The Qu'ran

[McCulloch]

quraan is written by allah but other books written by person so you have to read it to make sure

Well i am sure the quran is much unique from among all the other books. [...] the quran has never been changed. The quran was and is as god says himself in the quran that the quran is copyrighted. So there are millions of copys in the world in many translation--but all the same thing. Ones in english, urdu, arabic, chinese, brail... and so on. So which one shall you read? The one that says Quran or koran or coran on the cover. And as the biggining chapter introduces the author (god). You can order many free ones from islam tomorow, or even better go to your local mosque.[...]

So I went to the quran. I read it and I felt closer to god in my whole life. I actually cryed. And now i am closer to god then ever.

I have been invited to read the Qu'ran. It has been claimed that it has the answers to the questions, How can I know if God exists? and How can I know what God wants of me? It has been implied that the divine truth of the Quran is self-evident.

For Debate: If you have read the Qu'ran or part of it, is its divine origin self-evident? Does it make a convincing argument for the existence of God?

[Goat]

This is not a rule of debate, we dont belief in Jewish faiths, so it will conclude the end of discussion right?

This is showing more that your positive side is towards 1 particular religion, and its not getting in an open hearted and healthy debate anymore.

For authentication of Jewish scripture, I can make post, and will invite you to come there, but here we have to be neutral and see all the authentic references and accept them with open heart, whicch is the simple and main rule of debate, if you accept, we will proceed further.

Well, since you were quoting the Jewish scriptures, you should look at what the Jews believe about their own scriptures. When someone makes a claim that the concept is different in one religion than another, you look at how the scholars who specialize in the religions use it, and if they match, they are the same, and if they disagree, they are different.

My point stands. For the use of the Jewish scriptures, to describe Samson, Solomon and David as 'prophets' is incorrect.

Still, you are only emphasizing on Jewish scriptures,
Ok, Do you agree that Solomon & David are refered as prophet in Christianity and Islam? after this, we wil move forward for Judaism

Ok.. I would like you to show a CHRISTIAN source that says that refer to Solomon, David and/or Samson were 'prophets'. They are not considered prophets in the Christian religion either. Can you show any place in the Jewish scripture or the
New Testament that refers to Solomon, David or Samson as being a prophet?

Sure. will mention here few links, which you can check and decide. Source is from Jewish and christian scholars.

http://www.tikkunministries.org/newslet ... -jan07.asp

http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/ent ... in_Judaism
(Can refer to the part of Solomon in world religion's)

Now, both David, Solomon were Kings, (solomon being son of David), and they were gifted by words from God, and wisdom, and as per the Jewish and christian scripture, God promised and gave them glad tidings etc etc.
To make it easy, in Abrahamic religions, God's promise, glad tidings etc etc, is not for any person, but his prophets and his chosen ones, which are either messenger or prophets.
Further we know from History, that both christian and jewish scriptures are distorted and changed due to several calamities , and what we have now, is just writen books of men throuth traditions and words of mouth.
Also, to be noted that, Jews gave the most hard time to their prophets, or men chosen by God, and always make fun of them, torture them, so in conclusion to this, we can't take their scripture as truly authentic. Because on their history of mocking and making fun of their prophets.

There seems to be a difference in how Islam defines 'prophet' verses Christianity and Judaism. If you look at the Old Testament, often it was the prophets that chidded the Kings for things they did wrong. If you notice in both the Jewish and Christian sources the term 'Prophet' was not used for those people

[TrueReligion]

This is not a rule of debate, we dont belief in Jewish faiths, so it will conclude the end of discussion right?

This is showing more that your positive side is towards 1 particular religion, and its not getting in an open hearted and healthy debate anymore.

For authentication of Jewish scripture, I can make post, and will invite you to come there, but here we have to be neutral and see all the authentic references and accept them with open heart, whicch is the simple and main rule of debate, if you accept, we will proceed further.

Well, since you were quoting the Jewish scriptures, you should look at what the Jews believe about their own scriptures. When someone makes a claim that the concept is different in one religion than another, you look at how the scholars who specialize in the religions use it, and if they match, they are the same, and if they disagree, they are different.

My point stands. For the use of the Jewish scriptures, to describe Samson, Solomon and David as 'prophets' is incorrect.

