Muslim violence

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1John2_26
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Muslim violence

Post #1

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In mosques throughout Palestinian cities, clerics condemned the cartoons. An imam at the Omari Mosque in Gaza City told 9,000 worshippers that those behind the drawings should have their heads cut off.

"If they want a war of religions, we are ready," Hassan Sharaf, an imam in Nablus, said in his sermon.
Why do Muslims react so violently to harmless things like "insulting and insensitive cartoons?"

Will Islam ever join the world in debate rather than reacting with violence and war?
Muslims Again Protest Muhammad Caricatures

By QASSIM ABDEL-ZAHRA, Associated Press Writer

Tens of thousands of angry Muslims marched through Palestinian cities, burning the Danish flag and calling for vengeance Friday against European countries where caricatures of the Prophet Muhammad were published.

Angry protests against the drawings were spread in the Muslim world.

In Iraq, thousands demonstrated after Friday mosque services, and the country's leading Shiite cleric denounced the drawings. About 4,500 people rallied in Basra and hundreds at a Baghdad mosque. Danish flags were burned at both demonstrations.

Muslims in Turkey, Pakistan, Indonesia and Malaysia demonstrated against the European nations whose papers published them.

The caricatures, including one depicting the Muslim prophet wearing a turban fashioned into a bomb, were reprinted in papers in Norwegian, French, German and even Jordanian after first appearing in a Danish paper in September. The drawings were republished after Muslims decried the images as insulting to their prophet. Dutch-language newspapers in Belgium and two Italian right-wing papers reprinted the drawings Friday.

Islamic law, based on clerics' interpretation of the Quran and the sayings of the prophet, forbids depiction's of the Prophet Muhammad and other major religious figures even positive ones to prevent idolatry. Shiite Muslim clerics differ in that they allow images of their greatest saint, Ali, the prophet's son-in-law, though not Muhammad.

Danish Prime Minister Fogh Rasmussen, in a meeting with the Egyptian ambassador, reiterated his stance that the government cannot interfere with issues concerning the press. On Monday, he said his government could not apologize on behalf of a newspaper, but that he personally "never would have depicted Muhammad, Jesus or any other religious character in a way that could offend other people."

Early Friday, Palestinian militants threw a bomb at a French cultural center in Gaza City, and many Palestinians began boycotting European goods, especially those from Denmark.

"Whoever defames our prophet should be executed," said Ismail Hassan, 37, a tailor who marched through the pouring rain along with hundreds of others in the West Bank city of Ramallah.

"Bin Laden our beloved, Denmark must be blown up," protesters in Ramallah chanted.

In mosques throughout Palestinian cities, clerics condemned the cartoons. An imam at the Omari Mosque in Gaza City told 9,000 worshippers that those behind the drawings should have their heads cut off.

"If they want a war of religions, we are ready," Hassan Sharaf, an imam in Nablus, said in his sermon.

About 10,000 demonstrators, including gunmen from the Islamic militant group Hamas firing in the air, marched through Gaza City to the Palestinian legislature, where they climbed on the roof, waving green Hamas banners.

"We are ready to redeem you with our souls and our blood our beloved prophet," they chanted. "Down, Down Denmark."

Thousands of protesters in the center of Nablus burned at least 10 Danish flags. In Jenin, about 1,500 people demonstrated, burning Danish dairy products. Hundreds protested in Jericho, and protests were held in towns throughout Gaza.

Fearing an outbreak of violence, Israel barred all Palestinians under age 45 from praying at Jerusalem's Al Aqsa Mosque compound, Islam's third holiest site.

Nevertheless, about 100 men chanting Islamic slogans and carrying a green Hamas flag demonstrated outside Jerusalem's Old City on Friday afternoon. The crowd scattered when police on horseback arrived, and some of the protesters threw rocks. Police broke up a second demonstration at Damascus Gate with tear gas and stun grenades.

In Iraq, the country's top Shiite cleric, Grand Ayatollah Ali al-Sistani, decried the drawings but did not call for protests.

"We strongly denounce and condemn this horrific action," he said in a statement posted on his Web site and dated Tuesday.

