islam is the only truth

[umair]

islam is the only and complete truth, and i would love to entertain any of your questions regarding islam.

[Catharsis]

>>>now answering your last point i would like to say , that if you will consider god in the form of a human,only then will you search for the faculties of hearing,speech thinking , and a spirit in him , instead you must know that god is a power who does what he wills, knows everything, and is free from any wants.<<<

You obviously missed the point of my question.

Let me rephrase:

Does Koran mention that Christ is the Spirit of God and his Word given by God to Mary?

Do you worship God along with his Spirit and Word?

[umair]

>>>now answering your last point i would like to say , that if you will consider god in the form of a human,only then will you search for the faculties of hearing,speech thinking , and a spirit in him , instead you must know that god is a power who does what he wills, knows everything, and is free from any wants.<<<

You obviously missed the point of my question.

Let me rephrase:

Does Koran mention that Christ is the Spirit of God and his Word given by God to Mary?

Do you worship God along with his Spirit and Word?

hello catharisis,

by your question it appears to me that , you do not read or observe the other points but are just intended to prove to me the one point which is the basis of your faith.

well my answer is clear NO!
the quran does not mention that christ is the spirit of god,niether his word.

but it does mention that christ is a spirit created by god,similar to the way every living soul is, and also mentions that christ spoke the messege of god similar to the way all of his messengers did.

remember one thing , you will have to think logically, because the messege is crystal clear!

[Catharsis]

Umair, Happy New Year!

>>>well my answer is clear NO!
the quran does not mention that christ is the spirit of god,niether his word.

but it does mention that christ is a spirit created by god,similar to the way every living soul is, and also mentions that christ spoke the messege of god similar to the way all of his messengers did.<<<

Ha ha, what makes you think I will not address the rest of your post? The problem is that you keep avoiding answering the actual questions that I ask, and volunteer information that I do not ask for -- but I will answer them.

Thanks for answering the question. Now we've established that Islam holds that Christ is Created -- Created 'word', but not eternal. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Please answer the question: (forget Christ now) Do you worship God along with his Spirit and Word?


>>> in the case of muhammed(saw) , the assertion was simply the quran itself , which is a book of such high knowledge and highest level of arabic, contrary to the fact that muhammed(saw) never went to school , or attended any classes.
and the non muslim arabs at that time used to be astonished by the way the prophet(saw) used to recite them so easily.<<<

You say simply the quran itself! How convenient!

How is this different from Hubbard's Dianetics, H. P. Blavatsky's Theosophical writings, or any other self-proclaimed "prophets"?

As we've agreed, If God wants the salvation of the whole world anyone who pretends to be a messenger of God needs a sign and power from God to confirm his message. The fact that Muhammed never went to school, and could recite the quran easily is not very impressive.

The signs and powers are the following: to make miracles, to speak various languages and avoid worldly things -- while you have the opposite traits: the menace with sword, tribute, and conviction, traits which have been found in Muhammed.


>>>now in christianity what you can believe and what you cannot is a matter of debate,because none of the verses of the bible have been written in the life of jesus, and what clearly appears is that because of the love for him and because of some misunderstanding of his messege his desciples started thinking of him as god,and that is what we find in the bible.
for instance their are some points in the bible that we as muslims can accept.<<<

>>>and the fact is that no where in the bible will you find jesus calling himself as the god, instead you will at all places find his desciples calling him with that name.<<<

Yes, it was a matter of debate (Ecumenical Synods), unlike in Islam. Debate establishes correct or orthodox belief. You should also know that the Bible was a product of the Orthodox Church -- the Church came first, then the Bible (decades and centuries after), and the Church always believed that Jesus is the Son of God. There are many things which are not explicitly mentioned in the Bible, like Holy Trinity, details of Worship, Liturgy, yet this was always part of the Church and its beliefs. NT does not contain the fullness of the truth.

It is no surprise that you'd find contradictions in the Bible, as many other groups and individuals have done so thousands times over. This is logical since you're outside of Tradition and the Church community. As a result, many false beliefs and formulations can be, and are formed. Your "beliefs" are as valid as mine then, if all is relative.

