Questions about Jesus and JW’s

[MissKate13]

1. Jehovah’s Witnesses say Jesus was “a god.” This is how the NWT reads (John 1:1).

Do JW’s believe Jesus was a true or false god?

2. JW’s say Jesus is a created being.

When was Jesus (capital or lower case g) created?

I look forward to your responses to one or both questions.

MissKate13

[Eloi]

What would a false god be to you?

Thanks for your question!
In my humble opinion, a false god would be the exact opposite of our true God.

Our God by nature is love, righteousness, holiness, truth, grace and mercy.

A false god by nature would be the exact opposite: hate, unrighteousness, falsehood, no grace, and merciless.

Interesting way of considering what a false god is.

According to your concept ... would the goddess of mercy of Buddhism be a "true god"?

[JehovahsWitness]

I have a copy of the Kingdom Interlinear, which I use regularly along with lexicons when I’m want to know how the original language reads and what it means.
... What is your opinion of the NWT adding “other” to the word of God?

If you have and use Interlinears and lexicons (which you should if you are a serious student of the bible), you know all translators add words to the target language to render their translations understandable and accurate.

For example, the greek word for "thing" is not in the text at Colossians 1:16 at all, yet most translators have added that word ("things") at least two times.

I know you are not going to contest the English translation you use never adds words that are not in the original text, that would simply be untrue. I see nothing untoward with the adding of the word "other" to Col 1:16 but if you do, maybe you can see yourself to writing in a sentence or two as to why you see it as problematic.





JW


FURTHER READING :

http://defendingthenwt.blogspot.com/200 ... artin.html
https://fosterheologicalreflections.blo ... hings.html

[JehovahsWitness]

How is firstborn defined in standard academic Greek lexicons?

Prototokos

• the firstborn of man or beast; of Christ, the first born of all creation - Thayer's Greek Lexicon

• From protos and the alternate of tikto; first-born (usually as noun, literally or figuratively) -- firstbegotten(-born). - Strong's Exhaustive Concordance

QUESTION: What did Paul mean when he refered to Jesus as the "firstborn of all creation" (Col 1:15)?

Some have suggested that since the scriptures have examples of the term "firstborn" (prototokos ) denoting preeminence that Paul meant Christ was preeminent over creation without being part of said creation. But note the folowing ...

The term "firstborn" (prototokos) occurs 128 times in the Septuagint and 8 times in the NT and at no time is it used to denote someone "supreme" or "preeminent" of a group he himself does NOT belong to. For example, Genesis 49:3, "Ruben, thou art my first-born [prototokos] ... and the first [arkhe - 'beginning'] of my children." - Septuagint Version. So Reuben was preminent but of the group of the children of Israel to which he (Reuben) also belonged.

CONCLUSION Even if Paul *is* saying Jesus is "preeminent" he is still saying he (Jesus) is preeminent in a group he (Jesus) belonged to - in short that Jesus is the GREATEST of all the CREATED beings.




JW

FURTHER READING (Arche)
https://fosterheologicalreflections.blo ... arche.html

To learn more please go to to other posts related to ...

GOD, JESUS and ...THE "TRINITY TEXTS" DEBUNKED

[JehovahsWitness]

WHY IS DAVID CALLED THE FIRSTBORN (prototokos)?

And I will make him the firstborn, the highest of the kings of the earth -- Psalm 89:28,

This scripture is clearly not giving a new lexical meaning to prototokos but simply showing that God has the right to put David in the position a firstborn (compare 1 Chronicles 26:1-2 and 2 Chronicles 21:3). Scripturally the firstborn in a family was almost invariably given a position of preeminence but that position was not automatic. Take for example the case of Reuben, Jacob's literal first-born; he lost *pre-eminence* but he continued to be known as the "first-born" (prototokos in the Septuagint) of the family - see Gen. 49:3, 4; 1 Chronicles 5:1-3 RSV. So Psalms is not giving a new or alternative meaning to the world "firsborn" only showing the rights and privileges ATTACHED to that position can on occassion be given (or taken away).

To illustrate: Take the meaning of the word "whore" (or prostitute). The meaning of the word is essentially someone that exchanges sexual favors for money. If a politician, forced to accept illegal money inexchange for political power said that his benefactor is "making a whore out of him" does this mean that the word "whore" can mean prostitute OR politician? Can one legitimately have a definition for whore "one that runs for any kind of political office"? Obviously not, the meaning of the word remains unchanged but the actions have resulted in the subject being submitted to similar feelings of degredation.

That God declared David "firsborn" does not mean the word has two different meanings, only that God's actions have resulted in David having the same rights and privileges of someone who is the born first, even though he was in fact the youngest.


FURTHER READING
http://examiningthetrinity.blogspot.fr/ ... l-115.html
http://web.archive.org/web/200312032221 ... otokos.htm

[MissKate13]

Do JW’s believe Jesus was a true or false god?

A true god.

RELATED POSTS

How many Only True Gods exist?
viewtopic.php?p=1090732#p1090732

How many only true Christs have there been ? (tigger)
viewtopic.php?p=866476#p866476

FURTHER RESEARCH [Only True God] http://examiningthetrinity.blogspot.com ... e-god.html

I’m happy to know you believe Jesus is/was a true god. And for the record, whether a lower case or capital G is before the word god makes no difference to me. Capital letters were not used in the original language of the Greek extant manuscripts.

