Sodom, Greece, Rome and homosexuality.

AlAyeti · Post by **AlAyeti** » Sun Jul 03, 2005 11:00 pm

Does allowing for diversity include parents having no voice in what their children are forced to be taught and have to accept?

Do Christians and the many other cultures and belief systems opposed to homosexuality have the right to have their culture and religious views respected in society when it comes to decent and natural sexual behavior in the education system and in public?

Are homosexuals demanding accesss to children under the label of diversity and anti-hate legislation?

This seems the number one issue between average and normal "family" people and the homosexual agenda.

Can there be laws passed that keeps homosexuality from becoming forced on children and families that oppose it, without the homosexual community and homosexual action organizations crying discrimination?

Is there such a thing anymore as heterosexual rights?

trencacloscas · Post by **trencacloscas** » Sat Jul 23, 2005 6:08 am

I consider Pederasty and the homosexual agenda one and the same.

That's only an issue of bigotry and ignorance. 'Pederasty' comes from the Greek word 'paidós', which means literally 'child', 'kid'... It's a big difference. Having sex between responsible adults can be harmless; with children, it's a whole different consideration and our laws see it that way.

But for you you're lucky. Anything you don't like in history, you discard.

Right on the contrary. I don't like Nazis, I don't like Russian Communists, and of course I don't like Christians. You seem to have a problem since you pretend to discard the crimes of the latter.

Hitler was Christian? Pathetic and laughable if it weren't for the amount of people he murdered. Almost as many as those atheists in communists countries. Please show me from the Gospels where his Christianity finds foundation? (I'm an Atheist then.)

He was baptized, he claimed to be Christian and he claimed to fight for the Christian God. Luke 19:27 provided him reasons, "bring hither", remember? He acted "in the name of", from a religious point of view.

Check his sayings:

From a speech in 1922:
"My feelings as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior as a fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, surrounded by a few followers, recognized these Jews for what they were and summoned men to fight against them and who, God's truth! was greatest not as a sufferer but as a fighter."

Only from "Mein Kampf":

"Hence today I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator: by defending myself against the Jew, I am fighting for the work of the Lord."
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"This human world of ours would be inconceivable without
the practical existence of a religious belief."

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"What we have to fight for...is the freedom and independence
of the fatherland, so that our people may be enabled to fulfill
the mission assigned to it by the Creator."

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"And the founder of Christianity made no secret indeed of his
estimation of the Jewish people. When He found it necessary,
He drove those enemies of the human race out of the Temple of God."

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"It may be that today gold has become the exclusive ruler of life, but
the time will come when man will again bow down before a higher god."

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"Thus inwardly armed with confidence in God and the unshakable
stupidity of the voting citizenry, the politicians can begin
the fight for the 'remaking' of the Reich as they call it."
[Adolph Hitler, "Mein Kampf" Vol. 2 Chapter 1]

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"The greatness of Christianity did not lie in attempted negotiations for
compromise with any similar philosophical opinions in the ancient world, but in its inexorable fanaticism in preaching and fighting for its own doctrine."

As Hitler never quit Catholicism, never broke the Concordat, strived to maintain united the Protestant churches, persecuted atheists, searched for mystic artifacts around the globe and declared often that religion was a great tool for political propaganda, I guess we can count him as a Christian.

But this was discussed in another topic: http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... a&start=80

Remember you wanted to follow this path. Instead of answering the question: Do the crimes of others wash away the crimes of the Christians????????

Christian liars are never let off the hook as easily as you let off Lenin and Stalin and their prophet Nietzsche.

What do you mean exactly? What hook is that?

Jesus is Joshua or Yeshua. A common name. And, very cool that God would pick something so common. But "Chrestus" and the problems in Roman culture because of it? C'Mon now. Only a "freethinker" can be that ignorant. Do the math. . .