But if you say that you accept the Scriptures, and all ancient prophets and "messengers", you have to accept them in its entirety, without conveniently picking and choosing from the Scriptures, and also accept the Tradition.
Do you trust the Gospels, or don't you?

>>>now i would move further to give you the references from the scriptures , but before that i would like to show some of the verses of the quran which tell that earlier genereations of mankind were also sent with messengers.

Qur'an 35:24
Verily We have sent thee (Muhammad) in truth as a bearer of glad tidings and as a warner:
And there never was a people without a warner having lived among them (in the past).

Qur'an 16:36
For We assuredly sent amongst every People an apostle (with the Command) "Serve Allah and eshew Evil":
Of the people were some whom Allah guided and some on whom Error became inevitably (established).
So travel through the earth and see what was the end of those who denied (the Truth).

Qur'an 4:164
And Messengers (Prophets who received revealed books) We have mentioned unto thee (Muhammad) before
And Messengers We have not mentioned unto thee;
And Allah spake directly unto Moses.

These verses of the Holy Qur’an testify that Allah (the One True God) has sent prophets to every people. Therefore, it is not surprising to Muslims to find prophecies about the Last Prophet, Muhammad (s), in previously revealed scriptures
<<<

This is as valid and meaningful as Dianetics.


>>>1)in the old testament there are more than a thousand reference that the messiah will return,but no where has it been mentioned that the name of the messiah would be jesus,instead it refers to muhammed(may peace be upon both of them),which i can prove fom the verse in Deuteronomy, chapter 18, verse 18

( "I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren,
like unto thee,
and I will put my words in his mouth;
and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him." Deut.18:18.[/quote]) <<<

Seriously now...How does this verse specifically refer to Muhammed? Comparison charts ...Anything else?


>>>2) now when we talk about the reference from the bible:Jesus (sws) prays to God that people are given another ‘Comforter’. There is also mention of the ‘Spirit of Truth’ who ‘will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself, but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak and he will show you things to come’, (John 16:13).

it can easily be understood over here that jesus is praying to god to give another comforter to his followers , so why should anyone get confused that he is not talking about muhammed,who was the last and final messenger of god after jesus(may peace be upon both of them).<<<

How did you decide that he is talking about Muhammed?!?! Using something other than fertile imagination that is...


Much of what you've done, in terms of your various "proofs", is pick and choose from the OT and NT. You pick stuff that somehow supports your point of view and Islam, and other stuff is expeditiously discarded (by your own admission, statement such as: but the facts like" i am the father,the son and the word" cannot be accepted by the muslims and they also contradict the first statement that "my father is geater than me"?)

But you're not the only one. This is how thousands upon thousands of heresies and sects have been established. Any heresy can find proof in the scriptures. It's like a spiritual cafeteria. Again, do you trust the Scriptures or don't you?

Sadly, it bears no semblance whatsoever to what you and Islam desperately want to present as the "Truth".

[cnorman18]

It occurs to me that Umair, Rusty, and some others have something in common; they claim that their Scriptures are so clear and simple that there is no room for debate or argument about their meaning.

Rather hard to engage someone with views like that in an actual debate, isn't it?

"You're obviously wrong. I'm obviously right. The only subject of interest is why you're either so stupid, so illogical, or so evil that you don't understand the plain, clear truth."

End of debate.

What's the point?

[umair]

Umair, Happy New Year!

>>>well my answer is clear NO!
the quran does not mention that christ is the spirit of god,niether his word.

but it does mention that christ is a spirit created by god,similar to the way every living soul is, and also mentions that christ spoke the messege of god similar to the way all of his messengers did.<<<

Ha ha, what makes you think I will not address the rest of your post? The problem is that you keep avoiding answering the actual questions that I ask, and volunteer information that I do not ask for -- but I will answer them.

Thanks for answering the question. Now we've established that Islam holds that Christ is Created -- Created 'word', but not eternal. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Please answer the question: (forget Christ now) Do you worship God along with his Spirit and Word?