Still, you are only emphasizing on Jewish scriptures,
Ok, Do you agree that Solomon & David are refered as prophet in Christianity and Islam? after this, we wil move forward for Judaism

Ok.. I would like you to show a CHRISTIAN source that says that refer to Solomon, David and/or Samson were 'prophets'. They are not considered prophets in the Christian religion either. Can you show any place in the Jewish scripture or the
New Testament that refers to Solomon, David or Samson as being a prophet?

Sure. will mention here few links, which you can check and decide. Source is from Jewish and christian scholars.

http://www.tikkunministries.org/newslet ... -jan07.asp

http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/ent ... in_Judaism
(Can refer to the part of Solomon in world religion's)

Now, both David, Solomon were Kings, (solomon being son of David), and they were gifted by words from God, and wisdom, and as per the Jewish and christian scripture, God promised and gave them glad tidings etc etc.
To make it easy, in Abrahamic religions, God's promise, glad tidings etc etc, is not for any person, but his prophets and his chosen ones, which are either messenger or prophets.
Further we know from History, that both christian and jewish scriptures are distorted and changed due to several calamities , and what we have now, is just writen books of men throuth traditions and words of mouth.
Also, to be noted that, Jews gave the most hard time to their prophets, or men chosen by God, and always make fun of them, torture them, so in conclusion to this, we can't take their scripture as truly authentic. Because on their history of mocking and making fun of their prophets.

There seems to be a difference in how Islam defines 'prophet' verses Christianity and Judaism. If you look at the Old Testament, often it was the prophets that chidded the Kings for things they did wrong. If you notice in both the Jewish and Christian sources the term 'Prophet' was not used for those people

Goat, I mentioned already what term prophet means, Even Jesus is not mentioned as prophet there, so you mean Jesus was not a prophet as well?
Christian andd Jewish scripture is just mere;;y words of mouth and traditional stories. its proven also, that it is tempered, what more explannation you like?

It will be only now remaining to believe in Quran, which gives exactly the right picture of those noble persons, and prophets.
Further the link which I gave, New World Encyclopedia also mentionedd Solomon as prophet, wou can read it there as well.

[Goat]

This is not a rule of debate, we dont belief in Jewish faiths, so it will conclude the end of discussion right?

This is showing more that your positive side is towards 1 particular religion, and its not getting in an open hearted and healthy debate anymore.

For authentication of Jewish scripture, I can make post, and will invite you to come there, but here we have to be neutral and see all the authentic references and accept them with open heart, whicch is the simple and main rule of debate, if you accept, we will proceed further.

Well, since you were quoting the Jewish scriptures, you should look at what the Jews believe about their own scriptures. When someone makes a claim that the concept is different in one religion than another, you look at how the scholars who specialize in the religions use it, and if they match, they are the same, and if they disagree, they are different.

My point stands. For the use of the Jewish scriptures, to describe Samson, Solomon and David as 'prophets' is incorrect.

Still, you are only emphasizing on Jewish scriptures,
Ok, Do you agree that Solomon & David are refered as prophet in Christianity and Islam? after this, we wil move forward for Judaism

Ok.. I would like you to show a CHRISTIAN source that says that refer to Solomon, David and/or Samson were 'prophets'. They are not considered prophets in the Christian religion either. Can you show any place in the Jewish scripture or the
New Testament that refers to Solomon, David or Samson as being a prophet?

Sure. will mention here few links, which you can check and decide. Source is from Jewish and christian scholars.

http://www.tikkunministries.org/newslet ... -jan07.asp

http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/ent ... in_Judaism
(Can refer to the part of Solomon in world religion's)

Now, both David, Solomon were Kings, (solomon being son of David), and they were gifted by words from God, and wisdom, and as per the Jewish and christian scripture, God promised and gave them glad tidings etc etc.
To make it easy, in Abrahamic religions, God's promise, glad tidings etc etc, is not for any person, but his prophets and his chosen ones, which are either messenger or prophets.
Further we know from History, that both christian and jewish scriptures are distorted and changed due to several calamities , and what we have now, is just writen books of men throuth traditions and words of mouth.
Also, to be noted that, Jews gave the most hard time to their prophets, or men chosen by God, and always make fun of them, torture them, so in conclusion to this, we can't take their scripture as truly authentic. Because on their history of mocking and making fun of their prophets.

