What did carnivores eat after the flood?

[otseng]

Quarkhead asked a good question. So I'm creating a new topic here to address it.

After all the animals stepped off Noah's ark, what did the carnivores eat? All the (land) animals perished in a world-wide flood. So the only animals that carnivores could eat were those that stepped off the boat. Wouldn't they have all eaten each other? And also what did the carnivores eat while they were in the ark?

[superimposed]

We know that God was involved in many aspects of the flood account. He spoke to Noah and gave instructions on how to build the ark. The Holy Spirit entered Noah for 120 years while he preached to the people about the coming rains. God brought the animals to Noah. And of course God brought the exact ones Noah would need to the ark. Perhaps the superspecies of each kind. And God shut the door to the ark for Noah. So yes Christians rely upon many miracles involved in the account of the ark in Genesis.

When I mentioned Noah stayed upon the ark for 7 days, I meant after they had landed and the flood waters went away. So staying on the ark for 7 more days meant they were in no rush for space or food.

As far as the KT event story and the 65 million years... anyone that actually believes that I was serious, will be ignored from this point forward.

The flood was somewhere about 5000 years ago.

[JoeyKnothead]

From Post 71:

Prolly gonna be best to go on and count these claims up and see which can be shown to be true...

We know that God was involved in many aspects of the flood account.

1. God exists
2. The flood occurred
3. God was involved

He spoke to Noah and gave instructions on how to build the ark.

4. God spoke to Noah
5. About how to build the ark.
6. Noah actually built this ark.

God brought the animals to Noah.

7. God can herd cats

And of course God brought the exact ones Noah would need to the ark.

8. God left out the non-important animals (and plants 'presumabubbly')

Perhaps the superspecies of each kind.

Not counted, but what's a kind, a superspecies, and how are the two related?

And God shut the door to the ark for Noah.

9. God closed the door to the ark

So yes Christians rely upon many miracles involved in the account of the ark in Genesis.

Well that'll 'bout kill any need to challenge all these claims, but since you claimed 'em, you own 'em.

When I mentioned Noah stayed upon the ark for 7 days, I meant after they had landed and the flood waters went away. So staying on the ark for 7 more days meant they were in no rush for space or food.

10. Noah stayed on the ark for seven more days (not counting the claim he was ever on it)

As far as the KT event story and the 65 million years... anyone that actually believes that I was serious, will be ignored from this point forward.

When you admit to misrepresenting, how can anyone take you seriously?

Poe's Law is strong in this'n.

The flood was somewhere about 5000 years ago.

10. The flood occurred
11. It happened about 5000 years ago.

Eleven, eleven wonderful claims. Ahh-hah-hah.

Let's see how many can be shown to be true, or how many turn out to be "not serious".

[Cathar1950]

superimposed wrote:

The flood was somewhere about 5000 years ago.

He is simply wrong headed.
Given the continuity in various places where life continued without a flood not only is the account not historical but his interpretation is even worse and it should be the duty of other Christians to set him right.
Here he has added ignorance to his beliefs and equates the two. If he can't be taught then he needs to be ridiculed as his opinion is ridiculous.

I refuse to let him equate his beliefs with any half intelligible religion.
His religion or world view lacks any credibility.

It should be a moral obligation not to take his views seriously and to either educate or ignore. It's a joke.

Hartshorne give a list of some of the deficiencies of inherited religions.

Otherworldliness—the flight from the one task we surely face, that of human welfare on earth, to a questionable one, the winning of the heavenly passport.
Power worship—the divorce of the notion of supreme influence from that of supreme sensitivity, in concepts both of deity and of the church and state authority.
Asceticsm—the failure to genuinely synthesize “physical� and “spiritual� values, as shown above all in the failure of practicality all the churches to do justice t the meaning and problems of marriage.
Moralism—the notion that serving God is almost entirely a matter of avoiding theft and adultery and the like, together with despising charity, leaving noble-hearted courageous creative action in art, science, and statesmanship as religiously neutral or secondary.
Optimism—the denial that tragedy is fundamental in the nature of existence and God; an example being what one may call the pacifism of magical politics: let us (the pacifists) renounce force and there will be neither war nor very terrible tyranny.
Obscurantism—the theory that we can best praise God by indulging in contradiction and semantical nonsense.
The confusion of deity and humanity in the theory of infallible revelation.
With the possible exception of the last (which seems sufficiently arbitrary on any metaphysical basis), these defects are all connected with the neglect of the divine relativity.
The Divine Relativity: A Social Conception of God 1948 Yale University Press 148-49.

