Paradise on Earth

[onewithhim]

When I learned that the Bible speaks of a restored Garden of Eden and the restoration of mankind to the perfection and endless life that Adam forfeited, I was thrilled. Who doesn't want to keep living on this beautiful earth, with our loved ones, and being able to do all the things we love to do---endlessly?

If God said to you today, "When do you want to die?" would you say "now!!"? I don't think very many people would say that.

We CAN live forever here on Earth. The Bible tells us that we can.

Matthew 5:5
Psalm 37:9-11,29

[Capbook]

... me a fire that can burn is not a symbol.

A symbolic fire, with symbolic burning can .

And symbolic ashes?

Exactly! Now you're getting the hang of it.

Lexicon doesn't define it as symbol. It is define as ashes.
אפר 'êpher
BDB Definition:
1) ashes

Things don't have to be defined as "symbols" in the same text. Does Revelation 13: 1,2 say that it is a symbol of something else? No, but we know the wild beast symbolizes governments of men.

I believe that things that does not exist in real life could be interpreted as symbolic but not things that we encounter in our daily lives, like fire. What consumes Sodom and Gomorrah then? And so is Ezek 28:18, we all know that real fire can bring things to ashes.

[onewithhim]

I just believe hell (gehenna) is not symbolic.

Could that be because you don't have a clear understanding if what the word "symbolic" actually means ?

How do you define symbolic then.

Online definition of symbolic;
1. serving as a symbol.
"a repeating design symbolic of eternity"
2. involving the use of symbols or symbolism.
"the symbolic meaning of motifs and designs"

Online definition of symbol;
1. a mark or character used as a conventional representation of an object, function, or process,

Could it be you dont understand how the above can apply to a scripture in the bible?

Because I don't see any "symbol or symbolic" in the verse. Even lexicon and commentaries doesn't mentions "symbol or symbolic"

So you don't know what "symbol" or "symbolic" mean. Do you understand the symbolism that JehovahsWitness posted for you regarding the sheep? It is an animal, yet it is a symbol of a person who hears Jesus' voice (through the scriptures) and follows him.

At least one translation uses the word "symbols," referring to the book of Revelation. "This is the revelation which God gave to Jesus Christ to show his slaves what must soon occur. He sent it by means of symbols through his angel, to his slave John." (Revelation 1:1, 21st Century New Testament)

Greek semaino does not define "symbol" in Lexicons.

σημαίνω sēmainō
Thayer Definition:
1) to give a sign, to signify, indicate
2) to make known

How does your post render what I said incorrect? Can you explain why you defined "symbol" after my post which only said that there is the word in Revelation1:1 after you lamented that you don't see "symbol" anywhere in the Bible? Could you read and comment on the previous two posts?

[myth-one.com]

I just believe hell (gehenna) is not symbolic.

Could that be because you don't have a clear understanding if what the word "symbolic" actually means ?

How do you define symbolic then.

Online definition of symbolic;
1. serving as a symbol.
"a repeating design symbolic of eternity"
2. involving the use of symbols or symbolism.
"the symbolic meaning of motifs and designs"

Online definition of symbol;
1. a mark or character used as a conventional representation of an object, function, or process,

Could it be you dont understand how the above can apply to a scripture in the bible?

Because I don't see any "symbol or symbolic" in the verse. Even lexicon and commentaries doesn't mentions "symbol or symbolic"

So you don't know what "symbol" or "symbolic" mean. Do you understand the symbolism that JehovahsWitness posted for you regarding the sheep? It is an animal, yet it is a symbol of a person who hears Jesus' voice (through the scriptures) and follows him.

At least one translation uses the word "symbols," referring to the book of Revelation. "This is the revelation which God gave to Jesus Christ to show his slaves what must soon occur. He sent it by means of symbols through his angel, to his slave John." (Revelation 1:1, 21st Century New Testament)

Greek semaino does not define "symbol" in Lexicons.

σημαίνω sēmainō
Thayer Definition:
1) to give a sign, to signify, indicate
2) to make known

How does your post render what I said incorrect? Can you explain why you defined "symbol" after my post which only said that there is the word in Revelation1:1 after you lamented that you don't see "symbol" anywhere in the Bible? Could you read and comment on the previous two posts?

symbol -- a mark or character used as a conventional representation of an object, function, or process.

sign -- an object, quality, or event whose presence or occurrence indicates the probable presence or occurrence of something else.