Al-Sistani, who wields enormous influence over Iraq's majority Shiites, made no call for protests and suggested that militant Muslims were partly to blame for distorting Islam's image.

He referred to "misguided and oppressive" segments of the Muslim community and said their actions "projected a distorted and dark image of the faith of justice, love and brotherhood."

"Enemies have exploited this ... to spread their poison and revive their old hatreds with new methods and mechanisms," he said.

The drawings were first published in September in the Danish newspaper Jyllands-Posten. The issue reignited last week after Saudi Arabia recalled its ambassador to Denmark and many European newspapers reprinted them this week.

The Jyllands-Posten had asked 40 cartoonists to draw images of the prophet. The purpose, its chief editor said, was "to examine whether people would succumb to self-censorship, as we have seen in other cases when it comes to Muslim issues."

The 12 caricatures have prompted boycotts of Danish goods, bomb threats and demonstrations in front of Danish embassies across the Islamic world. Muslims have also directed their anger at other European countries, with Palestinian gunmen briefly kidnapping a German citizen Thursday and surrounding European Union headquarters in Gaza.

Turkey's Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan was quoted as saying the caricatures are an attack on "our spiritual values" which have damaged efforts to establish an alliance between the Muslim world and Europe.

Hundreds of Turks emerging from mosques following Friday prayers staged demonstrations, including one in front of the Danish consulate in Istanbul.

"Hands that reach Islam must be broken," chanted a group of extremists outside the Merkez Mosque in Istanbul.

In Jakarta, Indonesia, more than 150 hardline Muslims stormed a high-rise building housing the Danish Embassy on Friday and tore down and burned the country's flag.

Pakistan's parliament unanimously voted to condemn the drawings as a "vicious, outrageous and provocative campaign" that has "hurt the faith and feelings of Muslims all over the world." About 800 people protested in Pakistan's capital, Islamabad, chanting "Death to Denmark" and "Death to France." Another rally in the southern city of Karachi drew 1,200 people.

Fundamentalist Muslims protested outside the Danish Embassy in Malaysia, chanting "Long live Islam, destroy our enemies."

British Foreign Secretary Jack Straw criticized European media outlets for republishing the caricatures as demonstrators prepared to take to the streets of London.

____

Associated Press Writers Qassim Abdul-Zahra and Sinan Salaheddin in Baghdad, Iraq; Selcan Hacaoglu in Ankara, Turkey; Benjamin Harvey in Istanbul, Turkey; Maria Sanminiatelli in Rome; Jan M. Olsen in Copenhagen, Denmark; Munir Ahmad in Islamabad, Pakistan; and Irwan Firdaus in Jakarta, Indonesia, contributed to this report.


Copyright 2006 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. The information contained in the AP News report may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed without the prior written authority of The Associated Press.

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micatala
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Post #21

Post by micatala »

Why do Muslims react so violently to harmless things like "insulting and insensitive cartoons?"
The people who are going way over board in their reactions are simply taking things way, way too seriously. Maybe religious training should also come with a little training in humor and humility?

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Post #22

Post by 1John2_26 »

Quote:

We already have social, civil and religious laws against killing the innocent.


Well that's reassuring considering that Christians take it as a matter of faith that none are innocent.
And the Gospel of Christ is offered as a remedy for a sinful life to be lived to a long and natural conclusion. Unlike Islaimic Jihadism that ends the innocent life with a beheading by sword, AK-47 or bomb.

The comparison really is to Islamic intolerance that is eerily similar to secularism. Neither wants Christians to speak.

One uses "civil rights" laws and one uses the sword.

