are alluded to and represent our debt-based federal reserve economy.
* The Green Horse. Many of you are upset because I didn’t call it a “pale” horse. Stop now and go look up the Koiné Greek word. Everywhere else it is used throughout the New Testament and the Septuagint, it denotes the color green or green grass, tree or shrubbery.
Green is the color of Islam. Every muslim country has green on their flag. The rider’s name is death, their modus operandi is to kill with the sword, famine, death and the beasts of the earth. They have power over a fourth part of the earth. How do you kill with death? How about ‘Hamas-cide” bombing. How do you kill with the beasts of the earth? There’s little teeny beasts of the earth too like ebola, anthrax, smallpox etc.
It is significant to remember the last enemy to be overcome is death.
By the way, the nation Israel became a nation in the midst of these four horsemen. Why is that significant? Hitler made it national policy to exterminate the Jews. By putting his hand to kill those who are the apple of God’s eye, he fell prey to the reciprocal outcome of a scriptural axiom. Those who bless thee will I bless, and those who curse thee will I curse. Hitler could only decrease, while Israel could only increase. It’s God’s mathematics, he subtracts in order to multiply. It was the appointed time.
What’s ahead? Following the fifth and sixth seal (which I’d love to go into, but don’t want to take the time) are the trumpets. For those with ears to hear, go back and study the destruction of Jericho, then consider these four walls of Satan’s prison: Darwinism, Socialism, Debt-driven/controlled Capitalism and the false religion of Islam. These will be felled by the trumpets, which follow the seals and set the captives free. (The resurrection occurs “at the last trump”.
We are now between the third and fourth seals, the fourth seal has been opened. How long will it be? Only God knows the times and the seasons.
JED
In that post I mentioned that there’s a recurring pattern running through the scriptures.
I first became aware of it when studying the temple. The architecture of the temple outlines the history of the world from the creation to the Kingdom Age.
* In the Holy of Holies everything is overlaid with gold. This area denotes the Kingdom Age. (There’s a lot more symbolism going on but this will have to be an overview to keep it brief.)
* Before the Holy of Holies is the holy place. This area represents the ‘church age’.
* Before the holy place is a staircase rising from the brass alter to the holy place. This represents Christ’s ascension.
* The brass alter represents Christ’s sacrifice. It’s in the court known as the court of the Jews. The brass laver in this court represents the crossing of the Red Sea. This court represents the period from Abraham to John the Baptist; the age of the Jews.
* Outside the gates to the court of the Jews is a court known as the court of the gentiles. This represents the period from Adam to the destruction of Babylon.
The first verse in the Bible follows this pattern. Time, space, matter and energy are brought to bear by God at the center of the thought. Not at the center of the syntax of the sentence, but as the agent of the action.
The face of the created earth reflects this pattern as well. The river (representing God) divided the earth into four areas.
The Israelites marched in the wilderness under four banners. Rabbinical tradition maintains these ‘standards’ bore the images of the living creatures before God’s throne, the man, the ox, the eagle and the lion. The tabernacle (at its center) represented the presence of the LORD.
There are four ages appointed to this creation. Each begins with a man who owes his origin to a miracle of God.
* Adam was brought forth from the dust of the ground.
* Isaac was brought forth from the womb of a 90-year-old barren woman.
* Jesus was brought forth from the womb of a virgin, the only begotten Son of God.
* Emmanuel, the first begotten from the dead.
Many argue that the patriarch of the final age is the same as Jesus. It must be remembered that God deals in puns. Isaac was a descendant of Adam, so you could argue that Isaac was 100% human. Yes, but you could also say that Isaac ‘arose’ from Adam. You could also say that Emmanuel ‘arose’ from Jesus, and the pun is sprung. Doesn’t the prophecy say the resurrected Jesus “shall” be called Emmanuel, God with us?
Applying this pattern to Revelation, we find four sevens after John is transported to the day of the Lord: Seven seals, seven trumpets, seven thunders and seven vials (bowls).
The seals are the legacy of the disobedient house of Adam, the trumpets, the legacy of Israel, the thunders; the church of Jesus Christ and the vials; those of that age to come and the patriarch of that age.