They seem to be synonyms -- a word or phrase that means exactly or nearly the same as another word or phrase in the same language.

And the word "sign" appears about 146 times in the Bible.

[Capbook]

I just believe hell (gehenna) is not symbolic.

Could that be because you don't have a clear understanding if what the word "symbolic" actually means ?

How do you define symbolic then.

Online definition of symbolic;
1. serving as a symbol.
"a repeating design symbolic of eternity"
2. involving the use of symbols or symbolism.
"the symbolic meaning of motifs and designs"

Online definition of symbol;
1. a mark or character used as a conventional representation of an object, function, or process,

Could it be you dont understand how the above can apply to a scripture in the bible?

Because I don't see any "symbol or symbolic" in the verse. Even lexicon and commentaries doesn't mentions "symbol or symbolic"

So you don't know what "symbol" or "symbolic" mean. Do you understand the symbolism that JehovahsWitness posted for you regarding the sheep? It is an animal, yet it is a symbol of a person who hears Jesus' voice (through the scriptures) and follows him.

At least one translation uses the word "symbols," referring to the book of Revelation. "This is the revelation which God gave to Jesus Christ to show his slaves what must soon occur. He sent it by means of symbols through his angel, to his slave John." (Revelation 1:1, 21st Century New Testament)

Greek semaino does not define "symbol" in Lexicons.

σημαίνω sēmainō
Thayer Definition:
1) to give a sign, to signify, indicate
2) to make known

How does your post render what I said incorrect? Can you explain why you defined "symbol" after my post which only said that there is the word in Revelation1:1 after you lamented that you don't see "symbol" anywhere in the Bible? Could you read and comment on the previous two posts?

I do check Rev 1:1 and find there's no word "symbol" in the original Greek.
I do replied on your post#3078 with my post 3081.

[Capbook]

I just believe hell (gehenna) is not symbolic.

Could that be because you don't have a clear understanding if what the word "symbolic" actually means ?

How do you define symbolic then.

Online definition of symbolic;
1. serving as a symbol.
"a repeating design symbolic of eternity"
2. involving the use of symbols or symbolism.
"the symbolic meaning of motifs and designs"

Online definition of symbol;
1. a mark or character used as a conventional representation of an object, function, or process,

Could it be you dont understand how the above can apply to a scripture in the bible?

Because I don't see any "symbol or symbolic" in the verse. Even lexicon and commentaries doesn't mentions "symbol or symbolic"

So you don't know what "symbol" or "symbolic" mean. Do you understand the symbolism that JehovahsWitness posted for you regarding the sheep? It is an animal, yet it is a symbol of a person who hears Jesus' voice (through the scriptures) and follows him.

At least one translation uses the word "symbols," referring to the book of Revelation. "This is the revelation which God gave to Jesus Christ to show his slaves what must soon occur. He sent it by means of symbols through his angel, to his slave John." (Revelation 1:1, 21st Century New Testament)

Greek semaino does not define "symbol" in Lexicons.

σημαίνω sēmainō
Thayer Definition:
1) to give a sign, to signify, indicate
2) to make known

How does your post render what I said incorrect? Can you explain why you defined "symbol" after my post which only said that there is the word in Revelation1:1 after you lamented that you don't see "symbol" anywhere in the Bible? Could you read and comment on the previous two posts?

symbol -- a mark or character used as a conventional representation of an object, function, or process.

sign -- an object, quality, or event whose presence or occurrence indicates the probable presence or occurrence of something else.

They seem to be synonyms -- a word or phrase that means exactly or nearly the same as another word or phrase in the same language.

And the word "sign" appears about 146 times in the Bible.

Yes, "sign" did appear in Ezek 20:20, but I believe it cannot be substituted by the word "symbol" in that verse.

[JehovahsWitness]

I do check Rev 1:1 and find there's no word "symbol" in the original Greek.

Source : G.K. Beale, New International Greek Testament Commentary

[Capbook]

I do check Rev 1:1 and find there's no word "symbol" in the original Greek.

Source : G.K. Beale published his monumental commentary on Revelation in the New International Greek Testament Commentary

Do the word "signified" defined by G.K. Beale?

[onewithhim]

I just believe hell (gehenna) is not symbolic.

Could that be because you don't have a clear understanding if what the word "symbolic" actually means ?

How do you define symbolic then.