>>> in the case of muhammed(saw) , the assertion was simply the quran itself , which is a book of such high knowledge and highest level of arabic, contrary to the fact that muhammed(saw) never went to school , or attended any classes.
and the non muslim arabs at that time used to be astonished by the way the prophet(saw) used to recite them so easily.<<<

You say simply the quran itself! How convenient!

How is this different from Hubbard's Dianetics, H. P. Blavatsky's Theosophical writings, or any other self-proclaimed "prophets"?

As we've agreed, If God wants the salvation of the whole world anyone who pretends to be a messenger of God needs a sign and power from God to confirm his message. The fact that Muhammed never went to school, and could recite the quran easily is not very impressive.

The signs and powers are the following: to make miracles, to speak various languages and avoid worldly things -- while you have the opposite traits: the menace with sword, tribute, and conviction, traits which have been found in Muhammed.


>>>now in christianity what you can believe and what you cannot is a matter of debate,because none of the verses of the bible have been written in the life of jesus, and what clearly appears is that because of the love for him and because of some misunderstanding of his messege his desciples started thinking of him as god,and that is what we find in the bible.
for instance their are some points in the bible that we as muslims can accept.<<<

>>>and the fact is that no where in the bible will you find jesus calling himself as the god, instead you will at all places find his desciples calling him with that name.<<<

Yes, it was a matter of debate (Ecumenical Synods), unlike in Islam. Debate establishes correct or orthodox belief. You should also know that the Bible was a product of the Orthodox Church -- the Church came first, then the Bible (decades and centuries after), and the Church always believed that Jesus is the Son of God. There are many things which are not explicitly mentioned in the Bible, like Holy Trinity, details of Worship, Liturgy, yet this was always part of the Church and its beliefs. NT does not contain the fullness of the truth.

It is no surprise that you'd find contradictions in the Bible, as many other groups and individuals have done so thousands times over. This is logical since you're outside of Tradition and the Church community. As a result, many false beliefs and formulations can be, and are formed. Your "beliefs" are as valid as mine then, if all is relative.

But if you say that you accept the Scriptures, and all ancient prophets and "messengers", you have to accept them in its entirety, without conveniently picking and choosing from the Scriptures, and also accept the Tradition.
Do you trust the Gospels, or don't you?

>>>now i would move further to give you the references from the scriptures , but before that i would like to show some of the verses of the quran which tell that earlier genereations of mankind were also sent with messengers.

Qur'an 35:24
Verily We have sent thee (Muhammad) in truth as a bearer of glad tidings and as a warner:
And there never was a people without a warner having lived among them (in the past).

Qur'an 16:36
For We assuredly sent amongst every People an apostle (with the Command) "Serve Allah and eshew Evil":
Of the people were some whom Allah guided and some on whom Error became inevitably (established).
So travel through the earth and see what was the end of those who denied (the Truth).

Qur'an 4:164
And Messengers (Prophets who received revealed books) We have mentioned unto thee (Muhammad) before
And Messengers We have not mentioned unto thee;
And Allah spake directly unto Moses.

These verses of the Holy Qur’an testify that Allah (the One True God) has sent prophets to every people. Therefore, it is not surprising to Muslims to find prophecies about the Last Prophet, Muhammad (s), in previously revealed scriptures
<<<

This is as valid and meaningful as Dianetics.


>>>1)in the old testament there are more than a thousand reference that the messiah will return,but no where has it been mentioned that the name of the messiah would be jesus,instead it refers to muhammed(may peace be upon both of them),which i can prove fom the verse in Deuteronomy, chapter 18, verse 18

( "I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren,
like unto thee,
and I will put my words in his mouth;
and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him." Deut.18:18.

) <<<

Seriously now...How does this verse specifically refer to Muhammed? Comparison charts ...Anything else?