Heartshorne in Beyond Humanism wrote:

The more the rational elements of culture, that is science and critical meatphysics, advance, the less need or excuse there will be, it seems to me, for authoritative revelation as a rival or supplement to knowledge. We need inspiration as well as proof; but infallible inspiration seems a meaningless idea. Even if God dictated the Bible, it would be of no help until he taught us how to traslate it into modern language and thought and life, and if we were taught to do this infallibly, we should aquire a degree of insight clearly incompatable with human limitations.
Popular Fundamentalism is either a negative evil, a callowness of culture which should be kindly assisted to cure itself; or a positive evil, an unloving and therefore unchristian dogmatism which is to be greeted, like every other form of arrogant power, with indignation and ridicule. An infallible dogma or book or church is a boast or a bludgeon, not a call to comradship in human strength or human modesty and repentance.

[DeBunkem]

maybe they picked up all the dead stuff they saw floating in the water

Odd for me to lend support to a creationist argument - but you have a point. Many (most? all?) carnivores are not above scavenging for a meal. Eagles, wolves, big cats, will all eat carrion, which is the proverbial "free lunch" acquired at minimum expenditure of energy.

But I still say, it never happened.

That is assuming the stressed sea carnivores didn't chow down on the easiest source of meat requiring the least expenditure of energy...floating Flood carrion.

[CincyJim]

What "flood"? There is no evidence of any "Noah's ark" flood.

Therefore isn't the question(s) axed putting the cart before the horse?

One ought to be axing about the facts/evidence/proof(truth) of any such flood.




To admit ignorance isn't a sign of stupidity, it blatantly acknowledges a curious intellect.

[Christanity4ever]

I am a progressive creationist of sorts so the young earth creationists as well as atheists make fun of me. However I do wish I had the faith to be a young earth creationist and a fundamentalist christian. Nevertheless I hope God does not smite me for believing that he uses natural events and forces 99% of the time to produce super-normal results. Anyway, if I were an young earth creationist I could say well God made the world look the way it does for mans sake, in other worlds god could do anything and everything so why do we need an ark or anything similar?

I think the flood did seem and for all practical purposes was a local world wide flood. In other words It encompassed the known world. So yes Noah could of built an ark and I believe he did. The point is that he had foreknowledge that the flood was coming. All the rest is gravy.

C4

http://www.icr.org/article/414/

Oh a good book that addresses new scientific/archeological discoveries lending creedence to a flood of truly bibical proportions, here is an excerpt ;

"In 1997, geologists Walter Pitman and William Ryan proposed the first truly novel interpretation of the flood in over 150 years. Their studies of sediments in the Black Sea convinced them that the body had been a freshwater lake until about 5600 B.C. When the rising waters of the Mediterranean broke through the Bosporus, "ten cubic miles of water poured through each day, two hundred times what flows over Niagara Falls."

With great intellectual daring, Pitman and Ryan have moved outside of their academic niche to suggest that this event had enormous consequences for human history. They marshal evidence from archeology, mythology, linguistics, and agriculture to describe a flood-driven diaspora of early farmers. Subsets of these people became (variously) proto-Indo-Europeans, Sumerians, Beaker People, Vincas, Tocharians--the founders of the early cultures of Europe and western Asia. --Mary Ellen Curtin --This text refers to an out of print or unavailable edition of this title."



Its second from the top of my must buy list!

C-4

[Grumpy]

Christanity4ever

It encompassed the known world.

