Evidence For And Against Evolution

[Miles]

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Came across this little gem a bit ago and thought I'd share.




Thoughts?

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[The Barbarian]

People don't matter any more, what they believe matters. It's hard to feel the Christian love that Jesus apparently taught.

To be fair, most Buddhists, most Muslims, most (whatever) fail to live up to the ethical and moral precepts of their professed faiths.

Christians are called on to be an imitation of Christ, who did not assail even the (by Jewish standards) heretical Samaritans. So for a Christian:

Religions, however, that are bound up with an advanced culture have struggled to answer the same questions by means of more refined concepts and a more developed language. Thus in Hinduism, men contemplate the divine mystery and express it through an inexhaustible abundance of myths and through searching philosophical inquiry. They seek freedom from the anguish of our human condition either through ascetical practices or profound meditation or a flight to God with love and trust. Again, Buddhism, in its various forms, realizes the radical insufficiency of this changeable world; it teaches a way by which men, in a devout and confident spirit, may be able either to acquire the state of perfect liberation, or attain, by their own efforts or through higher help, supreme illumination. Likewise, other religions found everywhere try to counter the restlessness of the human heart, each in its own manner, by proposing "ways," comprising teachings, rules of life, and sacred rites. The Catholic Church rejects nothing that is true and holy in these religions. She regards with sincere reverence those ways of conduct and of life, those precepts and teachings which, though differing in many aspects from the ones she holds and sets forth, nonetheless often reflect a ray of that Truth which enlightens all men.
...
No foundation therefore remains for any theory or practice that leads to discrimination between man and man or people and people, so far as their human dignity and the rights flowing from it are concerned.

The Church reproves, as foreign to the mind of Christ, any discrimination against men or harassment of them because of their race, color, condition of life, or religion. On the contrary, following in the footsteps of the holy Apostles Peter and Paul, this sacred synod ardently implores the Christian faithful to "maintain good fellowship among the nations" (1 Peter 2:12), and, if possible, to live for their part in peace with all men,(14) so that they may truly be sons of the Father who is in heaven.
POPE PAUL VI, Nostra Aetate

[EarthScienceguy]

"Excerpted from The Guardian Australia, 5 April 21.

People don't matter anymore, what they believe matters. It's hard to feel the Christian love that Jesus apparently taught."

1. Does love allow people to destroy themselves?

People who smoke have a longer life expectancy than those that engage in homosexual activity. Depression is much higher in those that engage in homosexual activity even in places like Norway and Sweden where it is readily acepted.

2. One point I do agree with you on is that many Christians do not address this subject out of an attitude of love but out of one of condemnation. People can address sin and not be condemning. People are free to make their own choices but regarding this lifestyle.

3. Laws against smoking were put in place because of the number of people smoking kills each year and yet those that engage in homosexual activity have a higher death rate than those that smoke. So why should there not be laws banning this activity if it kills more people.

[Miles]

"Excerpted from The Guardian Australia, 5 April 21.

People don't matter anymore, what they believe matters. It's hard to feel the Christian love that Jesus apparently taught."

1. Does love allow people to destroy themselves?

How would a feeling go about allowing something?

People who smoke have a longer life expectancy than those that engage in homosexual activity. Depression is much higher in those that engage in homosexual activity even in places like Norway and Sweden where it is readily acepted.

We await your evidence.

2. One point I do agree with you on is that many Christians do not address this subject out of an attitude of love but out of one of condemnation. People can address sin and not be condemning.

Curious, what do you mean by "address"? Talk about? Debate? Examine? Question? Discuss? Clarify?

3. Laws against smoking were put in place because of the number of people smoking kills each year and yet those that engage in homosexual activity have a higher death rate than those that smoke. So why should there not be laws banning this activity if it kills more people.

Again, let's see your evidence that those who engage in homosexual activity have a higher death rate than those that smoke.

AND why would laws against homosexual activity would be reasonable? I ask because the established attitude toward any behavior is one of acceptance unless some factor(s) suggest otherwise. Got some factor(s) that deems homosexual activity so bad that laws should be established to ban it?