>>>2) now when we talk about the reference from the bible:Jesus (sws) prays to God that people are given another ‘Comforter’. There is also mention of the ‘Spirit of Truth’ who ‘will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself, but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak and he will show you things to come’, (John 16:13).

it can easily be understood over here that jesus is praying to god to give another comforter to his followers , so why should anyone get confused that he is not talking about muhammed,who was the last and final messenger of god after jesus(may peace be upon both of them).<<<

How did you decide that he is talking about Muhammed?!?! Using something other than fertile imagination that is...


Much of what you've done, in terms of your various "proofs", is pick and choose from the OT and NT. You pick stuff that somehow supports your point of view and Islam, and other stuff is expeditiously discarded (by your own admission, statement such as: but the facts like" i am the father,the son and the word" cannot be accepted by the muslims and they also contradict the first statement that "my father is geater than me"?)

But you're not the only one. This is how thousands upon thousands of heresies and sects have been established. Any heresy can find proof in the scriptures. It's like a spiritual cafeteria. Again, do you trust the Scriptures or don't you?

Sadly, it bears no semblance whatsoever to what you and Islam desperately want to present as the "Truth".[/quote]



hello catharsis,

do you know that you are facing the same problem,like many other's, that when you are unable to protect and prove your faith then you start asking illogical questions , like muhammed(saw) was a violent man etc.


well i have no problem with it because i am here to answer questions, but the fact is that you say that people will find contradictions in the bible because they are outside the circle of orthodox believe, but this is the point ,because if a person believes then he dosent needs proof, but it is for the non believers, and believe me i without any hesitation invite you to find contradictions or any blunder in the quran, can you be such confident to protect your belief?

well coming to your point which you have been sticking to from the first day of the debate: no i do not worship god along with his spirit, or along with his word, instead i worship god alone, because god is not like a human body , having the spirit different from the body, and yes i do not worship what he has said instead i worship him.

[umair]

It occurs to me that Umair, Rusty, and some others have something in common; they claim that their Scriptures are so clear and simple that there is no room for debate or argument about their meaning.

Rather hard to engage someone with views like that in an actual debate, isn't it?

"You're obviously wrong. I'm obviously right. The only subject of interest is why you're either so stupid, so illogical, or so evil that you don't understand the plain, clear truth."

End of debate.

What's the point?

no i do not want to end the debate,because the fact is that you until now have not asked your questions.

and yes if you want me to answer you for your misunderstood claims ,then i am sorry for that, because i have been repeatedly asking you to clarify your questions,instead of asking those bold statements like ' islam is violent' , now prove it!

[cnorman18]

It occurs to me that Umair, Rusty, and some others have something in common; they claim that their Scriptures are so clear and simple that there is no room for debate or argument about their meaning.

Rather hard to engage someone with views like that in an actual debate, isn't it?

"You're obviously wrong. I'm obviously right. The only subject of interest is why you're either so stupid, so illogical, or so evil that you don't understand the plain, clear truth."

End of debate.

What's the point?

no i do not want to end the debate,because the fact is that you until now have not asked your questions.

and yes if you want me to answer you for your misunderstood claims ,then i am sorry for that, because i have been repeatedly asking you to clarify your questions,instead of asking those bold statements like ' islam is violent' , now prove it!

Sorry, I decline.

It's clear that you only invited questions in order to prove the superiority and truth of Islam, which you think you have done by simply denying that there are any problems associated with its followers at all. That is utterly ludicrous and unworthy of anything called "debate.'

You also apparently feel free to lie. I never said "Islam is violent," which you claim, by your use of quotation marks, is a direct quote from me. So much for your own truthfulness in your service to Allah.

I'll stand by every one of my posts on this thread. You have answered none of them, but only pretended to by denying plain, obvious, and on-the-record truths; my questions need no clarification. You need to admit that they are real questions based on real events, instead of just sticking your fingers in your ears and repeating your mantras and quoting your book.

And now you have simply lied, telling an outright and blatant untruth and challenging me to prove something I never said.

I see no point in addressing your remarks again.

[umair]

It occurs to me that Umair, Rusty, and some others have something in common; they claim that their Scriptures are so clear and simple that there is no room for debate or argument about their meaning.

Rather hard to engage someone with views like that in an actual debate, isn't it?