This may be real explanation of what all the Flood myths have as a kernal of truth, and maybe even Noah represents a real person's tale of his family's survival, maybe even saving a few of his domesticated animals. But like all fish in tales(Jonah)get bigger with every retellling, so the Flood kept getting bigger until it swallowed the whole Earth.

Think of these myths as Stone Age Television. As man huddled in the shelter of the cave and gathered around the fire, Tale Tellers were the evening"s entertainment. If the TT was smart, he would make his tales wonderous, to entertain and possibly instruct or indoctrinate the tribe as to the rules of the tribe and who was in charge(the Shaman and/or the Cheif)because he was appointed by god(Divine Right of Kings). Before writing was invented there was already a rich language being passed down by oral means, perhaps with the assistance of a few cave paintings of well known characters and animals. In fact, the cave paintings were the first crude written language...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synoptic_t ... c_cultures

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cave_painting

Men(modern Humans)were in Europe more than 100,000 years ago, had entire civilizations most of us have never heard of, but left lots of information behind in the form of art, tools, burials, artifacts, pottery, bones of game, grains and flowers. Anything organic in origin(bones, leather, grains and flowers)can be very accurately dated by Carbon dating to 50,000 years or so, these are much older than that. Pottery sometimes contains radioactive elements that are "reset" by firing, or other dating methods(there are over 40)which involve radioisotope "stopwatches". The world was not created 6000 years ago, writing was invented about 10-15,000 years ago.

Grumpy

[DeBunkem]

What "flood"? There is no evidence of any "Noah's ark" flood.

Therefore isn't the question(s) axed putting the cart before the horse?

One ought to be axing about the facts/evidence/proof(truth) of any such flood.




To admit ignorance isn't a sign of stupidity, it blatantly acknowledges a curious intellect.

Sometimes the shell blows up the cart first. If the horses survive, they run run like merry hell off the battlefield. Just load and fire. With the Bible and other "holy" books, you'll hit something.

[DeBunkem]

This may be real explanation of what all the Flood myths have as a kernal of truth, and maybe even Noah represents a real person's tale of his family's survival, maybe even saving a few of his domesticated animals. But like all fish in tales(Jonah)get bigger with every retellling, so the Flood kept getting bigger until it swallowed the whole Earth.

Or it could have originated with a common occurence as the Earth emerged from the Ice Age...glacial bursts. At least in N. America, some of them were truly catastrophic. See HugeFloods.com.

[McCulloch]

I think the flood did seem and for all practical purposes was a local world wide flood. In other words It encompassed the known world. So yes Noah could of built an ark and I believe he did. The point is that he had foreknowledge that the flood was coming. All the rest is gravy.

I like that. A local world wide flood. What the heck is that? If it was local then by definition it could not be world-wide. The known world? Known by whom? The Chinese? The Mayans? All humanity?

"In 1997, geologists Walter Pitman and William Ryan proposed the first truly novel interpretation of the flood in over 150 years. Their studies of sediments in the Black Sea convinced them that the body had been a freshwater lake until about 5600 B.C. When the rising waters of the Mediterranean broke through the Bosporus, "ten cubic miles of water poured through each day, two hundred times what flows over Niagara Falls."

With great intellectual daring, Pitman and Ryan have moved outside of their academic niche to suggest that this event had enormous consequences for human history. They marshal evidence from archeology, mythology, linguistics, and agriculture to describe a flood-driven diaspora of early farmers. Subsets of these people became (variously) proto-Indo-Europeans, Sumerians, Beaker People, Vincas, Tocharians--the founders of the early cultures of Europe and western Asia. --Mary Ellen Curtin --This text refers to an out of print or unavailable edition of this title."



Its second from the top of my must buy list!

Don't rush out to buy it.

National Geographic, "Noah's Flood" Not Rooted in Reality, After All? by Bruce Dorminey for National Geographic News, February 6, 2009

Giosan's new study, which appears in the January issue of the journal Quaternary Science Reviews, indicates a less catastrophic influx, submerging only about 1,240 square miles (2,000 square kilometers).

New Scientist, Flood hypothesis seems to hold no water, 04 May 2002 by Jeff Hecht