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Post #23

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ENIGMA wrote:Everybody has free speech. Nobody gets the governmental megaphone.
Baloney. I don't see any clergy in the New York City Council, in the State Assembly or in Congress or the Senate. Some religious lobbyists, maybe, but no real religious representatives of the people.
You want the governmental megaphone. You want the force of government to indoctrinate all the unbelievers that you can and silence the rest.
No, that's what the national neo-Darwinist abortionists like Bill and Hill Clinton want.
Christian votes elect Christian political leaders to power who then appoint judges who share their values.
What are the values of these so-called Christian political leaders and judges? Separation of church and state in violation of the First Amendment which prohibits the federal government from making any law prohibiting the free exercise of religion? Supreme Court or any other federal prohibitions against the clergy teaching religion in state schools hypocritically violate the rights of free states and the free clergy to do so.
Even now they are chipping away at the wall of church/state separation which has, by and large, protected all Americans from religious persecution by the government. It protects you as well. Be glad.
Why should anyone be "glad," other than secular socialists when the secular state has the power to break up religious marriages and otherwise abort the offspring of Christian, Jewish and Muslim wives and husbands without equal parental or religious consent?
Would this "secular Church" be the EAC or the Illuminati?
I have some difficulty remembering which mythical secret order does what items..
I have difficulty in remembering what the EAC stands for - the European American Community or the East African Community of Darwinist descendents of apes.
Christians are still able to vote. Their votes count just as much as anyone else's votes.
Not as long as the corrupt politicians they vote for continue to deny their clergy the right to teach religion in public schools. The public schools belong to the clergy as much as anyone else, no? Don't tell us our so-called public schools are the private property of secular political hacks like Pataki and Bloomberg or other neo-Darwinist sex theorists and secular socialists and abortionists like Hill Clinton.
Does this mean that if I torch a few buildings in response to something Pat Robertson said on the 700 Club, I get to send him the bill for the damage?
No, but if Pat says something which incites you and other secularists to riot, the newspaper or tv broadcasting corp which he said it on should be held liable for the damages you and your fellow secularist reactionaries cause to the public at large.
Last I checked, the newspaper industry doesn't constitute a government.
Last time I checked, the press is considered to be the fourth branch of government instead of the church.
Well that's reassuring considering that Christians take it as a matter of faith that none are innocent. :roll:
That's right. Especially those who slaughter and commit abortion of the unborn children of Christian, Jewish and Muslim babies. Since Bill and Hill Clinton are staunch advocates of the right of medical doctors to kill Christian, Jewish and Muslim babies before they are born, they head the list of those wanted for domestic violence, infanticide and international terrorism.

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Post #24

Post by jcrawford »

micatala wrote:
Why do Muslims react so violently to harmless things like "insulting and insensitive cartoons?"
The people who are going way over board in their reactions are simply taking things way, way too seriously. Maybe religious training should also come with a little training in humor and humility?
Yes, let's have a little secular indoctrination in religious training, humor and humility. Otherwise, some secular socialists may go overboard in their reactions to religious fundamentalists by taking themselves way too seriously.

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Post #25

Post by jcrawford »

1John2_26 wrote:The comparison really is to Islamic intolerance that is eerily similar to secularism. Neither wants Christians to speak.

One uses "civil rights" laws and one uses the sword.
Muslims and seccy socialists in cahoots against Christians? What's a Christian to do else side with the Jew as if Muslims and seccies don't hate them too?

Too bad that all of God's people don't form a Holy Political Council in New York City to offset the unholy influence of the Security Council down at the imperial seccy socialist club called the U.N.

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Post #26

Post by ENIGMA »

1John2_26 wrote:
Quote:

We already have social, civil and religious laws against killing the innocent.

Well that's reassuring considering that Christians take it as a matter of faith that none are innocent.
And the Gospel of Christ is offered as a remedy for a sinful life to be lived to a long and natural conclusion. Unlike Islaimic Jihadism that ends the innocent life with a beheading by sword, AK-47 or bomb.
Stop.

The only innocent person that exists, according to your worldview is well outside the jurisdiction of swords, AK-47s, and bombs.

Any statement to the contrary is not supported by a consistent Biblical worldview.

I find your concern for your fellow human being admirable, but would wish that you acknowledge when you are drawing from secular ethics.
The comparison really is to Islamic intolerance that is eerily similar to secularism. Neither wants Christians to speak.
No, I would rather that Christians speak. The more they speak, and the more we learn, the more they discredit themselves.