"You're obviously wrong. I'm obviously right. The only subject of interest is why you're either so stupid, so illogical, or so evil that you don't understand the plain, clear truth."

End of debate.

What's the point?

no i do not want to end the debate,because the fact is that you until now have not asked your questions.

and yes if you want me to answer you for your misunderstood claims ,then i am sorry for that, because i have been repeatedly asking you to clarify your questions,instead of asking those bold statements like ' islam is violent' , now prove it!

Sorry, I decline.

It's clear that you only invited questions in order to prove the superiority and truth of Islam, which you think you have done by simply denying that there are any problems associated with its followers at all. That is utterly ludicrous and unworthy of anything called "debate.'

You also apparently feel free to lie. I never said "Islam is violent," which you claim, by your use of quotation marks, is a direct quote from me. So much for your own truthfulness in your service to Allah.

I'll stand by every one of my posts on this thread. You have answered none of them, but only pretended to by denying plain, obvious, and on-the-record truths; my questions need no clarification. You need to admit that they are real questions based on real events, instead of just sticking your fingers in your ears and repeating your mantras and quoting your book.

And now you have simply lied, telling an outright and blatant untruth and challenging me to prove something I never said.

I see no point in addressing your remarks again.

well i didnt quote it to show that you said that instead i just wanted to show your ideas when you asked those questions.

one thing is clear that you do not understand my points, i think you possibly would understand them when i ask you questions like :
1)jews are the slayers of jesus
2)jews are responsible for the unrest in the world
3)jews are terrorists
4)jews have always considered their women as mere objects
5)their priests teach hatred,

come on, can you answer them? no possibly you cannot until i quote to you the context of my questions, similar has been the problem with your questions.

[muhammad rasullah]

It is not an accusation that the muslims put forth on the christians it is a truth that christians fail to realize and some do but refuse to accept. How can the father be God, the son be God and the holy spirit be God but there are not three Gods but one god? What language are they speaking when they say this? Surely it isn't english! Three seperate entities cannot be one.

Muslims do not believe that Allah created the world through the word as the christians see it! In John 1:1 christians beleive jesus is the word and god. "in the beginning was the word, and the word was with God and the word was God" Allah strengthened all his messengers with the word. The word is as Allah says 19:35 It is not befitting to (the majesty of) Allah that He should beget a son. Glory be to Him! when He determines a matter, He only says to it, "Be", and it is. Also the message which jesus brought. The birth of jesus is as the likeness of the creation of adam.

Hi umair,

I have some questions, so I hope you're still around...

i) Why do you accuse us, Christians, of having three gods? Why do Muslims believe in a uni-personal God?

A Muslim believes that God created the world through the Word (am I correct?) -- so what the Muslim believes in as Word, is what the Orthodox Christians call the Son?

2) Why do Muslims (much like all Protestants) accuse us, Orthodox Christians, of idolatry with respect to Icons?

Thanks

well first i would like to thank you for posing your queries:

i would like to tell you about what does allah(swt) speaks about himself and the concept of holy trinity in the quran:

REGARDING THE SONSHIP OF JESUS:

"That is Jesus, son of Mary, in word of truth, concerning which they are
doubting. It is not for God to take a son unto Him. Glory be to Him!
When He decrees a thing, He but says to it 'Be', and it is." (Qur'an
19:34, 35)

"And they say, 'the All-Merciful has taken unto Himself a son.' You have
indeed advanced something hideous. The heavens are well nigh rent of it
and the earth split asunder, and the mountains well nigh fall down
crashing for that they have attributed to the All-Merciful a son; and it
behooves not the All-Merciful to take a son. None is there in the
heavens and earth but he comes to the All-Merciful as a servant."
(Qur'an 19:88-93)

"Truly the likeness of Jesus, in God's sight, is as Adam's likeness; He
created him of dust, then said He unto him, 'Be', and he was." (Qur'an
3:59)