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[EarthScienceguy]

[Replying to Miles in post #284]

Previous estimates from obituaries and pre-1994 sex surveys suggested that the median age of death for homosexuals is less than 50 yr. Four contemporary databases were used to test that estimate: (1) obituaries in the homosexual press from 1993 through 1997 reflected treatment success for those with AIDS but suggested a median age of death less than 50 years; (2) two large random sexuality surveys in 1994--one in the USA and the other in Britain--yielded results consistent with a median age of death for homosexuals of less than 50 years; (3) the median age of those ever married in Denmark, Sweden, and Norway was about 50 years, while that of the ever homosexually partnered was about 40 yr; further, the married were about 5 times more apt to be old and 4 times less apt to be widowed young; and (4) intravenous drug abusers and homosexuals taking HIV tests in Colorado had almost identical age distributions. The four lines of evidence were consistent with previous findings suggesting that homosexual activity may be associated with a lifespan shortened by 20 to 30 years.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/9923159/

It’s well known to the point of stereotype that gay men experience higher rates of HIV, substance abuse, and suicide. But it’s less known, and hardly talked about, that we also have much higher rates of depression, especially those of us living with HIV, despite the causal relationship of depression and self-medicating and self-harming behavior.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog ... r=ac12003a

Depression affects LGBT people at higher rates than the heterosexual population, and LGBT youths are more likely than heterosexual students to report high levels of drug use and feelings of depression. According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC)Trusted Source, suicide is the third leading cause of death among people age 10 to 24 in the United States. Lesbian, gay, and bisexual youths in grades 7-12 are twice as likely trusted Source to attempt suicide than their heterosexual peers.

https://www.healthline.com/health/depre ... r=ffcac34b

Research also shows that, compared to other men, gay and bisexual men have higher chances of having:

Major depression,
Bipolar disorder, and
Generalized anxiety disorder.
One man upset with arms crossed and another man with hands resting on upset man's shoulders in a comforting motion.
Gay and bisexual men may also face other health threats that usually happen along with mental health problems. These include more use of illegal drugs and a greater risk for suicide. Gay and bisexual men are more likely than other men to have tried to commit suicide as well as to have succeeded at suicide. HIV is another issue that has had a huge impact on the mental health of gay and bisexual men. It affects men who are living with HIV; those who are at high risk, but HIV negative; and loved ones of those living with, or who have died from HIV.

https://www.cdc.gov/msmhealth/mental-health.htm

MALE HOMOSEXUALS COMMIT A DISPROPORTIONATE NUMBER OF CHILD SEX ABUSE CASES
Homosexual apologists admit that some homosexuals sexually molest children, but they deny that homosexuals are more likely to commit such offenses. After all, they argue, the majority of child molestation cases are heterosexual in nature. While this is correct in terms of absolute numbers, this argument ignores the fact that homosexuals comprise only a very small percentage of the population.

The evidence indicates that homosexual men molest boys at rates grossly disproportionate to the rates at which heterosexual men molest girls. To demonstrate this it is necessary to connect several statistics related to the problem of child sex abuse: 1) men are almost always the perpetrator; 2) up to one-third or more of child sex abuse cases are committed against boys; 3) less than three percent of the population are homosexuals. Thus, a tiny percentage of the population (homosexual men), commit one-third or more of the cases of child sexual molestation.

http://lanternproject.org.uk/library/ge ... ual-abuse/

Love is not a feeling. Love is a commitment.

Feelings come and go. Lust is a feeling. I feel like being with you until you give me what I want. When you stop giving me what I want I am done with you.

Love is committed to the betterment of someone else. Love stays committed to the betterment of a person even when their feelings may say they do not like the person and then love adds on the phrase "right now". Because they know eventually their feelings for that person will come back if they stay committed to the betterment of that person.

[EarthScienceguy]

[Replying to Miles in post #284]

Yet another anthology of homosexual fiction, A History of Gay Literature: The Male Tradition, published by Yale University Press, includes “a longish chapter on ‘Boys and Boyhood’ which is a seemingly definitive account of pro-pedophile literary works.” The author appears more concerned with the feelings and emotions of the man than with his boy victim. He explores the question of “whether or not you regard as a way of retreating from life or, on the contrary, as a way of engaging with it at its most honest and least corrupted level.”