There seems to be a difference in how Islam defines 'prophet' verses Christianity and Judaism. If you look at the Old Testament, often it was the prophets that chidded the Kings for things they did wrong. If you notice in both the Jewish and Christian sources the term 'Prophet' was not used for those people

Goat, I mentioned already what term prophet means, Even Jesus is not mentioned as prophet there, so you mean Jesus was not a prophet as well?
Christian andd Jewish scripture is just mere;;y words of mouth and traditional stories. its proven also, that it is tempered, what more explannation you like?

It will be only now remaining to believe in Quran, which gives exactly the right picture of those noble persons, and prophets.
Further the link which I gave, New World Encyclopedia also mentionedd Solomon as prophet, wou can read it there as well.

Jesus is not considered anything at all in the Jewish religion. In the mainstream Christian religion, Jesus is not considered a prophet but God.. I will accept for the Quran, Jesus would be a prophet.

But Jesus is irrelevant for the Jewish religion. You will not find one bit of scripture on Jesus in Judaism.

[TrueReligion]

This is not a rule of debate, we dont belief in Jewish faiths, so it will conclude the end of discussion right?

This is showing more that your positive side is towards 1 particular religion, and its not getting in an open hearted and healthy debate anymore.

For authentication of Jewish scripture, I can make post, and will invite you to come there, but here we have to be neutral and see all the authentic references and accept them with open heart, whicch is the simple and main rule of debate, if you accept, we will proceed further.

Well, since you were quoting the Jewish scriptures, you should look at what the Jews believe about their own scriptures. When someone makes a claim that the concept is different in one religion than another, you look at how the scholars who specialize in the religions use it, and if they match, they are the same, and if they disagree, they are different.

My point stands. For the use of the Jewish scriptures, to describe Samson, Solomon and David as 'prophets' is incorrect.

Still, you are only emphasizing on Jewish scriptures,
Ok, Do you agree that Solomon & David are refered as prophet in Christianity and Islam? after this, we wil move forward for Judaism

Ok.. I would like you to show a CHRISTIAN source that says that refer to Solomon, David and/or Samson were 'prophets'. They are not considered prophets in the Christian religion either. Can you show any place in the Jewish scripture or the
New Testament that refers to Solomon, David or Samson as being a prophet?

Sure. will mention here few links, which you can check and decide. Source is from Jewish and christian scholars.

http://www.tikkunministries.org/newslet ... -jan07.asp

http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/ent ... in_Judaism
(Can refer to the part of Solomon in world religion's)

Now, both David, Solomon were Kings, (solomon being son of David), and they were gifted by words from God, and wisdom, and as per the Jewish and christian scripture, God promised and gave them glad tidings etc etc.
To make it easy, in Abrahamic religions, God's promise, glad tidings etc etc, is not for any person, but his prophets and his chosen ones, which are either messenger or prophets.
Further we know from History, that both christian and jewish scriptures are distorted and changed due to several calamities , and what we have now, is just writen books of men throuth traditions and words of mouth.
Also, to be noted that, Jews gave the most hard time to their prophets, or men chosen by God, and always make fun of them, torture them, so in conclusion to this, we can't take their scripture as truly authentic. Because on their history of mocking and making fun of their prophets.

There seems to be a difference in how Islam defines 'prophet' verses Christianity and Judaism. If you look at the Old Testament, often it was the prophets that chidded the Kings for things they did wrong. If you notice in both the Jewish and Christian sources the term 'Prophet' was not used for those people

Goat, I mentioned already what term prophet means, Even Jesus is not mentioned as prophet there, so you mean Jesus was not a prophet as well?
Christian andd Jewish scripture is just mere;;y words of mouth and traditional stories. its proven also, that it is tempered, what more explannation you like?

It will be only now remaining to believe in Quran, which gives exactly the right picture of those noble persons, and prophets.
Further the link which I gave, New World Encyclopedia also mentionedd Solomon as prophet, wou can read it there as well.

Jesus is not considered anything at all in the Jewish religion. In the mainstream Christian religion, Jesus is not considered a prophet but God.. I will accept for the Quran, Jesus would be a prophet.

But Jesus is irrelevant for the Jewish religion. You will not find one bit of scripture on Jesus in Judaism.

Why, the Jews were not waiting for messiah?who was messiah if Jesus was not the 1? John the Baptist? Elias?

Who was refered as a prophet in Jews scripture? Noah came before Jews, he was not a prophet? Abraham was not PROPHET? cause he came before Jews, what about Isaac, Ishmael?

