Is America A Christian Nation ???

[I AM ALL I AM]

"The proportion of the [American] population that can be classified as Christian has declined from 86% in 1990 to 77% in 2001." ARIS Study. 4
http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_prac2.htm

Main religious preferences of Americans

According to the CIA,[6] the following is the order of religious preferences in the United States:

* Christian: (78.5%)
o Protestant (51.3%)
o Roman Catholic (23.9%)
o Mormon (1.7%)
o other Christian (1.6%)
* unaffiliated (12.1%)
* none (4%)
* other or unspecified (2.5%)
* Jewish (1.7%)
* Buddhist (0.7%)
* Muslim (0.6%)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_i ... ted_States

..... the actual number of overweight or obese people in America, according to the National Institutes of Health (NIH) is much larger - about 60% .....
http://www.center4research.org/wmnshlth ... esity.html

Gluttony (Latin, gula)

Derived from the Latin gluttire, meaning to gulp down or swallow, gluttony is the over-indulgence and over-consumption of anything to the point of waste.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seven_deadly_sins

The Seven Deadly Sins:
Lust
Gluttony
Greed
Sloth
Wrath
Envy
Pride

If the above statistics are correct, can America be called a 'christian nation' when there are 60% (some studies say more) of the population committing one of the 'seven deadly sins', that of gluttony ???

If so, would this mean that you can be a 'sinner' and still be considered christian ???

If not, does this mean that anyone claiming to be a christian that sins is not truly a christian ???

Or, is the claim of being christian enough to be considered a christian (as in George Bush claiming to be a christian) without having to follow the tenets of the faith ???

Or, is belief in 'Jesus Christ' all that is required to be considered a christian and not the actual following of the tenets of faith ???

[Avariel]

Hence, if it is that only a belief in 'Jesus' is required, then the enslaved have become the enslavers when they attempt to convert others to the christian religion/cult.

Further, claims of being a "good christian" would obviously be a claim of being an enslaver of others.

Basically, yes.

This is why many Christian groups claim to be "non-denominational" even though they still end up pushing dogma. This is why Protestants broke away from the Catholic Church in the first place, although they didn't end up that much better off. This is why I'm a solitary practitioner, and this is why the Bible is pushed as being "literal" to suppress subjective and therefore "higher" thinking. No one wants free-thinkers under their control.

[ChristianGuy]

... I would say that the U.S. could be described as a "Christian" Nation.

G'day ChristianGuy.

Not only "would" you say it, you have.

Now, it "could" be called anything, which doesn't mean that it IS actually what it is being called.

Do you have any reasoning as to why you "would" and have called America a christian nation ???

Or are you simply repeating a term that you have heard bandied about by others without contemplating the implications of the term and what it actually means ???

Actually I thought that I explained my point fairly well, but let me go a little deeper into what I said. As far as where the nation stands right now, I wouldn't call it a Christian Nation. Upon looking at what people claim and what our religious statistics show, however, I can see how it is called a "Christian" Nation. When I say that I mean that based solely on what people say they are, I can see it being labeled thus. Maybe it would be more accurate to say that as far as religion goes, we claim to be primarily Christian. I think our founders were probably heavily influenced by Christianity, but they did not write the constitution based on any one religion. This is the land of opportunity and any religion is welcome here, but Christianity is the prevailing belief system in this nation, though it goes without saying that it is becoming less of that each day. So, when I say I could see us being called a Christian Nation, I do not mean to imply that Christianity is the only accepted ideas here. I do however think that the reason that people say that about us is because we are (we claim to be) primarily "Christian" when the census comes around.


As a side note: I have not interacted with you on the forums until now and I just want to say I really appreciate your style. G'day to you too

[I AM ALL I AM]

G'day ChristianGuy.

You started your original post on this thread with this question .....

"Is this about "logic" or is it about the U.S. being a Christian Nation?"


Logically, a definition of christianity would be required to comprehend whether in fact America could honestly be called a christian nation or not.

This is one of the reasons that I asked the original questions of .....

If the above statistics are correct, can America be called a 'christian nation' when there are 60% (some studies say more) of the population committing one of the 'seven deadly sins', that of gluttony ???

If so, would this mean that you can be a 'sinner' and still be considered christian ???

If not, does this mean that anyone claiming to be a christian that sins is not truly a christian ???