I do the math, and the math is clear. 'Chrestus' does not equate to 'Christ' in English but to 'The Good' in Greek, It was a name used by both slaves and freemen and is attested more than eighty times in Latin inscriptions. Clearly, Suetonius was explaining why the Jews (not Christians) were expelled from Rome and is referring to a Jewish agitator in the 50s – not to a Galilean pacifist of the 30s.

Now your slight of hand with regards to Perpetua. A Christian changing their name? Where have I heard that before? Hmm, Peter maybe? Paul?

Any evidence of this or just an imagination of yours? Any independent source or testimony?

History sure is repeating itself worldwide on the Christian proselytizing thing huh? I'm sorry for reality when it's easier to disregard unpleasant things with ire.

Christians cannot use open killing and torture to proselytize these days like they did during centuries, but they still use lies.

Nietzsche's followers

You mean, like the Christian Hitler... of course. But Nietzsche's followers are not Nietzsche since Nietzsche didn't write neither about the use of violence or coercion, nor about organized state terror.

Sodom was a reality too

You mean, a historic Sodom?

Please refer me to where He said to harm anyone?

Luke 19:27
Luke 14:26
Luke 12:51-53
Matthew 10:34
Revelation 2:23
Luke 12:47
Matthew 18:15-17
Matthew 10:33
Matthew 13:41-42
Matthew 25:46
Matthew 23:14

And of course all the doctrine of the eternal damnation for sinners (pretty cruel, ah?), and all the wailing and gnashing of teeth that he was so fond of.

AlAyeti · Post by **AlAyeti** » Sat Jul 23, 2005 10:50 am

Your fear comes through loud and clear. And of course your hatred.

Your perspective is typical and common. I have "judged" violent people who claim to follow Christ from the Gospels. Jesus clearly points us to the fruits to tell whether a person is a believer. And in the case of Christians who do bad things, they have a no excuse like you do.

But I judge atheists by the actions of those who believe in it as well. The probability that a billion people have been murdered by atheism is in keeping with observable actions of the atheists in countries that have embraced this ideology and who murder or imprison any who don't.

Jesus spoke of hell as a reality. And it is.

The fruits of "historic Sodom" (?) can be seen in Boston. Now men demand to able to marry men. Women slaughter their children wholesale in their own wombs. Children are fatherless and suffering in staggering numbers even in "Westernized" countries. That you cannot see the Biblical stories proved as reality out your front window today, is unbelievable.

Hell is a reality that can be deduced from your very own efforts to drive the very thought from the world and your mind. Of course. It is too horrible to go unchallenged. And is one big reason Jesus was opposed as well by the people He condemned so loudly.

This is the only (bottom) line of the skeptic/atheist/secular/humanist. And it is as old as the first skeptic question asked in the Bible.

"Did God 'really' say?"

History repeating and repeating and repeating.

AlAyeti · Post by **AlAyeti** » Sat Jul 23, 2005 10:59 am

Do the crimes of others wash away the crimes of the Christians????????

No.

But will the others admit to their horrible acts and repent?

No.

I'm OK with the truth.

For example, look how you deny the evil of Neitszche's ubermensch and will trivialize those that have embraced atheism and its inevitable cruelty.

If scales measure things of worth, then Christianity is by far the most worthy. There can be no good done in the name of atheism because chaos begets chaos. Also historically provable. Where did Neitzsche end up? Almost laughable.

There is no morality in either evolution or its offspring of atheism. Murder is OK and so is any other evil (that doesn't exist). Just power.

trencacloscas · Post by **trencacloscas** » Sat Jul 23, 2005 12:02 pm

I'm sorry, pal, you don't seem to follow a logic or give clear statements, just get clung to prejudices and and bad rhetoric.

It is obvious that you never actually read Nietzsche directly and you don't care about the truth, just your fanatic bigotry against everything but your delusion of Christianity. Every sentence shows...

But I judge atheists by the actions of those who believe in it as well.