Goat, make your mind open to understannd 1 basic thing. Jews scripture is not from God anymore, because Moses didnt wrote single word. the so calledd 10 comandments were lost already. If you want, I can show full history, and by the way its already pproven from history as well
So your any of claim of their scripture is not valid and not authentic by anny means.

[Goat]

Why, the Jews were not waiting for messiah?who was messiah if Jesus was not the 1? John the Baptist? Elias?

Who was refered as a prophet in Jews scripture? Noah came before Jews, he was not a prophet? Abraham was not PROPHET? cause he came before Jews, what about Isaac, Ishmael?

Goat, make your mind open to understannd 1 basic thing. Jews scripture is not from God anymore, because Moses didnt wrote single word. the so calledd 10 comandments were lost already. If you want, I can show full history, and by the way its already pproven from history as well
So your any of claim of their scripture is not valid and not authentic by anny means.

The simple fact is that in the Jewish religion, those people who are waiting for the Messiah all agree that the Messiah has not arrived yet, because the tasks that the messiah is supposed to accomplish has not been done.

I am sorry, but Muslims or Christians do not have the right to tell Jews what the Jews believe, just like the Muslims and the Jews do not have the right to tell the Christians what they believe, or the Christains and the Jews don't have the right to tell the Muslims what they do believe.

There is nothing in the Jewish scripture about Jesus. If anything is thought about him is that he was a failed Messiah, nothing else. THere have been a lot of failed messiahs.

[TrueReligion]

Why, the Jews were not waiting for messiah?who was messiah if Jesus was not the 1? John the Baptist? Elias?

Who was refered as a prophet in Jews scripture? Noah came before Jews, he was not a prophet? Abraham was not PROPHET? cause he came before Jews, what about Isaac, Ishmael?

Goat, make your mind open to understannd 1 basic thing. Jews scripture is not from God anymore, because Moses didnt wrote single word. the so calledd 10 comandments were lost already. If you want, I can show full history, and by the way its already pproven from history as well
So your any of claim of their scripture is not valid and not authentic by anny means.

The simple fact is that in the Jewish religion, those people who are waiting for the Messiah all agree that the Messiah has not arrived yet, because the tasks that the messiah is supposed to accomplish has not been done.

I am sorry, but Muslims or Christians do not have the right to tell Jews what the Jews believe, just like the Muslims and the Jews do not have the right to tell the Christians what they believe, or the Christains and the Jews don't have the right to tell the Muslims what they do believe.

There is nothing in the Jewish scripture about Jesus. If anything is thought about him is that he was a failed Messiah, nothing else. THere have been a lot of failed messiahs.

We are not talking what Jews believe, because Jews gave hard time to Moses as well, and as per them he was prophet also:)

We are talking in geeneral, was Jesus a prophet or no? and which any other prophet is mentioned in bible?

[Goat]

Why, the Jews were not waiting for messiah?who was messiah if Jesus was not the 1? John the Baptist? Elias?

Who was refered as a prophet in Jews scripture? Noah came before Jews, he was not a prophet? Abraham was not PROPHET? cause he came before Jews, what about Isaac, Ishmael?

Goat, make your mind open to understannd 1 basic thing. Jews scripture is not from God anymore, because Moses didnt wrote single word. the so calledd 10 comandments were lost already. If you want, I can show full history, and by the way its already pproven from history as well
So your any of claim of their scripture is not valid and not authentic by anny means.

The simple fact is that in the Jewish religion, those people who are waiting for the Messiah all agree that the Messiah has not arrived yet, because the tasks that the messiah is supposed to accomplish has not been done.

I am sorry, but Muslims or Christians do not have the right to tell Jews what the Jews believe, just like the Muslims and the Jews do not have the right to tell the Christians what they believe, or the Christains and the Jews don't have the right to tell the Muslims what they do believe.

There is nothing in the Jewish scripture about Jesus. If anything is thought about him is that he was a failed Messiah, nothing else. THere have been a lot of failed messiahs.

We are not talking what Jews believe, because Jews gave hard time to Moses as well, and as per them he was prophet also:)

We are talking in geeneral, was Jesus a prophet or no? and which any other prophet is mentioned in bible?

Since, Jesus is not mentioned in the Jewish Bible, and the Jewish religion does not accept him, then he is not a prophet.

Jesus is totally irrelevant to Judaism.