· A significant percentage of books that have appeared on the Gay Men’s Press fiction bestseller list contain pedophilia themes, including:

Some Boys: described as a “memoir of a lover of boys” that “evokes the author’s young friends across four decades.”
For a Lost Soldier: the story of a sexual relationship between a soldier and an eleven-year-old boy, set during World War II.
A Good Start, Considering: yet another story about an eleven-year-old boy (!) who suffers sexual abuse but is rescued by a teenager who “offers him love and affection”
Terre Haute: billed as “A poetic novel of sexual awakening in the American Midwest, tracing an adolescent’s journey from introspection to perilous desire.”
Shiva and Arun: the story of two Indian adolescents who “discover early on the joys of sex.”
Teardrops on My Drum: barefoot kids in 1920’s Liverpool search for “adventure, love and sex.”
Pro-pedophilia Publications
Recent years have seen the appearance of publications that lend a scholarly veneer to the fascination with pedophilia in the gay community. Such publications attempt to make the case for “intergenerational intimacy.” The nation’s largest gay publisher, Alyson Publications, which distributes Daddy’s Roommate and other homosexual books that promote homosexuality to children, publishes books advocating man-boy sex, including:

· Paedophilia: The Radical Case, which contains detailed information on how to engage in sexual relations with young boys.

· The Age Taboo, another defense of pedophiliawhich claims: “Boy-lovers . . . are not child molesters. The child abusers are . . . parents who force their staid morality onto the young people in their custody.”

The Journal of Homosexuality and Pedophilia
The Journal of Homosexuality is viewed as the premier “mainstream” English-language publication of the gay movement. One prominent editor is John DeCecco, a psychologist at San Francisco State University who also serves on the editorial board of the Dutch pedophile journal Paidika. It is therefore not surprising to see pedophilia promoted on its pages.

In 1990 the Journal of Homosexuality published a series of essays on pedophilia that were eventually published as Male Inter-Generational Intimacy:Historical, Socio-Psychological, and Legal Perspectives, edited by pedophile Edward Brongersma. None of the essays offered any substantive criticism of pedophilia: most blatantly promoted man-boy love as the natural right of homosexuals.

In 1999 Helmut Graupner, wrote an article on pedophilia in the Journal of Homosexuality, in which he claims: “Man/boy and woman/girl relations without doubt are same-sex relations and they do constitute an aspect of gay and lesbian life.” Graupner argues that, as such, consensual sexual relations between adult homosexuals and youths as young as fourteen qualifies as a “gay rights issue.”

The fascination with pedophilia continues to be a cause of concern even within the gay community. Lesbian columnist Paula Martinac, writing in the homosexual newspaper Washington Blade, states:

ome gay men still maintain that an adult who has same-sex relations with someone under the legal age of consent is on some level doing the kid a favor by helping to bring him or her ‘out.’ It’s not pedophilia, this thinking goes–pedophilia refers only to little kids. Instead, adult-youth sex is viewed as an important aspect of gay culture, with a history dating back to ‘Greek love’ of ancient times. This romanticized version of adult-youth sexual relations has been a staple of gay literature and has made appearances, too, in gay-themed films.
Martinac adds that “When some gay men venerate adult-youth sex as affirming while simultaneously declaring ‘We’re not pedophiles,’ they send an inconsistent message to society. . . . The lesbian and gay community will never be successful in fighting the pedophile stereotype until we all stop condoning sex with young people.”

http://lanternproject.org.uk/library/ge ... ual-abuse/

VICTIM’S TURNED VICTIMIZERS: THE CONSEQUENCES OF HOMOSEXUAL CHILD ABUSE
The steadfast denial of the disturbing ties with pedophilia within the homosexual movement is no purely academic matter. Perhaps the most tragic aspect of the homosexual-pedophile connection is the fact that men who sexually molest boys all too often lead their victims into homosexuality and pedophilia. The evidence indicates that a high percentage of homosexuals and pedophiles were themselves sexually abused as children:

· The Archives of Sexual Behavior reports: “One of the most salient findings of this study is that 46 percent of homosexual men and 22 percent of homosexual women reported having been molested by a person of the same gender. This contrasts to only 7 percent of heterosexual men and 1 percent of heterosexual women reporting having been molested by a person of the same gender.”