How can you possibly judge people who claim absense of beliefs for their beliefs?

AlAyeti · Post by **AlAyeti** » Sun Jul 24, 2005 10:57 am

Hundreds of millions murdered and subjugated by Atheists.

I can judge "its" worth and them.

Logically through empiricism.

teegstar · Post by **teegstar** » Mon Jul 25, 2005 10:10 am

This seems the number one issue between average and normal "family" people and the homosexual agenda.

Can you please explain to me what this homosexual agenda is exactly? Some evil plot to take over the world? Some scheme to tortue little bunnies? Some absurd plan to hijack the economy and become billionares?

trencacloscas · Post by **trencacloscas** » Mon Jul 25, 2005 1:45 pm

Hundreds of millions murdered and subjugated by Atheists.

I can judge "its" worth and them.

Logically through empiricism.

It would be interesting to hear where do these "hundreds of millions" come from. And why that's the excuse for 1700 years of crime, torture and superstition. What do empiricism has to do with it?

McCulloch · Post by **McCulloch** » Mon Jul 25, 2005 2:03 pm

AlAyeti wrote:Hundreds of millions murdered and subjugated by Atheists.
I can judge "its" worth and them.
Logically through empiricism.

trencacloscas wrote:
It would be interesting to hear where do these "hundreds of millions" come from. And why that's the excuse for 1700 years of crime, torture and superstition. What do empiricism has to do with it?

AlAyeti blames Atheism for the crimes of Stalinism and Maoism.
It is a kind of double standard. Any crimes done in the name of christianity are done by false christians and is certainly not caused by any flaw in the ideals of christianity. But atheism, itself, is at fault for all of the crimes done by atheists.

AlAyeti · Post by **AlAyeti** » Tue Jul 26, 2005 10:01 pm

Mculloch,

You can do the research yourself.

Where does a Christian find the support for killing people from their written beliefs? In fact Christns condemn other Christians who murder people in any name. Remember that woman murderer in Texas who became a "Born Again Christian in prison?" She was executed.

Communism finds its license to kill directly from atheism. Now isn't it the same slipperyness to say that atheism is "just" the belief in no god? That is a ludicrous position to take on this subject. Cause and effect, "empiricism" makes a sound judgment on that perspective.

Christianity ansd Christians came to a place of judgment from their belief system. Communists are still doing what their morality or lack thereof, is telling them it is OK to do. I have never once excused anyone of any belief system that murdered anyone. But to parade Hitler around as a Bible-believing Christian is absurd. I don't remember any Chrsitian group forming a crusader army to fight for the "Christians" in Waco? Do you?

Now religions like Islam, judge away. And of course the Soviets and Chinese did battle for any attacked communist country.

The killing fields were uncovered "somewhat." How many mountains of humans are strewn amongst communist countries that have no freedom. Hundreds of millions is an acurate assesment.

Why are America and western countries heading back to Sodom, Greece and Rome? Now that I would like to see an answer for.

The commie-atheist connection is obvious.

AlAyeti · Post by **AlAyeti** » Tue Jul 26, 2005 10:11 pm

T,

How many Christians were tortured and killed in the Inquisition?

Remember that the Jews were exiled out of Spain. Not so lucky were those Christians that did not want to follow Catholic dogma.

Also another example of Christian versus Christian to decide what it's all about. "Protest-ant.? Ever wonder about the "skepticism" in that word? C'mon now open your mind a bit.

Also, how many conscripts from "God knows where" were enlisted in the wars to take back the lands stolen by force and murder by the Muslims? I'm sorry the Crusaeds. No it is no excuse, but it may be a fact of history.

Maybe communists like Stalin and Lenin et al, weren't really atheists and/or had religious fundamentalists doing all of the genocidal slaughtering.

Just one look at all of those Christians going to church every week gives one a thought or two. . . bloodthirsty to the core.

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Sodom, Greece, Rome and homosexuality.

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