[TrueReligion]

Why, the Jews were not waiting for messiah?who was messiah if Jesus was not the 1? John the Baptist? Elias?

Who was refered as a prophet in Jews scripture? Noah came before Jews, he was not a prophet? Abraham was not PROPHET? cause he came before Jews, what about Isaac, Ishmael?

Goat, make your mind open to understannd 1 basic thing. Jews scripture is not from God anymore, because Moses didnt wrote single word. the so calledd 10 comandments were lost already. If you want, I can show full history, and by the way its already pproven from history as well
So your any of claim of their scripture is not valid and not authentic by anny means.

The simple fact is that in the Jewish religion, those people who are waiting for the Messiah all agree that the Messiah has not arrived yet, because the tasks that the messiah is supposed to accomplish has not been done.

I am sorry, but Muslims or Christians do not have the right to tell Jews what the Jews believe, just like the Muslims and the Jews do not have the right to tell the Christians what they believe, or the Christains and the Jews don't have the right to tell the Muslims what they do believe.

There is nothing in the Jewish scripture about Jesus. If anything is thought about him is that he was a failed Messiah, nothing else. THere have been a lot of failed messiahs.

We are not talking what Jews believe, because Jews gave hard time to Moses as well, and as per them he was prophet also:)

We are talking in geeneral, was Jesus a prophet or no? and which any other prophet is mentioned in bible?

Since, Jesus is not mentioned in the Jewish Bible, and the Jewish religion does not accept him, then he is not a prophet.

Jesus is totally irrelevant to Judaism.

What Jews think, is irreleventto us, because Jews dont have authority to choose or call any1 prophet, its God who choses and make some1 prophet right?
What confirmation you have for the scripture of Jews that its authentic,and what source they have for their scripture?
For instance, Quran was revealed to Muhammad (PBUH), and he wrote in his life time.so now muslims,and others can definitly claim that its authentic froM Muhamad,and nothing has been changed since then.
What about Jews?did Moses wrote anything in his life?

[Goat]

What Jews think, is irreleventto us, because Jews dont have authority to choose or call any1 prophet, its God who choses and make some1 prophet right?
What confirmation you have for the scripture of Jews that its authentic,and what source they have for their scripture?
For instance, Quran was revealed to Muhammad (PBUH), and he wrote in his life time.so now muslims,and others can definitly claim that its authentic froM Muhamad,and nothing has been changed since then.
What about Jews?did Moses wrote anything in his life?

Mohammed claimed the Quran was revealed to him. .. to be sure. I don't believe his claim is accurate, just like i don't believe the Book of the Mormon was revealed to Joesph Smith.

There is a difference between a claim, and reality.

As for what God says.. well.. there are people who make claims in God's name, but that is a lot different from God saying anything. As for any scripture being 'authentic'. .. well... the Jewish faith deceided it was valid for the Jews.. and they don't accept Mohammad as a prophet of God to them.

Tradition has it that Moses wrote most of the Torah.

[TrueReligion]

What Jews think, is irreleventto us, because Jews dont have authority to choose or call any1 prophet, its God who choses and make some1 prophet right?
What confirmation you have for the scripture of Jews that its authentic,and what source they have for their scripture?
For instance, Quran was revealed to Muhammad (PBUH), and he wrote in his life time.so now muslims,and others can definitly claim that its authentic froM Muhamad,and nothing has been changed since then.
What about Jews?did Moses wrote anything in his life?

Mohammed claimed the Quran was revealed to him. .. to be sure. I don't believe his claim is accurate, just like i don't believe the Book of the Mormon was revealed to Joesph Smith.

Whatyou believe, its not related and does;nt carry any weight, you know the rules buddy, we haveto look on authentic sources.

There is a difference between a claim, and reality.

As for what God says.. well.. there are people who make claims in God's name, but that is a lot different from God saying anything. As for any scripture being 'authentic'. .. well... the Jewish faith deceided it was valid for the Jews.. and they don't accept Mohammad as a prophet of God to them.

Again, you are not telling me wats the source of Jews scripture? Jews were there since begining of world? or they came long after Moses?
Tradition has it that Moses wrote most of the Torah.

Are you sure Moses wrote Torah?What tradition say,does;nt matter, wat authenticity say,dat matters my friend, and all authentic sources deny this that Moses wrote anything, every1 knows this well. you want proofs for this?