Exodus 3, who was in the burning bush?

[placebofactor]

Exodus 3:2, King James Bible, “The angel (messenger) of the LORD appeared to him (Moses) in a flame of fire from within the bush.”

Question, “Did the angel of the Lord appear to Moses as he was, or AS a flame of fire?” Answer: He appeared “in a flame of fire,” not “as a flame of fire.” He is present within the flame; the flame is the environment of the appearance, not the angel’s form.

Question: Is the LORD (YHWH) in verse 4 the “angel of the LORD” in verse 2? And in Verse 4, “When the LORD (YHWH) saw that he turned aside to look, God (Elohim) called to him from the midst of the bush.”
Question: Is the LORD and God in verse 4 the same person as the angel of the LORD in verse 2?

The text begins with “the angel of the LORD appeared…”, but when the voice speaks, it is simply “God” and “the LORD.” There was no change of scene, no new character introduced, no explanation. The same presence in the bush is now called “YHWH” and “Elohim.”

I understand that the God and LORD of verse 4 are the same person as the angel of the LORD in verse 2. And yes, each title carries a different theological emphasis.

As the Angel of the LORD, this is God manifested.
As the LORD, “YHWH,” this is his covenant identity, and,
As God, “Elohim,” it speaks of his authority and power. The narrative uses all three to give a fuller picture of who is speaking from the bush.

As for the name “I Am” in verse 14, it sums it all up. “I Am” means God will be what he will be." He will be the angel of the LORD delivering a message. As the LORD, he is speaking of his identity, faithfulness, and that he is and will be. And as God, he is the Creator, Sovereign, and Judge?

As the “I Am,” it sums up all three titles? “I Am” (Ehyeh) in Exodus 3:14 expresses God’s freedom, constancy, and self-determining nature. “He will be what he will be.” He will be whatever the situation requires; he will manifest Himself however He chooses because he is not and will not be defined by man.

Strictly limiting ourselves to what the Bible teaches, what do we know? John 1:18, “No man hath seen God (the Father) at any time.”
John 5:37, “Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape.” These two verses refer to the Father, as the context makes clear.

So, the Bible teaches that the Father has never been seen, and his voice never heard. So what is the logical conclusion we can draw? Who appeared and spoke to Moses in the bush? And who else holds all the titles of LORD, God, angel of the LORD, and the I Am? The only other divine person the scriptures identify as God, as LORD, as the angel of the LORD, and the I Am, is the Son of God, Jesus Christ.

[BruceLeiter]

[Replying to OneJack in post #59]

@OneJack, the Old Testament and Jesus' teachings existed then, both in Hebrew and in Greek, and the other in the disciples' minds, as they heard him firsthand. At that time, they added up to "the word" that Jesus was referring to, whereas we have the complete "word" that God inspired. Why did that personage you encountered discount "the word"? If he did, he wasn't the real Jesus but a fake one.

[OneJack]

[Replying to OneJack in post #59]

@OneJack, the Old Testament and Jesus' teachings existed then, both in Hebrew and in Greek, and the other in the disciples' minds, as they heard him firsthand. At that time, they added up to "the word" that Jesus was referring to, whereas we have the complete "word" that God inspired. Why did that personage you encountered discount "the word"? If he did, he wasn't the real Jesus but a fake one.

For you to be able to say fake, you must have heard it from God, have you, Bruce? Did the Lord God in the OT direct people to come to the scriptures to know Him and His will?

[Capbook]

By the same token, Capbook, you always rely on the words in the bible, are they the Lord God Jesus Christ, who is the only Savior of all? Will those words be able to save your soul?

Faith to the true Jesus can save us through God's grace OneJack.
I'm just sad that you seems would never plan to try that spirit, the "it is written" was the best defense Jesus used against the devil.
As the Word of God is the best defense and offense against the enemy OneJack.
Why not try, he might agree, and we'll be agreeable.

Eph 6:17  And take THE HELMET OF SALVATION, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God.[/color] 

Never did Jesus say that the Bible is the Word of God, did He?