Religion is inherently self-destructive when granted a significant measure of power. A quick look through Europe's history books as well as an examination of the Middle East today would confirm that.

Separation of Church and State is the main reason why the US is not as secular as Europe. Remove it, and after a few rounds of various religious groups using state power to crush various other religious groups, the notion of a religious government would quickly be seen as absurd.

I would be fine with that course of events. I would, however, prefer to be on the opposite side of a large body of water when it starts.
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Post #27

Post by ENIGMA »

Does this mean that if I torch a few buildings in response to something Pat Robertson said on the 700 Club, I get to send him the bill for the damage?
No, but if Pat says something which incites you and other secularists to riot, the newspaper or tv broadcasting corp which he said it on should be held liable for the damages you and your fellow secularist reactionaries cause to the public at large.
Sweet. Time to get some friends and lock n' load.. :roll:
Well that's reassuring considering that Christians take it as a matter of faith that none are innocent. :roll:
That's right. Especially those who slaughter and commit abortion of the unborn children of Christian, Jewish and Muslim babies.
No, everyone. Including all of those unborn children that you are so fond of.

Original sin.. only religion could come up with that one.
Gilt and Vetinari shared a look. It said: While I loathe you and all of your personal philosophy to a depth unplummable by any line, I will credit you at least with not being Crispin Horsefry [The big loud idiot in the room].

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Post #28

Post by jcrawford »

ENIGMA wrote:Original sin.. only religion could come up with that one.
Only atheistic humanists could come up with the idea of no sin at all, and only secular politicians can legislate sinful policies and corrupt social programs without being publically held accountable for their sins.

That's why God raises up Islamic armies - to chastize and punish nations who allow women and medical doctors to kill the children of Christian, Jewish and Muslim fathers with neither their knowledge nor consent.

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Post #29

Post by juliod »

That's why God raises up Islamic armies
So you're agreeing with Osama that god is on the side of the terrorists?

I find that shocking. And yet another reason to be glad of my atheism.

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Post #30

Post by 1John2_26 »

jccrawford wrote:
Muslims and seccy socialists in cahoots against Christians? What's a Christian to do else side with the Jew as if Muslims and seccies don't hate them too?
Though Christians send millions of dollars to Israel yearly, missionary proselytizing is illegal in Israel. But Christians and Jews today have a good relationship. And according to the "Noble Qur'an," always have been: "Friends of each other."

The hatred of the secularist/humanist towards Christians is well documented but here is some Islamic info:

ISLAM VERSUS THE WORLD Moslems divide the world into two irreconcilable
camps, the first is "dar al-Islam", or "house of Islam", which includes
all countries where Islam currently prevails, and the second is "dar
al-harb", or "house of war", which includes everywhere else. The object
of Islam and its followers is to expand their faith (and power) until
the whole world is within their realm. It is a global vision, similar
to that used in the last century by Communism, but much more powerful,
being a religion as well as a political ideology.

THE HOLY WAR The vehicle for Islamic expansion is the concept of
"jihad" or "holy war". In translation, they misrepresent "jihad" as
"struggle" and sometimes "self defense". In reality, the Koran
instructs that "jihad" is a "sacred duty", incumbent on "every Moslem".
There is also a schedule of rewards for those who "dispose of" infidels
(which include any non-Moslem, Christians, Jews, Hindus and others).
The same rewards are bestowed also upon all those who die while
participating in holy-war campaigns. As the Yussuf Ali English
translation of the Koran states: "Allah hath conferred on those who
fight [for him] with their wealth and their lives a rank above those
who tarry."
We all know ell the fate of a jewish person in the hands of a muslim Jihad warrior, but Christians have it bad as well at the hands of the Muslim that practices "Islam, the religion of peace."