Online definition of symbolic;
1. serving as a symbol.
"a repeating design symbolic of eternity"
2. involving the use of symbols or symbolism.
"the symbolic meaning of motifs and designs"

Online definition of symbol;
1. a mark or character used as a conventional representation of an object, function, or process,

Could it be you dont understand how the above can apply to a scripture in the bible?

Because I don't see any "symbol or symbolic" in the verse. Even lexicon and commentaries doesn't mentions "symbol or symbolic"

So you don't know what "symbol" or "symbolic" mean. Do you understand the symbolism that JehovahsWitness posted for you regarding the sheep? It is an animal, yet it is a symbol of a person who hears Jesus' voice (through the scriptures) and follows him.

At least one translation uses the word "symbols," referring to the book of Revelation. "This is the revelation which God gave to Jesus Christ to show his slaves what must soon occur. He sent it by means of symbols through his angel, to his slave John." (Revelation 1:1, 21st Century New Testament)

Greek semaino does not define "symbol" in Lexicons.

σημαίνω sēmainō
Thayer Definition:
1) to give a sign, to signify, indicate
2) to make known

How does your post render what I said incorrect? Can you explain why you defined "symbol" after my post which only said that there is the word in Revelation1:1 after you lamented that you don't see "symbol" anywhere in the Bible? Could you read and comment on the previous two posts?

I do check Rev 1:1 and find there's no word "symbol" in the original Greek.
I do replied on your post#3078 with my post 3081.

You aren't understanding what I posted. That's why I asked you to re-read the previous posts. Also, in the Interlinear Bible that I have which has the Greek words, in Revelation 1:1 there is the word "signified" which means the same thing as presented in signs, or, symbols." Your Thayer definition is right on.

[Revelations won]

Dear Onewithhim,

One can express their private interpretations infinitely, But is all this talk about living forever on "this earth" of any value? Is this really your end goal?

Personally I for one do not look forward to living forever on "this earth" forever.

Should not all seek a loftier goal?

Revelation 21:1
And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.
6 And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.
7 He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.

So you should consider the clear fact that "this earth" and the heaven will both pass away according to Revelation 21.

I for one would look forward to living in the realm of a new heaven and a new earth.

This new heaven and new earth will also be a place wherein as stated that God will be also present and living with his faithful followers!

Since you have also stated that you also reject all latter day revelation, then I find it mighty strange that according to your private doctrine you would therefore have your God living with you and he neither could or would reveal or communicate with you forever????

[onewithhim]

Dear Onewithhim,

One can express their private interpretations infinitely, But is all this talk about living forever on "this earth" of any value? Is this really your end goal?

Personally I for one do not look forward to living forever on "this earth" forever.

Should not all seek a loftier goal?

Revelation 21:1
And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.
6 And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.
7 He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.

So you should consider the clear fact that "this earth" and the heaven will both pass away according to Revelation 21.

I for one would look forward to living in the realm of a new heaven and a new earth.

This new heaven and new earth will also be a place wherein as stated that God will be also present and living with his faithful followers!

Since you have also stated that you also reject all latter day revelation, then I find it mighty strange that according to your private doctrine you would therefore have your God living with you and he neither could or would reveal or communicate with you forever????

God will not live with us literally, as I have explained. He will "live with" us the same as he did in times past with the nation of Israel. He said he would live with them, but did he literally come down out of heaven? No, and does Jesus literally live with us? After all he said that he would be with us until the end of the age. No, neither one is or will literally live with us. (See Exodus 29:45; Matthew 28:20.)

When it says that the world will be burned up and destroyed, it does not mean the literal earth. It is the "ungodly people" that are destroyed.

"The world of [Noah's] time suffered destruction when it was deluged with water. But by the same word the heavens and the earth that are now are stored up for fire and are being reserved to the day of judgment, and of destruction of the ungodly men." (2Peteer 3:6,7)

Did the literal earth become destroyed in Noah's day? (Matthew 24:37) No, and it will not be destroyed in the future. (Ecclesiastes 1:4) The "new heavens" means the form of government will change from men's government to the Kingdom with Christ as King (Isaiah 9:6,7). The "new earth" means a new society of people, righteous people, with no more evil individuals around to make life difficult. (What is "the earth" in this scripture? "Now all the earth continued to be of one language and of one set of words." (Genesis 11:1) It isn't the literal earth, is it? No, it's the people on the earth. Same with the "earth" being destroyed as mentioned by Peter. It is not the literal earth, but the people on it that are evil.