Where's God?

[POI]

Does he pop up in my dreams? Is he the one whom produces my goose-bumps? Is He the one giving me my "moral compass"? Is he only experienced during deep meditation? If I have enough faith, will he appear to me? But seriously. Where is he? I was a Christian for decades. I earnestly prayed for him to reach me, to no avail.

For debate: Why have I not felt his presence?

A) I never tried hard enough; lack faith
B) He does not want to reveal Himself to me (yet)
C) Evil is blocking the request(s)
D) I'm too dumb to realize he's reaching me
E) He's not really there at all <- Current conclusion

Do not answer yet. This topic has spawned from another unrelated topic. I decided to devote this large topic to itself. Below are some premises:

P1) does god exist? (dunno)
P2) does god want a relationship with all, especially the ones who seek him (apparently so)
P3) is god capable of communicating (apparently so)
P4) can god communicate his message in a way in which the recipient could no longer deny (apparently so)
P5) have I asked for this communication earnestly and repetitively (YES)
P6) does the Bible state god answers the call to all who seek him (YES)

At best, god has opted not to contact me YET. And this would be after decades of actively seeking him. Without any emotion, I'm logically left with 2 options.

A) God is not really there <- Current conclusion.
B) God is not adhering to his promise (yet).

[BruceLeiter]

[Replying to OneJack in post #324]

I have read and studied the Bible many times, @OneJack, and have received God's salvation and eternal life through no merit of my own when I was 16.

The verse that you cite, according to the context, involves Jesus' criticism of the way his listeners were studying the Scriptures, not the fact that they studied them. They used the Old Testament as a way to gain salvation through their obedience to the law and their rules. Thus, he says that the way they approached the Old Testament was faulty. The New Testament clearly says that we must read and study the Scriptures:

Luk_24:32  They said to each other, “Did not our hearts burn within us while he talked to us on the road, while he opened to us the Scriptures?”
Luk_24:45  Then he opened their minds to understand the Scriptures,

Act_17:2  And Paul went in, as was his custom, and on three Sabbath days he reasoned with them from the Scriptures,
Act_17:11  Now these Jews were more noble than those in Thessalonica; they received the word with all eagerness, examining the Scriptures daily to see if these things were so.

Act_18:28  for he powerfully refuted the Jews in public, showing by the Scriptures that the Christ was Jesus.

Rom_15:4  For whatever was written in former days was written for our instruction, that through endurance and through the encouragement of the Scriptures we might have hope.

Eph_1:13  In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit,
2Ti_2:15  Do your best to present yourself to God as one approved, a worker who has no need to be ashamed, rightly handling the word of truth.

[POI]

But no one notices how God does His talking to all in general

Why in the heck would god knowingly do this, if god knows you are not even going to notice?

[BruceLeiter]

[Replying to POI in post #332]

It's not God's fault that people don't notice his revelation of himself through the Bible and his creation, @POI. It's the humans' fault, so that they are without any excuse:

Rom 1:18  For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who by their unrighteousness suppress the truth. 
Rom 1:19  For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. 
Rom 1:20  For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse. 

[POI]

[Replying to BruceLeiter in post #333]

I did not ask whose fault it is. I asked:

Why in the heck would god knowingly do this, if god knows you are not even going to notice? In other words, if he knows someone will not notice, As I highlighted you saying in post 332, why would he even bother?

[BruceLeiter]

[Replying to POI in post #334]

God cares because he has made every human creature; we are his creation, @POI.

[OneJack]

But no one notices how God does His talking to all in general

Why in the heck would god knowingly do this, if god knows you are not even going to notice?

This is one of God's ways of guiding people to the right path. One good example is when we are living in sin, God speaks with us through other people known to us, incidents, accidents, and consequences. God set them to cross our path to give us warnings, cautions, and moral lessons so we realize that we're doing things that draw us away from God; hence, the destiny of our souls is at risk of damnation in due time. In short, God impedes our path to slow down our wrongdoings and gives us space to consider the reality that someone much more powerful is always watching us. Therefore, the possibility of coming to and calling on the much more powerful Spirit Being is not far from reality one day.

[POI]

But no one notices how God does His talking to all in general

Why in the heck would god knowingly do this, if god knows you are not even going to notice?

This is one of God's ways of guiding people to the right path. One good example is when we are living in sin, God speaks with us through other people known to us, incidents, accidents, and consequences. God set them to cross our path to give us warnings, cautions, and moral lessons so we realize that we're doing things that draw us away from God;

The beauty in answers like this is there is absolutely no way to falsify the claim(s). It's an ever-moving target for which no skeptic can really ever challenge. It's an absolutely unfalsifiable set of given conditions for which apologists often like to go.

In short, God impedes our path to slow down our wrongdoings and gives us space to consider the reality that someone much more powerful is always watching us. Therefore, the possibility of coming to and calling on the much more powerful Spirit Being is not far from reality one day.

If he is going to impede upon our path, then just be a little more obvious about it. After decades, I have not noticed any god-driven impedance at all. Instead, just life happening. Again, if I never notice, then WHAT is the point? I haven't noticed anything, which would require a god at all. Time is running out. What the heck is he waiting for? If he is going to impede, then impede to where the skeptic will actually notice something.

[POI]

[Replying to POI in post #334]

God cares because he has made every human creature; we are his creation, @POI.

You are still not addressing my question. 3rd request. I'll rephrase it...

If god knows you will not notice, then what would be the point? Stating that he cares is irrelevant to my specific question, as I am addressing a specific asserted action in which god is claimed to perform. Let's just assume he cares. Okay, why contact people in a way in which they do not notice? Essentially, god is not achieving his goal, as the human is not even aware god is 'contacting' them.

[POI]

I'll say one thing... The Bible god is the grand champion of remaining hidden to me; and apparently also in modern times, when compared to written tales from Biblical times.

[BruceLeiter]

[Replying to POI in post #337]

God wants to teach us his will history through the Bible, his Book, @POI, if we will listen to him in his inspiration of its writers, who are prophets, apostles, and people who knew them personally.