Since you believe Jesus is a true god, does this mean you believe there are two gods?

There is only one True Almighty God. While Jesus is a mighty spirit being, a god even, he is second to Jehovah the Almighty. Jesus is not the True Almighty God or even equal to his Father. Jesus is never referenced to as the True God or a True God.

Satan is a god and his demons are gods in that they are mighty and powerful. People even worship them. People even worship angels as gods and Jesus as god but this is wrong according to Deuteronomy 6:10, Matthew 4:10 and Revelation 22:9. None of these can hold a candle to who Jehovah is according to Psalms 83:18.

Is it fair to say Satan is a false god and Jesus a true god?

[Eloi]

What would a false god be to you?

Thanks for your question!
In my humble opinion, a false god would be the exact opposite of our true God.

Our God by nature is love, righteousness, holiness, truth, grace and mercy.

A false god by nature would be the exact opposite: hate, unrighteousness, falsehood, no grace, and merciless.

Interesting way of considering what a false god is.

According to your concept ... would the goddess of mercy of Buddhism be a "true god"?

? ? ?

Some people don´t understand very well what Jesus meant when he said to his Father that HE is the only true God.

John 17:3 This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ.

Actually, some people want to denny what Jesus said there ... They don't like what he taught here, because they don't agree with him on this. On what else they don't?

[2timothy316]

Do JW’s believe Jesus was a true or false god?

A true god.

RELATED POSTS

How many Only True Gods exist?
viewtopic.php?p=1090732#p1090732

How many only true Christs have there been ? (tigger)
viewtopic.php?p=866476#p866476

FURTHER RESEARCH [Only True God] http://examiningthetrinity.blogspot.com ... e-god.html

I’m happy to know you believe Jesus is/was a true god. And for the record, whether a lower case or capital G is before the word god makes no difference to me. Capital letters were not used in the original language of the Greek extant manuscripts.

Since you believe Jesus is a true god, does this mean you believe there are two gods?

There is only one True Almighty God. While Jesus is a mighty spirit being, a god even, he is second to Jehovah the Almighty. Jesus is not the True Almighty God or even equal to his Father. Jesus is never referenced to as the True God or a True God.

Satan is a god and his demons are gods in that they are mighty and powerful. People even worship them. People even worship angels as gods and Jesus as god but this is wrong according to Deuteronomy 6:10, Matthew 4:10 and Revelation 22:9. None of these can hold a candle to who Jehovah is according to Psalms 83:18.

Is it fair to say Satan is a false god and Jesus a true god?

No. If one wants to worship or serve them, they are both false gods. Like those that worshiped Baal, Zeus, and all others that are not Jehovah. In the context of the scriptures, when it comes to worship there is only One True God to be worshiped. Deuteronomy 6:10, Matthew 4:10

“a God exacting exclusive devotion.” Ex 20:5
“Jehovah, whose name is Jealous, he is a jealous God.” Ex 34:14

One can say 'this is a god' and that can be true because of their mighty power and that's one thing, but put the word false in front of it that makes in connection to worship.

Satan is a powerful god. This is true.
Jesus is a powerful god. This is true.

Satan should be worshiped. This is false.
Jesus should be worshiped. This is false.

[JehovahsWitness]

Since you believe Jesus is a true god, does this mean you believe there are two gods?

There are more than two gods, there are MANY gods.

1 CORINTHIANS 8:5 - Aramaic Bible in Plain English

For even though there are what are called gods, whether in the Heavens or in The Earth, as there are many gods and many lords

[Eloi]

If the Bible says that Jehovah is "God of gods," wouldn't there have to be other "gods" in some other sense, for Jehovah to be God over all of them?

Deut. 10:17 For Jehovah your God is the God of gods and the Lord of lords, the God great, mighty, and awe-inspiring, who treats none with partiality and does not accept a bribe.

Psal. 136:2 Give thanks to the God of gods,
For his loyal love endures forever.
 3 Give thanks to the Lord of lords,
For his loyal love endures forever.

Dan. 2:46 Then King Nebuchadnezzar fell down with his face to the ground before Daniel and paid homage to him. And he gave the order to offer a present and incense to him. 47 The king said to Daniel: “Truly your God is a God of gods and a Lord of kings and a Revealer of secrets, because you were able to reveal this secret.”

Or is Jehovah the God of false gods?

[kjw47]

If the Bible says that Jehovah is "God of gods," wouldn't there have to be other "gods" in some other sense, for Jehovah to be God over all of them?

Deut. 10:17 For Jehovah your God is the God of gods and the Lord of lords, the God great, mighty, and awe-inspiring, who treats none with partiality and does not accept a bribe.

Psal. 136:2 Give thanks to the God of gods,
For his loyal love endures forever.
 3 Give thanks to the Lord of lords,
For his loyal love endures forever.

Dan. 2:46 Then King Nebuchadnezzar fell down with his face to the ground before Daniel and paid homage to him. And he gave the order to offer a present and incense to him. 47 The king said to Daniel: “Truly your God is a God of gods and a Lord of kings and a Revealer of secrets, because you were able to reveal this secret.”

Or is Jehovah the God of false gods?

The angels were called godlike. Psalm 8:5--And yes mislead mortals worship false gods. Which is actually satan posing as those gods. Small g god is not calling those the true God in any way shape or form.