· A study of 279 homosexual/bisexual men with AIDS and control patients discussed in the Journal of the American Medical Association reported: “More than half of both case and control patients reported a sexual act with a male by age 16 years, approximately 20 percent by age 10 years.”

· Noted child sex abuse expert David Finkelhor found that “boys victimized by older men were over four times more likely to be currently engaged in homosexual activity than were non-victims. The finding applied to nearly half the boys who had had such an experience. . . . Further, the adolescents themselves often linked their homosexuality to their sexual victimization experiences.”

· A study in the International Journal of Offender Therapy and Comparative Criminology found:”In the case of childhood sexual experiences prior to the age of fourteen, 40 percent (of the pedophile sample) reported that they had engaged ‘very often’ in sexual activity with an adult, with 28 percent stating that this type of activity had occurred ‘sometimes'”

· A National Institute of Justice report states that “the odds that a childhood sexual abuse victim will be arrested as an adult for any sex crime is 4.7 times higher than for people . . . who experienced no victimization as children.”

· A Child Abuse and Neglect study found that 59 percent of male child sex offenders had been “victim of contact sexual abuse as a child.”

· The Journal of Child Psychiatry noted that “there is a tendency among boy victims to recapitulate their own victimization, only this time with themselves in the role of perpetrator and someone else the victim.”

The circle of abuse is the tragic legacy of the attempts by homosexuals to legitimize having sex with boys. For too many boys it is already too late to protect them from those who took advantage of their need for love and attention. All too many later perpetrate the abuse by themselves engaging in the sexual abuse of boys. Only by exposing the lies, insincere denials, and deceptions–including those wrapped in scholastic garb–of those who prey sexually on children, can we hope to build a wall of protection around the helpless children among us.

http://lanternproject.org.uk/library/ge ... ual-abuse/

[Clownboat]

[Replying to Miles in post #284]

Yet another anthology of homosexual fiction, A History of Gay Literature: The Male Tradition, published by Yale University Press, includes “a longish chapter on ‘Boys and Boyhood’ which is a seemingly definitive account of pro-pedophile literary works.” The author appears more concerned with the feelings and emotions of the man than with his boy victim. He explores the question of “whether or not you regard as a way of retreating from life or, on the contrary, as a way of engaging with it at its most honest and least corrupted level.”

· A significant percentage of books that have appeared on the Gay Men’s Press fiction bestseller list contain pedophilia themes, including:

Some Boys: described as a “memoir of a lover of boys” that “evokes the author’s young friends across four decades.”
For a Lost Soldier: the story of a sexual relationship between a soldier and an eleven-year-old boy, set during World War II.
A Good Start, Considering: yet another story about an eleven-year-old boy (!) who suffers sexual abuse but is rescued by a teenager who “offers him love and affection”
Terre Haute: billed as “A poetic novel of sexual awakening in the American Midwest, tracing an adolescent’s journey from introspection to perilous desire.”
Shiva and Arun: the story of two Indian adolescents who “discover early on the joys of sex.”
Teardrops on My Drum: barefoot kids in 1920’s Liverpool search for “adventure, love and sex.”
Pro-pedophilia Publications
Recent years have seen the appearance of publications that lend a scholarly veneer to the fascination with pedophilia in the gay community. Such publications attempt to make the case for “intergenerational intimacy.” The nation’s largest gay publisher, Alyson Publications, which distributes Daddy’s Roommate and other homosexual books that promote homosexuality to children, publishes books advocating man-boy sex, including:

· Paedophilia: The Radical Case, which contains detailed information on how to engage in sexual relations with young boys.