"People of the Book, go not beyond the bounds in your religion, and say
not as to God but the Truth. The Messiah, Jesus, son of Mary, was only
the Messenger of God, and His Word that He committed to Mary, and a
spirit from Him. So believe in God and His Messengers, and say not,
'Three.' Refrain; better is it for you. God is only One God. Glory be to
Him - that He should have a son! To Him belongs all that is in the
heavens and in the earth; God suffices for a guardian." (Qur'an 4:171)


B. REGARDING JESUS BEING GOD:

"And when God said, 'O Jesus, son of Mary, did you say unto men, "Take
me and my mother as gods, apart from God?"' He said, 'To You be glory!
It is not mine to say what I have no right to. If I indeed said it, You
knew it, knowing what is within my soul, and I do not know what is
within Your soul; You know the things unseen. I only said to them what
You did command me: "Serve God, my Lord and your Lord." And I was a
witness over them, while I remained among them; but when You did take me
to Yourself the Watcher over them; You are the witness of everything.'"
(Qur'an 5:116, 117)


C. REGARDING CRUCIFIXION OF JESUS

"And for their unbelief, and their uttering against Mary a mighty
calumny, and for their saying, 'We slew the Messiah, Jesus, son of Mary,
the Messenger of God'...yet they did not slay him, neither crucified
him, only a likeness of that was shown to them. Those who are at
variance concerning him surely are in doubt regarding him, they have no
knowledge of him, except the following of surmise; and they did not slay
him of certainty...no indeed; God raised him up to Him; God is Almighty,
All-Wise. There is not one of the People of the Book but will assuredly
believe in him before his death, and on the Resurrection Day, he will be
a witness against them." (Qur'an 4:156-159)



and the most important is how god describes himself in the quran as:

in the name of allah , the most merciful, the most graceful
Say, he is Allah, the one.
Allah is eternel and absolute(lives forever and is above all needs)
non is born of him, nor is he born
and there is none like him.

[muhammad rasullah]

Umair, Happy New Year!

>>>well my answer is clear NO!
the quran does not mention that christ is the spirit of god,niether his word.

but it does mention that christ is a spirit created by god,similar to the way every living soul is, and also mentions that christ spoke the messege of god similar to the way all of his messengers did.<<<

Ha ha, what makes you think I will not address the rest of your post? The problem is that you keep avoiding answering the actual questions that I ask, and volunteer information that I do not ask for -- but I will answer them.

Thanks for answering the question. Now we've established that Islam holds that Christ is Created -- Created 'word', but not eternal. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Please answer the question: (forget Christ now) Do you worship God along with his Spirit and Word?


>>> in the case of muhammed(saw) , the assertion was simply the quran itself , which is a book of such high knowledge and highest level of arabic, contrary to the fact that muhammed(saw) never went to school , or attended any classes.
and the non muslim arabs at that time used to be astonished by the way the prophet(saw) used to recite them so easily.<<<

You say simply the quran itself! How convenient!

How is this different from Hubbard's Dianetics, H. P. Blavatsky's Theosophical writings, or any other self-proclaimed "prophets"?

As we've agreed, If God wants the salvation of the whole world anyone who pretends to be a messenger of God needs a sign and power from God to confirm his message. The fact that Muhammed never went to school, and could recite the quran easily is not very impressive.

.


>>>now in christianity what you can believe and what you cannot is a matter of debate,because none of the verses of the bible have been written in the life of jesus, and what clearly appears is that because of the love for him and because of some misunderstanding of his messege his desciples started thinking of him as god,and that is what we find in the bible.
for instance their are some points in the bible that we as muslims can accept.<<<

>>>and the fact is that no where in the bible will you find jesus calling himself as the god, instead you will at all places find his desciples calling him with that name.<<<

Yes, it was a matter of debate (Ecumenical Synods), unlike in Islam. Debate establishes correct or orthodox belief. You should also know that the Bible was a product of the Orthodox Church -- the Church came first, then the Bible (decades and centuries after), and the Church always believed that Jesus is the Son of God. There are many things which are not explicitly mentioned in the Bible, like Holy Trinity, details of Worship, Liturgy, yet this was always part of the Church and its beliefs. NT does not contain the fullness of the truth.