In the seals (the focus of this discussion) the first four have a character unlike the final 3. We commonly refer to them as the ‘horsemen of the Apocalypse’. Far too often these are dismissed simply as ‘war, famine, pestilence and death’. What a mockery is made of God’s Word with such a shallow handling of a passage so rich with symbolism.
In each of the seals there is both a horse and a rider. In the relationship of horse and rider, the horse is the vehicle. It is my contention that each horse represents an ideology of man used as a vehicle by the usurper to establish the four walls of hegemony over those who dwell upon the earth.
* The white horse represents the ideology of white supremacy, which is precisely the rationale that gave the white nations of Europe the idea they should subjugate what they considered the inferior races of the earth. Go read Revelation 6, a crown was given to the rider of the white horse. Even today a reference to ‘the crown’ alludes to the crown of England.
* The Red horse is even more obvious, Red Communism has as its modus operandi that it ‘takes peace from the earth’ by creating polarized factions in an otherwise peaceful culture to manufacture strife and confusion in order to subvert and gain power.
** Before I go on, it’s interesting to note that Satan’s counterfeit is complete with the counterfeit of God’s throne in the midst. The axis powers of Germany, Japan and Italy arose in the chronological center of these four horsemen. The black dragon was the symbol of Japan. Rome is the capitol of Italy, and Hitler’s Germany eerily reflects all four ideologies involved in these four horsemen, it was white supremacist, socialist, based upon a fraudulent economy and anti-Semitic to the extreme.
* The Black horse in which commodities and economic austerity measures are alluded to and represent our debt-based federal reserve economy.
* The Green Horse. Many of you are upset because I didn’t call it a “pale” horse. Stop now and go look up the Koiné Greek word. Everywhere else it is used throughout the New Testament and the Septuagint, it denotes the color green or green grass, tree or shrubbery.
Green is the color of Islam. Every muslim country has green on their flag. The rider’s name is death, their modus operandi is to kill with the sword, famine, death and the beasts of the earth. They have power over a fourth part of the earth. How do you kill with death? How about ‘Hamas-cide” bombing. How do you kill with the beasts of the earth? There’s little teeny beasts of the earth too like ebola, anthrax, smallpox etc.
It is significant to remember the last enemy to be overcome is death.
By the way, the nation Israel became a nation in the midst of these four horsemen. Why is that significant? Hitler made it national policy to exterminate the Jews. By putting his hand to kill those who are the apple of God’s eye, he fell prey to the reciprocal outcome of a scriptural axiom. Those who bless thee will I bless, and those who curse thee will I curse. Hitler could only decrease, while Israel could only increase. It’s God’s mathematics, he subtracts in order to multiply. It was the appointed time.
What’s ahead? Following the fifth and sixth seal (which I’d love to go into, but don’t want to take the time) are the trumpets. For those with ears to hear, go back and study the destruction of Jericho, then consider these four walls of Satan’s prison: Darwinism, Socialism, Debt-driven/controlled Capitalism and the false religion of Islam. These will be felled by the trumpets, which follow the seals and set the captives free. (The resurrection occurs “at the last trump”.
We are now between the third and fourth seals, the fourth seal has been opened. How long will it be? Only God knows the times and the seasons.
JED
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McCulloch
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Post #64
Other than your matching up modern events with Revelation, do you have any evidence that this interpretation is true?JED wrote:Nobody has posted since my previous incomplete post.
In that post I mentioned that there’s a recurring pattern running through the scriptures.
...
We are now between the third and fourth seals, the fourth seal has been opened. How long will it be? Only God knows the times and the seasons.
JED
Post #65
My initial reaction is baloney. THis is a quite fanciful reading into scripture. I would also completely reject that Darwin has anything to do with Satan. Sorry for the dismissive and annoyed tone, but this is a pet peeve of mine. Many claim evolution is somehow evil, but I have never seen any argument for this that holds any water, and I have to say I am getting awfully tired of this repetitive mantra.JED wrote: . . . then consider these four walls of Satan’s prison: Darwinism, Socialism, Debt-driven/controlled Capitalism and the false religion of Islam.