Or, is the claim of being christian enough to be considered a christian (as in George Bush claiming to be a christian) without having to follow the tenets of the faith ???

Or, is belief in 'Jesus Christ' all that is required to be considered a christian and not the actual following of the tenets of faith ???

..... which brings into doubt any reasoning in calling America a christian nation and thus offers the opportunity to debate the term being applied by many apparent christians. In relation to the original questions that I asked, I then questioned your reasoning as to why you would declare America a christian nation.

It appears that you have doubts about America being a christian nation from your posts;

"When I watch the news, I feel differently ..."

"I would say that only part of the "Christians" are true Christians, so that percentage may not be very accurate."

... which lead to me questioning your reasoning for doing calling it thus.


You have made reference to the "founders" of America being "heavily influenced by Christianity".

The evidence of George Washington's Masonic affiliation has been most troublesome for multitudes of Christians who have been influenced by the writings of Peter Marshall, D. James Kennedy, David Barton and others. For this reason, we are compelled to post the prima facie evidence of this matter.

The Library of Congress contains the George Washington Papers, which may be viewed online. A search inquiry yielded archives which contain actual photographs of original documents either written to or by Washington. The reader may view these documents in their original form. We have also transcribed certain of these letters which demonstrate, not only Washington's close ties to Freemasonry, but his position as Grand Master of the Alexandria Lodge No. 22 of Virginia.

Although Washington's correspondence with the Masonic Lodges is replete with Masonic references to the Great Architect of the Universe, his response to a Christian clergyman conspicuously avoids mention of Jesus Christ or acknowledgement of personal Christian faith. Washington also defended American Freemasonry and denied that American Masonic societies were connected to English Freemasonry or contaminated with the subversive principles of the Illuminati. The final exchange of letters reveals the mutual admiration between Washington and the Swedenborgian New Church of Baltimore.

The George Washington Papers at the Library of Congress

http://watch.pair.com/GW.html

There is also ample evidence that the 'founding fathers' of America were in fact masons, not christians.

So without the nation being founded on the principles of christianity and doubts about many of the American people actually being christians, can America, in all honesty, be called a christian nation ???

Would calling it thus also constitute an attempt to subvert, not only the truth, but the beliefs of Americans (and the rest of the world) about the country that they live in (or for the rest of the world, the perception of America as a christian nation) ???

[Avariel]

So without the nation being founded on the principles of christianity and doubts about many of the American people actually being christians, can America, in all honesty, be called a christian nation ???

Would calling it thus also constitute an attempt to subvert, not only the truth, but the beliefs of Americans (and the rest of the world) about the country that they live in (or for the rest of the world, the perception of America as a christian nation) ???[/b][/color]

Actually you've got a good point, because none of the founding fathers were Christians. I know Jefferson was an Epicurian, and most of the founding fathers were Deists who did not believe in the Bible and while believing that there was some manner of divine being or creator, did not believe that he concerned himself with the daily lives of humans. And in the 1796 treaty of Tripoli states thus:

[ChristianGuy]

I suppose in the way you put it we eould not be considered a Christian Nation. I really think that people say that though, they are refering to the religious standpoint of the majority of our nation. As far as government goes, I just don't know. It seems to me as if our forefathers were influenced, based on what they wrote, by Christianity. Maybe not though, I really don't know for sure.

[msmcneal]

I suppose in the way you put it we eould not be considered a Christian Nation. I really think that people say that though, they are refering to the religious standpoint of the majority of our nation. As far as government goes, I just don't know. It seems to me as if our forefathers were influenced, based on what they wrote, by Christianity. Maybe not though, I really don't know for sure.

I think the founding fathers might have shared a similar moral code with Christianity, but were not directly influenced by it. It seemed to be a common morality held at the time, with the notable exception of religious freedom. Which is why I don't think that the US was established as a solely Christian state.

[McCulloch]

I think the founding fathers might have shared a similar moral code with Christianity, but were not directly influenced by it. It seemed to be a common morality held at the time, with the notable exception of religious freedom. Which is why I don't think that the US was established as a solely Christian state.

There are other notable exceptions.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. That to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed.

The notion of the consent of the governed is not a Biblical one. In fact, Christians are explicitly instructed to obey the governing authorities.