· The Age Taboo, another defense of pedophiliawhich claims: “Boy-lovers . . . are not child molesters. The child abusers are . . . parents who force their staid morality onto the young people in their custody.”

The Journal of Homosexuality and Pedophilia
The Journal of Homosexuality is viewed as the premier “mainstream” English-language publication of the gay movement. One prominent editor is John DeCecco, a psychologist at San Francisco State University who also serves on the editorial board of the Dutch pedophile journal Paidika. It is therefore not surprising to see pedophilia promoted on its pages.

In 1990 the Journal of Homosexuality published a series of essays on pedophilia that were eventually published as Male Inter-Generational Intimacy:Historical, Socio-Psychological, and Legal Perspectives, edited by pedophile Edward Brongersma. None of the essays offered any substantive criticism of pedophilia: most blatantly promoted man-boy love as the natural right of homosexuals.

In 1999 Helmut Graupner, wrote an article on pedophilia in the Journal of Homosexuality, in which he claims: “Man/boy and woman/girl relations without doubt are same-sex relations and they do constitute an aspect of gay and lesbian life.” Graupner argues that, as such, consensual sexual relations between adult homosexuals and youths as young as fourteen qualifies as a “gay rights issue.”

The fascination with pedophilia continues to be a cause of concern even within the gay community. Lesbian columnist Paula Martinac, writing in the homosexual newspaper Washington Blade, states:

ome gay men still maintain that an adult who has same-sex relations with someone under the legal age of consent is on some level doing the kid a favor by helping to bring him or her ‘out.’ It’s not pedophilia, this thinking goes–pedophilia refers only to little kids. Instead, adult-youth sex is viewed as an important aspect of gay culture, with a history dating back to ‘Greek love’ of ancient times. This romanticized version of adult-youth sexual relations has been a staple of gay literature and has made appearances, too, in gay-themed films.
Martinac adds that “When some gay men venerate adult-youth sex as affirming while simultaneously declaring ‘We’re not pedophiles,’ they send an inconsistent message to society. . . . The lesbian and gay community will never be successful in fighting the pedophile stereotype until we all stop condoning sex with young people.”

http://lanternproject.org.uk/library/ge ... ual-abuse/

VICTIM’S TURNED VICTIMIZERS: THE CONSEQUENCES OF HOMOSEXUAL CHILD ABUSE
The steadfast denial of the disturbing ties with pedophilia within the homosexual movement is no purely academic matter. Perhaps the most tragic aspect of the homosexual-pedophile connection is the fact that men who sexually molest boys all too often lead their victims into homosexuality and pedophilia. The evidence indicates that a high percentage of homosexuals and pedophiles were themselves sexually abused as children:

· The Archives of Sexual Behavior reports: “One of the most salient findings of this study is that 46 percent of homosexual men and 22 percent of homosexual women reported having been molested by a person of the same gender. This contrasts to only 7 percent of heterosexual men and 1 percent of heterosexual women reporting having been molested by a person of the same gender.”

· A study of 279 homosexual/bisexual men with AIDS and control patients discussed in the Journal of the American Medical Association reported: “More than half of both case and control patients reported a sexual act with a male by age 16 years, approximately 20 percent by age 10 years.”

· Noted child sex abuse expert David Finkelhor found that “boys victimized by older men were over four times more likely to be currently engaged in homosexual activity than were non-victims. The finding applied to nearly half the boys who had had such an experience. . . . Further, the adolescents themselves often linked their homosexuality to their sexual victimization experiences.”

· A study in the International Journal of Offender Therapy and Comparative Criminology found:”In the case of childhood sexual experiences prior to the age of fourteen, 40 percent (of the pedophile sample) reported that they had engaged ‘very often’ in sexual activity with an adult, with 28 percent stating that this type of activity had occurred ‘sometimes'”

· A National Institute of Justice report states that “the odds that a childhood sexual abuse victim will be arrested as an adult for any sex crime is 4.7 times higher than for people . . . who experienced no victimization as children.”

· A Child Abuse and Neglect study found that 59 percent of male child sex offenders had been “victim of contact sexual abuse as a child.”