Most of the arguments I have seen for this make the same mistake that some atheists make in ascribing evil and error to the Bible because some people misread the Bible and reach erroneous conclusions on the basis of scripture. The fact that some people do this says nothing about the Bible, just as the fact that some may have misused the theory of evolution says nothing about the truth (or value) of evolution.
Post #66
evolution teaches things that are contrary to what the Bible teaches, such as, God created animals, and He created man from the dust of the ground. If someone does something that is contrary to what the Bible teaches (i.e. lying, or murder), than it is evil. Evolution is no different.micatala wrote:Many claim evolution is somehow evil, but I have never seen any argument for this that holds any water, and I have to say I am getting awfully tired of this repetitive mantra.
Post #67
axeplayer wrote:micatala wrote:Many claim evolution is somehow evil, but I have never seen any argument for this that holds any water, and I have to say I am getting awfully tired of this repetitive mantra.Evolution does not teach that God did not create animals.evolution teaches things that are contrary to what the Bible teaches, such as, God created animals
Evolution does not teach that man was not made from dust, though many scientists believe that evolution supports that view.and He created man from the dust of the ground.
What happens if the Bible contradicts what the Bible teaches? The Bible says in one place that Jesus is light, and in another that He is bread.If someone does something that is contrary to what the Bible teaches (i.e. lying, or murder), than it is evil.
Post #68
really? what part about a unicellular lifeform forming from just the right mixture of chemicals at just the right time in primordial slime and then evolving into everything we see today even comes close to supporting the idea that God created animals?tilia wrote:Evolution does not teach that God did not create animals.
again, how does the claim that man evolved from the same ancestor as monkeys come close to supporting the idea that God formed man in his own image from the dust of the ground so that he may rule over the animals?tilia wrote:Evolution does not teach that man was not made from dust, though many scientists believe that evolution supports that view.
what would happen? i guess we'll never know until someone actually finds a valid self-contradiction in the Bible.tilia wrote:What happens if the Bible contradicts what the Bible teaches?
How is that a contradiction? Jesus is light and bread. If the Bible said that Jesus was light and then somewhere else it said that Jesus was darkness, then that would be a valid contradiction. Jesus being light and bread isn't even close to being a contradiction. It's like someone saying that you are smart, and someone else saying that you are friendly, these aren't contradictions.tilia wrote:The Bible says in one place that Jesus is light, and in another that He is bread.
Post #69
axeplayer wrote:tilia wrote:Evolution does not teach that God did not create animals.Any of it, all of it.really? what part about a unicellular lifeform forming from just the right mixture of chemicals at just the right time in primordial slime and then evolving into everything we see today even comes close to supporting the idea that God created animals?
tilia wrote:Evolution does not teach that man was not made from dust, though many scientists believe that evolution supports that view.Dust forms slime, slime makes primates. A primate 'in His own image' presents the same difficulty (if there is one) regardless of the method creation chosen.again, how does the claim that man evolved from the same ancestor as monkeys come close to supporting the idea that God formed man in his own image from the dust of the ground so that he may rule over the animals?
tilia wrote:What happens if the Bible contradicts what the Bible teaches?what would happen? i guess we'll never know until someone actually finds a valid self-contradiction in the Bible.tilia wrote:The Bible says in one place that Jesus is light, and in another that He is bread.How can light be bread? Do we eat light? Do tungsten filaments make bread? There is a contradiction, because Jesus cannot be both. He is a lamb, too.How is that a contradiction? Jesus is light and bread.
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The Happy Humanist
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Post #70
Tilia - I'm on your side, but...think "metaphors."How can light be bread? Do we eat light? Do tungsten filaments make bread? There is a contradiction, because Jesus cannot be both. He is a lamb, too.How is that a contradiction? Jesus is light and bread.
Jim, the Happy Humanist!
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Any sufficiently advanced worldview will be indistinguishable from sheer arrogance --The Happy Humanist (with apologies to Arthur C. Clarke)
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Any sufficiently advanced worldview will be indistinguishable from sheer arrogance --The Happy Humanist (with apologies to Arthur C. Clarke)