And this is an older story.
Christians in Islamic Countries Being Targeted & Persecuted
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Weekend News Today
Lead: faith
Source: NewsMax.com
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Wed Oct 17,2001 -- The situation of Christians has deteriorated rapidly in many Islamic countries since the terrorist attacks on the U.S. and the subsequent U.S.-British raids on Afghanistan, according to Paul Marshall, a senior fellow at the Center for Religious Freedom. A prominent U.S. imam Monday publicly assailed as un-Islamic the persecution of Christians in Muslim countries ranging from Indonesia to Nigeria. "The Koran enjoins Muslims to treat everybody with dignity and compassion," claimed Muzzamil Siddiqi, director of the Islamic Society of Orange County, Calif., when asked about the rapid rise in murder threats, violence, forced conversions, incarceration and discrimination some Christians are being subjected to. Diane Knippers, president of the Institute on Religion and Democracy, praised Siddiqi's remarks as a wonderful statement. "We need more of this. We need Muslim groups in the U.S. to raise their voices on behalf of Christians in predominantly Muslim areas." Knip pers pointed out that "U.S. churches were quick to speak up on behalf of Moslems in our society. They rightly encouraged all America to treat them with respect.
But, at the same time the churches should speak up when Christians in Muslim areas are in jeopardy." The National Council of Churches' news service also condemned the persecution of Christians Monday. Marshall, an internationally recognized authority on religious rights, said Christians were in peril in a long belt of Muslim nations stretching from the eastern parts of Indonesia all the way to West Africa.

In an interview with United Press International, Marshall drew a grim picture for Christians, country by country:

Indonesia: In the eastern islands of this largest Muslim nation in the world, white-uniformed militiamen of Laskar Jihad are forcibly converting Christians to Islam. Marshall said this caused considerable embarrassment to the government, which did not condone such actions. This campaign has so far cost the lives of 5,000 to 6,000 people, the British-born scholar related. "There are links between Laskar Jihad and top terrorist Osama bin Laden," he said.

Bangladesh: Small radical groups supporting Osama bin Laden have bombed or burned down churches.

Pakistan: Christians depend on the protection of the government as several Muslim leaders have issued fatwas (religious decrees) to kill 2 Pakistani Christians for every Afghan Muslim who dies in the Anglo-American air raids. There have also been attacks on Christians along the Afghan border, Marshall told UPI.

Egypt: The government discriminates against Christianity by financing the construction of mosques, while denying permits for the reconstruction of Christian sanctuaries, according to Marshall.

Saudi-Arabia: In the last 2 months, 15 Christian expatriates have been jailed for worshiping in private homes, and three have been tortured, according to the religious rights organization International Christian Concern. An information officer at the Saudi embassy in Washington, who declined to give his name, denied this Tuesday: "As far as we know this is not true. We are not aware of any in jail at this time," he said. But, no religion other than Islam is allowed in the kingdom, and there is no church. When asked about this, Abdullah M. Khouj, rector of the Islamic Center in Washington, replied, "This is a matter to be negotiated between governments."

Sudan: Some 2 million people, chiefly Christians, have been killed in a civil war fought by the radical Islamic regime in the north of the country against non-Arab population in the south, according to several sources including Marshall and Diane Knippers' Institute on Religion and Democracy. For several years now, international religious rights organizations have been reporting what is going on: that Christians are being raped, tortured to death and crucified.

Somalia: Anybody found out to be a Christian will quickly be beheaded by Muslim vigilantes, Marshall said.

Nigeria: In 12 states, versions of Shari'a law, the Islamic penal code, have been imposed - in violation of the constitution of that African federal republic. After the imposition of Islamic law, riots ensued killing 5,000 in the city of Kaduna alone, said Marshall. Other reports put the death toll at around 1,000.

In other Muslim countries: (such as Algeria, etc.) Islamic radicals opposed to the government are killing other Muslims, primarily women and children although they have also murdered priests, nuns and even a bishop, Marshall explained. Others, such as the once-tolerant, formerly republican African nation of Mauritania are now taking tougher measures against Christians, Marshall continued. "If you arrive with a Bible, they'll take it off you. And it's illegal to preach Christianity to the locals."
And becoming a Christian in many Muslim countries such as Saudi Arabia, Iran or Afghanistan can mean that one loses one's job, one's ability to be educated, one's family, and even one's life, Wendy Norvell of the Southern Baptist Convention's International Mission Board told UPI.

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