· The Journal of Child Psychiatry noted that “there is a tendency among boy victims to recapitulate their own victimization, only this time with themselves in the role of perpetrator and someone else the victim.”

The circle of abuse is the tragic legacy of the attempts by homosexuals to legitimize having sex with boys. For too many boys it is already too late to protect them from those who took advantage of their need for love and attention. All too many later perpetrate the abuse by themselves engaging in the sexual abuse of boys. Only by exposing the lies, insincere denials, and deceptions–including those wrapped in scholastic garb–of those who prey sexually on children, can we hope to build a wall of protection around the helpless children among us.

http://lanternproject.org.uk/library/ge ... ual-abuse/

It is wrong (evil IMO) to restrict something I hold dear from another human on this planet. (Exceptions to every rule of course. I'm talking as a whole).
I hold dear that I had the option to fall in love with the person I chose. I hold dear that I am able to live my life with this person and even begin a family if we so choose. I hold dear growing old with this person and so much more.

To ostracize a subset of humanity when we are talking about something we hold dear for ourselves (like love and/or marriage), is wrong and evil. I would like to think humans wouldn't do this, if not for some religions of course.

[EarthScienceguy]

[Replying to Clownboat in post #287]

To ostracize a subset of humanity when we are talking about something we hold dear for ourselves (like love and/or marriage), is wrong and evil. I would like to think humans wouldn't do this, if not for some religions of course.

How many daughters have "fallen in love" with men that from the very start of their relationship harm them? It would be unloving of a parent not to warn that child of the harm that is going to befall them if they continue in this relationship.

Regarding studies regarding homosexual couples and violence, a recent study by the Canadian government regarding homosexual couples states that "violence was twice as common among homosexual couples compared with heterosexual couples".[2] According the American College of Pediatricians who cite several studies violence among homosexual couples is two to three times more common than among married heterosexual couples.[3] In addition, the American College of Pediatricians states the following: "Homosexual partnerships are significantly more prone to dissolution than heterosexual marriages with the average homosexual relationship lasting only two to three years."[3]

In June 2004, the journal Nursing Clinics of North America reported the following regarding homosexual couples:

“ Domestic abuse is under-reported in the gay community...
Male-on-male same-sex domestic violence also has been reported in couples where one or both persons are HIV-positive. Intimate partner abuse and violence include humiliation, threatening to disclose HIV status, withholding HIV therapy, and harming family members or pets.[4]

”
In 2000, the New York Times in an article entitled Silence Ending About Abuse in Gay Relationships cites some information which may indicate that domestic abuse may be under-reported in the homosexual community.[5] The New York Times article states the following:

“ But the issue of gay domestic abuse has been shrouded by silence until recently...
For years, gay people have tried to keep quiet about the problem, said Dave Shannon, coordinator of the violence recovery program at Fenway Community Health, a gay and lesbian clinic in Boston.

Mr. Shannon said: People feel, 'Why should we air our dirty laundry? People feel so negatively about us already, the last thing we should do is contribute to negative stereotypes of us.' [5]

https://conservapedia.com/Homosexual_Co ... c_Violence

[Aetixintro]

Evolution's Gaping Hole by Discovery Science - Thus Spurious Existence?

"Arrival of the Fittest!"

Here on YouTube:

[Miles]

Evolution's Gaping Hole by Discovery Science - Thus Spurious Existence?

"Arrival of the Fittest!"

Here on YouTube:

Ah yes, more pseudoscience and anti-evolution claptrap from Discovery Institute, home of Intelligent Design, "Teach the Controversy," and the infamous Wedge Document.

No thanks. I'll pass.



.

[brunumb]

Evolution's Gaping Hole by Discovery Science - Thus Spurious Existence?

"Arrival of the Fittest!"

Try this instead:

Arrival of the Fittest
Solving Evolution's Greatest Puzzle
Andreas Wagner
Discover the final puzzle piece to complete Darwin's theory of evolution in this landmark book from one of today's most inventive scientists



https://oneworld-publications.com/arriv ... ttest.html