It is no surprise that you'd find contradictions in the Bible, as many other groups and individuals have done so thousands times over. This is logical since you're outside of Tradition and the Church community. As a result, many false beliefs and formulations can be, and are formed. Your "beliefs" are as valid as mine then, if all is relative.

But if you say that you accept the Scriptures, and all ancient prophets and "messengers", you have to accept them in its entirety, without conveniently picking and choosing from the Scriptures, and also accept the Tradition.
Do you trust the Gospels, or don't you?

>>>now i would move further to give you the references from the scriptures , but before that i would like to show some of the verses of the quran which tell that earlier genereations of mankind were also sent with messengers.

Qur'an 35:24
Verily We have sent thee (Muhammad) in truth as a bearer of glad tidings and as a warner:
And there never was a people without a warner having lived among them (in the past).

Qur'an 16:36
For We assuredly sent amongst every People an apostle (with the Command) "Serve Allah and eshew Evil":
Of the people were some whom Allah guided and some on whom Error became inevitably (established).
So travel through the earth and see what was the end of those who denied (the Truth).

Qur'an 4:164
And Messengers (Prophets who received revealed books) We have mentioned unto thee (Muhammad) before
And Messengers We have not mentioned unto thee;
And Allah spake directly unto Moses.

These verses of the Holy Qur’an testify that Allah (the One True God) has sent prophets to every people. Therefore, it is not surprising to Muslims to find prophecies about the Last Prophet, Muhammad (s), in previously revealed scriptures
<<<

This is as valid and meaningful as Dianetics.


it can easily be understood over here that jesus is praying to god to give another comforter to his followers , so why should anyone get confused that he is not talking about muhammed,who was the last and final messenger of god after jesus(may peace be upon both of them).<<<

How did you decide that he is talking about Muhammed?!?! Using something other than fertile imagination that is...


Much of what you've done, in terms of your various "proofs", is pick and choose from the OT and NT. You pick stuff that somehow supports your point of view and Islam, and other stuff is expeditiously discarded (by your own admission, statement such as: but the facts like" i am the father,the son and the word" cannot be accepted by the muslims and they also contradict the first statement that "my father is geater than me"?)

But you're not the only one. This is how thousands upon thousands of heresies and sects have been established. Any heresy can find proof in the scriptures. It's like a spiritual cafeteria. Again, do you trust the Scriptures or don't you?

Sadly, it bears no semblance whatsoever to what you and Islam desperately want to present as the "Truth".

>>>1)in the old testament there are more than a thousand reference that the messiah will return,but no where has it been mentioned that the name of the messiah would be jesus,instead it refers to muhammed(may peace be upon both of them),which i can prove fom the verse in Deuteronomy, chapter 18, verse 18

( "I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren,
like unto thee,
and I will put my words in his mouth;
and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him." Deut.18:18.

) <<<

Seriously now...How does this verse specifically refer to Muhammed? Comparison charts ...Anything else?[/quote]

Who else could this verse be refering to? There was no other prophet to come after Jesus (peace be upon him) or no other person who claimed to be a prophet after jesus (peace be upon him). Who else could this be if not Muhammad?

>>>2) now when we talk about the reference from the bible:Jesus (sws) prays to God that people are given another ‘Comforter’. There is also mention of the ‘Spirit of Truth’ who ‘will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself, but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak and he will show you things to come’, (John 16:13).

When we read the history of Islam and muhammad (peace be upon him) the words of Allah written in the quran were divinely inspired through the mouth of the messenger of allah!

The signs and powers are the following: to make miracles, to speak various languages and avoid worldly things -- while you have the opposite traits: the menace with sword, tribute, and conviction, traits which have been found in Muhammed

These are not the examples of miracles or signs of a prophet many people can speak various languages and avoid worldly things. the prophet muhammad went into at least seven different battles and never died or had been fatally wounded in any. All these people who hated him and wanted him to die even when they were out numbered by the thousands still couldn't kill him why is that? read the history of the prophet then you'll be able to see the miracles he accomplished the quran being one of them.