OneJack, God Jesus, as written in John 8:31 said, in we continue in His word, that's God's Word being written.
Where? in the Bible OneJack.
Can you check it in your Bible if the verse I quote is true?

John 8:31  So Jesus was saying to those Jews who had believed Him, "If you continue in My word, then you are truly disciples of Mine; 

Use your wisdom, Capbook. The Bible did not yet exist when Jesus said that; therefore, the 'my word' in that verse is not about the Bible, but about the words that came out of the mouth of the Lord.

Yes, but later it was written in the Bible where almost all Christians read, just excluding your family OneJack.

[BruceLeiter]

[Replying to OneJack in post #62]

God did more than ask people to come to the Scriptures to know his will, @OneJack. He sent his words to the prophets to give to the people, mainly to turn them back from their idolatry and call them to obedience in following his will revealed in the laws. "Thus says the LORD" is said 415 times in the Old Testament. Do you want me to quote all of them? Of course not.

[OneJack]

[Replying to OneJack in post #62]

God did more than ask people to come to the Scriptures to know his will, @OneJack. He sent his words to the prophets to give to the people, mainly to turn them back from their idolatry and call them to obedience in following his will revealed in the laws. "Thus says the LORD" is said 415 times in the Old Testament. Do you want me to quote all of them? Of course not.

Read 100 times John 5:39-40 so that you may know you need to come to Jesus to have life, which you cannot find in the bible but in Christ Jesus alone.

[BruceLeiter]

[Replying to OneJack in post #65]

I came to Jesus in a personal commitment to follow him 67 years ago, @OneJack, and have had a personal relationship with him ever since then. Read my book What God Has Done: My True, Dramatic God-Biography.

[OneJack]

[Replying to OneJack in post #65]

I came to Jesus in a personal commitment to follow him 67 years ago, @OneJack, and have had a personal relationship with him ever since then. Read my book What God Has Done: My True, Dramatic God-Biography.

If you were, why would you continue to lock yourself up in the pages of the bible?

[BruceLeiter]

[Replying to OneJack in post #67]

I don't "lock myself up" in the Bible; it gives me God's principles for me to look at all of life from his viewpoint, for example, by viewing his creation as a means by which he reveals his glory and creative power. The result is my praise for his divine greatness. Psalm 19 gives that pattern with the first part (verses 1-6) praising God for his creative power revealed in his universe that the psalmist sees in the light of his Word, the Bible, in the second part (verses 7-14):

Psa 19:1  To the choirmaster. A Psalm of David. The heavens declare the glory of God, and the sky above proclaims his handiwork. 
Psa 19:2  Day to day pours out speech, and night to night reveals knowledge. 
Psa 19:3  There is no speech, nor are there words, whose voice is not heard. 
Psa 19:4  Their voice goes out through all the earth, and their words to the end of the world. In them he has set a tent for the sun, 
Psa 19:5  which comes out like a bridegroom leaving his chamber, and, like a strong man, runs its course with joy. 
Psa 19:6  Its rising is from the end of the heavens, and its circuit to the end of them, and there is nothing hidden from its heat. 
Psa 19:7  The law of the LORD is perfect, reviving the soul; the testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple; 
Psa 19:8  the precepts of the LORD are right, rejoicing the heart; the commandment of the LORD is pure, enlightening the eyes; 
Psa 19:9  the fear of the LORD is clean, enduring forever; the rules of the LORD are true, and righteous altogether. 
Psa 19:10  More to be desired are they than gold, even much fine gold; sweeter also than honey and drippings of the honeycomb. 
Psa 19:11  Moreover, by them is your servant warned; in keeping them there is great reward. 
Psa 19:12  Who can discern his errors? Declare me innocent from hidden faults. 
Psa 19:13  Keep back your servant also from presumptuous sins; let them not have dominion over me! Then I shall be blameless, and innocent of great transgression. 
Psa 19:14  Let the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart be acceptable in your sight, O LORD, my rock and my redeemer.